wisconsinteacher
5 year old buck +
So the 10:1 ratio you see online comparing ag lime vs pellet lime is not correct is what I'm understanding.
Lime?
- Thread starter wisconsinteacher
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Hideaway Acres
Yearling... With promise
I had a similar situation a few years ago on a one acre plot. Soil test said I needed 1 ton of lime, kinda hard to do all at once, it's a remote plot. So instead I've been putting 250-300 lbs of pelletized lime on it every fall. Now 3 or 4 years later everything is looking better. It's a process, I've learned to enjoy it and hey, it's a food plot not an income plot.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
You can see lots of stuff on line. Limestone is primarily calcium carbonate. There are generally impurities in it. The CCE accounts for those impurities and tells you how effective it is compared to calcium carbonate. It does not matter what the form of the lime is. There are a bunch of technical things about how quickly the lime can adjust your pH. It has to do with things like particle size and how fast it dissolves. None of that matters for a food plot.
You will need 10% more lime that is 80% CCE than lime that is 90% CCE. In my area lime is often 90% or better CCE. I presume the 60-69 on your test is the CCE of ag lime available in your area. So, it is not ag lime vs pellet lime in terms of amount. It is the neutralizing capability of the particular lime you buy.
So, if they are saying 2 tons of lime with a 60-69 CCE, and you Pellet lime is a higher CCE you will need less, but not 10x less. If your pellet lime is a very high CCE, I could see reducing the 2 tons to 1 ton perhaps.
But, for food plots, don't sweat it. The crops you are planting like BW and WR will do fine. As the pH changes they will improve. Just apply the lime you can and move on. See how your crops do. Test in a couple years and see if you need more lime. If you already applied 300 lbs of high CCE lime, and you do two more applications of 500 lbs, that is 1500 lbs, almost a ton. You should be in the ball park.
Thanks,
Jack
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I presume from your handle that you are in Wisconsin. Here is a local info sheet on lime in your area that keep things at a high level and does not get into the weeds. https://fyi.extension.wisc.edu/forage/files/2014/01/LimeFAQ-FOF.pdf
Foggy47
5 year old buck +
Man we are throwing around some big words here. I buy Dolomite lime (crushed lime from a quarry) that has a CCEC of 90 or more (cannot remember the numbers). I have sandy soils and this lime seems to wash through the sand more slowly than other lime available to me. The last time I got a 23 ton end dump semi trailer load.....and the driver dumped the load into two locations that had good access for him and me. I applied this lime to all the food plots and trails I had at that time.... (using my EZ Flow shown above).....and likely put down two tons / acre on the better plots. I raised my sandy loam to nearly 7 in many areas....and I was able to really grow some great crops over the years. The last application was about 8 years go....but I have added a little pell lime here and there over time.
I have more food plot areas now (after logging and opening some new ground) and some very weak land. I plan to buy another load and put about 4,000 / acre on the worst land and 2,000 lbs or so on my better lands. I have soil tests.....but I also have a good feel for where the lime needs to go. The last time I bought a 23 ton load.....it was about $700. I cannot begin to buy enough pell lime for that number. What I do this year will last me for 5 years......or possibly much longer now that I am going the regenerative farming role. It's all good. Don't over-think it.
I have more food plot areas now (after logging and opening some new ground) and some very weak land. I plan to buy another load and put about 4,000 / acre on the worst land and 2,000 lbs or so on my better lands. I have soil tests.....but I also have a good feel for where the lime needs to go. The last time I bought a 23 ton load.....it was about $700. I cannot begin to buy enough pell lime for that number. What I do this year will last me for 5 years......or possibly much longer now that I am going the regenerative farming role. It's all good. Don't over-think it.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I have high CCE lime in my area, but not everyone does. Prices are often related more to how far you are from the quarry than the material itself.
Foggy47
5 year old buck +
Yep....much of the cost is the trucking cost.
omicron1792
5 year old buck +
Getting 26 tons delivered on semi dump trailer for 35/ton.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I have a neighbor who is a new farmer. He is a building manager for a large company but wants to become a farmer in retirement. He is still learning. He paid through the nose for a tractor trailer load of lime during the pandemic to apply to a pasture. He has cattle not crops. He ask If I would bring my tractor with the loader over to fill his spreader and I said sure. I headed over with the tractor and then realized he wanted me to fill a broadcast spreader. I told him it wouldn't work, but he wanted to do it anyway. Weil, I only had to fill it once. He quickly realized it would not work with ag lime.
Lime is much less expensive here now than it was during the pandemic when diesel prices were sky high. His lime is still sitting there....
Lime is much less expensive here now than it was during the pandemic when diesel prices were sky high. His lime is still sitting there....
bigboreblr
5 year old buck +
That little Gandy cost me about $300. Bought it as a pelletized mulch spreader from a guy who had a landscaping business. Spent $100 for it, then bought the regular spreader bottom assembly for $200 to make it a regular spreader again.
Regular lime is about 30-40% cheaper than pelletized lime. I may not break even saving money on 2-3 acres of plots, but there's a value to not breathing ll the mess, or wearing if your using a bag spreader. However, 2 years ago I had troubling finding pelletized lime locally.
I wouldnt go 1/2 rye 1/2 brassicas. Mixes do lot better. Since your tilling this year, put that lime in before you till even a few weeks would be better. A lot of farmers by me add lime during the winter. I've always wondered what happend during srping run offs, but likely it gets into the soil before much of any is washed away.
Alot of folks are using min or low till techniques, some don't. I do what I can with what I got, or take advantage of the situation at hand. If I am tilling the soil, I like to use seeds that need to be put into the soil. I generally prefer to use wheat or oats. Oats won't survive past 15 deg nights usually. But, wheat overwinters. You may not have the weed suppression that rye does, but you can always do that next fall too. I noticed the forage feast mix by plotspike to be a nice blend of stuff.
Certain seeds are prefered because they can grow without much if any putting into the ground. IF your tilling ths year, try some stuff out. I've always mixed crops together. Usually a grain or two, clovers, winter peas, and some sort of brassica. Turnips can get hammered bad in some areas, like mine. However, daikon raddish is enjoyed, but not hammered to the point where they might significantly stunt bulb development, or eat it to it's death. IT also helps losen the soil down to 6 inches or so, and deer eat the bulbs well into winter.
Regular lime is about 30-40% cheaper than pelletized lime. I may not break even saving money on 2-3 acres of plots, but there's a value to not breathing ll the mess, or wearing if your using a bag spreader. However, 2 years ago I had troubling finding pelletized lime locally.
I wouldnt go 1/2 rye 1/2 brassicas. Mixes do lot better. Since your tilling this year, put that lime in before you till even a few weeks would be better. A lot of farmers by me add lime during the winter. I've always wondered what happend during srping run offs, but likely it gets into the soil before much of any is washed away.
Alot of folks are using min or low till techniques, some don't. I do what I can with what I got, or take advantage of the situation at hand. If I am tilling the soil, I like to use seeds that need to be put into the soil. I generally prefer to use wheat or oats. Oats won't survive past 15 deg nights usually. But, wheat overwinters. You may not have the weed suppression that rye does, but you can always do that next fall too. I noticed the forage feast mix by plotspike to be a nice blend of stuff.
Certain seeds are prefered because they can grow without much if any putting into the ground. IF your tilling ths year, try some stuff out. I've always mixed crops together. Usually a grain or two, clovers, winter peas, and some sort of brassica. Turnips can get hammered bad in some areas, like mine. However, daikon raddish is enjoyed, but not hammered to the point where they might significantly stunt bulb development, or eat it to it's death. IT also helps losen the soil down to 6 inches or so, and deer eat the bulbs well into winter.
Angus 1895
5 year old buck +
Ain’t there stuff that deer eat that grows in acidic soil?
omicron1792
5 year old buck +
Sure. It’s basically all the rest of the habitat. Food plots are us trying to put in a small oasis that’s different and more fertile than the other 90% of the property.
If trying to just get stuff to grow that normally grows in the area, skip food plots and do forest stand improvement and burn everything.
JMO.
Angus 1895
5 year old buck +
Forage oats, wheat, triticale and rye all tolerate soil pH as low as 5.5 and will thrive when pH levels are closer and just above 6.0. These seeds should be planted at a half-inch deep and fertilized at planting to give them an initial boost. Deer will also begin eating these plants as soon as they sprout.
it also states white clover.
it also states white clover.
SD51555
5 year old buck +
Been a long time since I mentioned this gems. I often think fallow syndrome is misdiagnosed as low pH. Most of my plots are right around 5.9-6.2 and grow mad lush crops, and with fantastic tonnage. Once you get into year 2 of a stay-green program (if that is your angle), your plants develop micro sites around their root tips anyway that govern pH, and your MF will deliver the goods (if the rest is in place).
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
bigboreblr
5 year old buck +
Even with fallow envirnments deer frequent, try the cage method. When doing the cage method, mark about 3 or 4 circles the same as the cage. Take a picture everytime you visit. You'll see what is liked or not in nature.
Seen photos on here of rye growing in moss. I made a nice clover plot out of a moss pile at camp. MY club mates are actually helping me with this plot, they're cutting trees in the spot for firewood. Been throwing lime in the north edge a bit more the past year, hopefully crabapples jive in this spot.
Seen photos on here of rye growing in moss. I made a nice clover plot out of a moss pile at camp. MY club mates are actually helping me with this plot, they're cutting trees in the spot for firewood. Been throwing lime in the north edge a bit more the past year, hopefully crabapples jive in this spot.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Most of what deer eat in my are grows in acidic soil. If you need to use lime to amend your food plots, your deer are mostly eating native foods growing in acidic soil.
omicron1792
5 year old buck +
What 31 tons of dry aglime looks like. Semi dump trailer load.
omicron1792
5 year old buck +
Man. I’m paying a farmer to spread with 4 ton lime buggy. He’s spreading now.
My place is so hilly I just don’t feel safe on those hills with that much weight behind me.
