D
dipper
Guest
Wisc can I have a link to the entire document
B
bat man
Guest
Have been patiently waiting for your process to come to fruition, but we had to try something, anything for change. The toilet keeps running over here.
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
You posted it dipper! go to your post #143 and click the link, "Deer Trustee Rule - Public Input Form" when that survey pops up read down through the bottom paragraph and click the link "health.wisconsin.gov" and a .pdf document will open. That is the full document. Hope that makes sense. Let me know if you don't get it to open.
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
It appears to be filling up with bu!!$hit here as well, and I don't know if the plunger will be large enough to clear the clog!
D
dipper
Guest
Ok I read it closely now, it appears the dnr is trying to dangle a Twinkie in front of the December doe hunt, to get people to bite.
Anything that encourages more bucks harvested is negative imo.
Anything that encourages more bucks harvested is negative imo.
Tree Spud
5 year old buck +
I just completed the survey. No to any increases in buck hunting, yes to additional doe hunts in farmland zones.
Without a mechanism to require hunters to shot a doe, many won't.
Not sure how adding buck harvest to Dec holiday hunt will help, hunters already have mid September to mid December to harvest deer. It would most likely just mean more bucks harvested with little impact on doe harvest.
Without a mechanism to require hunters to shot a doe, many won't.
Not sure how adding buck harvest to Dec holiday hunt will help, hunters already have mid September to mid December to harvest deer. It would most likely just mean more bucks harvested with little impact on doe harvest.
D
dipper
Guest
It's gonna get more people out. There are a lot of hunters just itching to kill da buck hay. The aprs will save some, but more bucks will be shot.
shawnv
5 year old buck +
I sure hope we don't turn into MN or IL with their issues. Aren't we supposed to have access now to the local biologists? Maybe we can write a few and see if any dare come here for discussion/debate. I think large organized meetings and surveys have their purpose but that is like scouting from google earth without putting boots on the ground. They might get a better gauge of what is going on out in the woods talking to us in smaller groups.
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
I have had a couple brief discussions with the Deer bio guys from both Juneau Co. and LaCrosse Co. They seem nice enough, but I think it's just a face they put on for the public. I personally believe they all think were just dumba$$e$ and should just let them run things because they are kollige edumacted. It seems like many of them manage as they see fit, and there is no rhyme or reason that they do the things they do or say. By some of the things they say, it doesn't even seem like they are on the same page on certain things? I suppose that depends on where you got your degree and who your professors were to some extent, but don't they all have the same basic info in their textbooks? We could(and I have) talk, but will they listen?
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
Sorry Spud, but I will totally disagree with this statement. Recent kill data shows that WI hunters have traditionally killed an average 1.2 antlerless per buck statewide across all seasons. What would make you think that would change just because the DNR also allows bucks to be killed during a traditionally "antlerless-only" season. Do you think the average WI hunter will refuse to shoot a doe if he's sitting out in the snow and cold if it is the only deer that presents itself? No way! They are dropping the hammer, horns or not. They are not going to sit out there getting hypothermia and frostbite for nothing. The ability/opportunity for them to harvest a buck is nothing more than bait on a hook to get them in the woods. Those December hunts are a bust because no one wants to get out in the woods and have Mr. Big step out of the thicket, only to have to let him walk. The does will be killed at the same 1.2 to 1 ratio as all the other seasons, it may even go up a bit, because guys will get sick of freezing and want to kill something so they can get back to the house to have some warm chili and a cocktail.
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Tree Spud
5 year old buck +
Whip ... it's not because they are college educated, it's because they are Government. The arrogance of Gov't knows no bounds.
When you make the rules, not responsible for plan vs results, and not accountable to your customers ... you'd be a water walker too!
Steve Bartylla
5 year old buck +
Don't get me wrong. I'm NOT a huge IL DNR supporter by any stretch, but by far the biggest issue in at least the area of IL I'm in (I manage 1 property, advise on another a couple counties away and have close ties to properties in 2 other counties, all ranging from flat out huge to average sized pieces of ground) isn't caused by mismanagement. It's that EHD and Blue Tongue laid waste to a very high % of the deer population. On the ground I'm actively managing, right around 70% of the deer died for EHD or BT last year, with about 10-15% dying the two years before. IMO, it sounds great to rip the IL DNR, and, IMHO they have been too slow to react and still haven't reacted as much as I believe they should, but there is nothing you can do to from their end to stop that, and I'm not convinced that there is anything anyone can do to even help. In those areas I'm very familiar with, the deer numbers were beyond ridiculously high. So much so that they're actually closer to a healthy level now than before the back to back to back disease die off. Before that happened, I actually found winter kills in WC IL each spring....WINTER KILLS in WC IL!!!!!!!!! That should never happen and screams huge overpopulation issues. I mean, they get 6" of snow and the world almost stops, No worries, though. 9 times out of 10, the snow is completely gone in under 2 weeks. All winter long, deer are able to and do feed on clover plots, not to mention acorns and crop waste in any unplowed farm fields. The management buck I killed down there a few days ago was feeding on clover before he entered the standing bean plot, just like most of the other 30 some deer I saw on that sit did. My assistant saw around 30 some deer just a quarter mile away that same afternoon, sitting on straight clover. How many deer you going to see sitting on clover in WI, MN or MI in Jan?!
I get the frustrations in IL. That said, at least in the pretty big area I'm familiar with, it's disease, NOT the DNR/uncontrolled harvest that caused the problem (though I completely agree that the doe tags/harvest should have been scaled back as a response), and all of N WI and most of MN would kill to be in 1/8th as good of shape as that area of IL is in.
Winter kill in WC IL. If that doesn't show how out of control, high the deer numbers were in that area, I don't know what possibly could....those deer don't even have a clue what winter is.
I get the frustrations in IL. That said, at least in the pretty big area I'm familiar with, it's disease, NOT the DNR/uncontrolled harvest that caused the problem (though I completely agree that the doe tags/harvest should have been scaled back as a response), and all of N WI and most of MN would kill to be in 1/8th as good of shape as that area of IL is in.
Winter kill in WC IL. If that doesn't show how out of control, high the deer numbers were in that area, I don't know what possibly could....those deer don't even have a clue what winter is.
D
dipper
Guest
That's why you should enroll in dmap. I talk with my local biologist multiple times a year. I've met her a couple times and she is actually kind of cute in a granola way. Anyway, she gets what is happening out there. The dnr realizes they need massive amounts of tags due to my management scenario. Unfortunately guys like my neighbors who refuse to shoot does throw the entire system out of whack. The dnr manages over a large area, populations fluctuate over these large areas for a variety of reasons. The dnr wages on under populated areas to draw deer from overpopulated areas. Most importantly the dnr wants the deer dead!!!!
It's a loose loose for the dnr. When hunters clueless as to why they are bipolar. If you don't think hunters are bipolar as a whole, really listen to yourselves.
D
dipper
Guest
Hey buddy, I don't share everything with you guys :p
If you can't beat them join them. If you guys want to shoot more deer become a farmer;)
D
dipper
Guest
Everyone knows my neighborhood is loaded with deer. That's why I got it locked down tighter than a freshman at the prom.
The neighbors aren't fond of my management, but I tell them too shoot does. Damn ammo is expensive, but it is so fun.
Nofo I'm sure that guy is itching to let you tell him how to do his job. :D
shawnv
5 year old buck +
I have equated the DMAP with the need for more deer tags and that is not the case in my area. We have a nice co-op that started this year and we'll see how that goes. I would still like have discussions with the biologists.
D
dipper
Guest
Than that is your chance to show them there isn't any deer. If everyone with low deer #s had a biologist at ground zero, with all the evidence in front of them, what would could they say? You have too many deer? There would be no excuses!
Imo dmaps are your chance to prove low deer #s. If the dnr gives you the finger after that, than they deserve the riots and protesting. Until than, it is nothing but bitching.
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