Are the glory days of deer hunting coming to a close?
- Thread starter Howboutthemdawgs
- Start date
I like your cover a lot better than ours. We have timber and clearcuts in various stages of regrowth. The picture below is an area where I belonged to a lease for a number of years. The patchwork is everything from one year old clearcuts to 75 yr old timber. A lot of this, you can not see 25 ft in front of you. This is an area about 8 miles wide and 20 miles long - and is very typical of southern AR. Deer dogging is a popular hunting method because of the miles of thick cover. While it is nowhere near as visually pleasing as Native’s cover - it is just as effective at hiding deer
Native Hunter
5 year old buck +
I wish we had more of your type of cover, because that is what it takes to get age on them. My type of cover helps with nutrition and drawing them in during the rut. Truth is that we need both of these cover types. You could replicate my type of cover with enough work, but I can't replicate yours.
SD51555
5 year old buck +
BenAllgood
5 year old buck +
I drive 10.5 hours to own ground in your landscape area. The cover in these commercial pine plantations down here is not conducive to big bucks unless managed completely different than is done now. I'd take the Midwest over any other landscape.
Native Hunter
5 year old buck +
Yes, I do. In about a 5 acre area it dominates - especially if I occasionally kill the competition early before it germinates each year. I estimate in that spot the picture was taken the JW is over 7 feet tall. That is flat land, so no optical illusions.You have big block jewelweed.
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I know they are speaking in generalities, but our deer peak in score at age 4 or 5 for the most part, typically, at 6 or 7 - they are going down hill. But, not always
I dont think these piney woods are great habitat - meaning I dont think they do much to add quality to a buck. But, what they do, up here at least, is help to add age based strictly on acreage of cover. I know some guys with a very south AR piney woods deer lease who feed a lot of protein. They have a goal of harvesting a 200” buck within the next five years. It wouldnt shock me if they do it. They have come surprisingly close already. They have the age, not so sure about genetics, but definitely lack nutrition. But you can cure nutrition.
Same with my place - we have quite a few five year old bucks - primarily due to quantity of cover. Problem is - our average 5 yr old buck scores 115.. It takes a large amount of 5 yr old bucks to produce a single 140” deer.
On average, what percentage of 5 yr old bucks in KY or IA would score 140”. Sounds like KY needs our density of 5 yr old bucks and we need their nutrition and genetics
I think they do get rid of it.
BenAllgood
5 year old buck +
Yep. Nutrition is the lacking component for expressing the genetic potential. A few generations of satisfying nutritional requirements shows what that area can produce. Age shows the top end of what a buck is capable of producing given the nutritional plane they are living on.I dont think these piney woods are great habitat - meaning I dont think they do much to add quality to a buck. But, what they do, up here at least, is help to add age based strictly on acreage of cover. I know some guys with a very south AR piney woods deer lease who feed a lot of protein. They have a goal of harvesting a 200” buck within the next five years. It wouldnt shock me if they do it. They have come surprisingly close already. They have the age, not so sure about genetics, but definitely lack nutrition. But you can cure nutrition.
Same with my place - we have quite a few five year old bucks - primarily due to quantity of cover. Problem is - our average 5 yr old buck scores 115.. It takes a large amount of 5 yr old bucks to produce a single 140” deer.
On average, what percentage of 5 yr old bucks in KY or IA would score 140”. Sounds like KY needs our density of 5 yr old bucks and we need their nutrition and genetics
Deer in KY are much easier to see than what I've experienced in LA. That doesn't help them get the age on. Too much cover handicaps the hunting. There's areas around me in LA where they run dogs so much, it limits the population.
That’s what was different in the glory days. Bucks could go years without encountering a hunter.
My neighbors in SW MS used to dog hunt and I hated it. They switched from hounds to corn feeders and my hunting has never been worse. In 40 years this spot hasn’t hunted so poorly.
In the dog hunting days there were lots fewer hardcore hunters. Top end 3.5 year olds are toast now.
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
3 properties. 700 acre. 9 card pulls. Zero bucks over 125”
just an anecdotal observation
just an anecdotal observation
Brian662
5 year old buck +
My good ones have mostly been vacant since Labor Day, not a big concern. Just means I won't be hunting a deer on a pattern opening weekend.
Lots of things changing in the whitetail woods right now -
Losing velvet
Beans yellowing
Acorns dropping
Hunters starting to spend time in the woods
Just to name a few.
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
No you’re right, just a little depressing. Some of the cameras have been sitting for 2 weeks. I’ve got a couple decent/nice deer in august but the disappearing act is odd. You would think something would walk by in that amount of time if it was there. I think my point is, the lack of mature bucks in most neighborhoods would probably shock people that care about that kind of thing
Brian662
5 year old buck +
I hear ya, I was concerned about losing "summer bucks" this year because we had 3 that were 150"+ and then my brassicas came on like gangbusters this year and all three of those deer were feeding on them. I thought I was in the chips as far as losing any of those bucks due to my food and then haven't seen any of them for 7+ days. Never know with these things. Plenty of 110-135" have been on camera in that time, so hard to say.
That is a great question Swampcat, I have never considered that scenario but it is worth thought sinceI I own land in Western KY. Quick background on my land, I have about 3 to 5 bucks yearly that go 130 to 140 but very few break that mark. I would say one buck every two years would go 150 and maybe one buck every five years would go 160 plus. I could kill a 130 plus buck every year but I don't and I have never killed a 160.. Back to the question, I think 70% could go 140inches at 5 years old but very very few make it to 5 years old and usually the one that makes it was inferior and passed on to make it to 5. With all that said I can't complain, the average buck is slowly getting better in my neighborhood, unfortunately I will die of old age before the average buck is a Booner. Funny thing is if the average buck was a Booner they would increase the entry Booner to be 180.............And so it goes.I dont think these piney woods are great habitat - meaning I dont think they do much to add quality to a buck. But, what they do, up here at least, is help to add age based strictly on acreage of cover. I know some guys with a very south AR piney woods deer lease who feed a lot of protein. They have a goal of harvesting a 200” buck within the next five years. It wouldnt shock me if they do it. They have come surprisingly close already. They have the age, not so sure about genetics, but definitely lack nutrition. But you can cure nutrition.
Same with my place - we have quite a few five year old bucks - primarily due to quantity of cover. Problem is - our average 5 yr old buck scores 115.. It takes a large amount of 5 yr old bucks to produce a single 140” deer.
On average, what percentage of 5 yr old bucks in KY or IA would score 140”. Sounds like KY needs our density of 5 yr old bucks and we need their nutrition and genetics
Hoytvectrix
5 year old buck +
You didn't mention how long those cards were out there. In the last two weeks, every buck on our cams has changed their pattern. Regardless, if inches are that important to you, I say keep moving west and north. 700 acres in Kentucky is probably worth at least 450 in MO. We have a neighbor that kills booners every year with a similar size property.
Seems like Native is in your state and clearly has deer that size or bigger, so I don't think it is just the soil. Maybe it is cover? Or maybe neighbors could all benefit from a pow wow to understand you're all looking for the same thing and willing to pass a few 125"s to get it?
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
1-2 weeks depending on the camera.
In theory my area is phenomenal. Our terrain and habitat is such that we could grow booners every year. My neighbor killed a 211 in 2013. Another a 195 a couple years ago. The region isn’t the problem. The people are. Between bait number one, crossbows, modern muzzleloader and 4 weekends of rifle they aren’t making it. I have high goals admittedly, only because I know what is possible here.
This guy has been regular every night. He is a direct product of allowing to put on age. I’ve had him for the last two years and somehow he’s escaped the gauntlet
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