MO just approved Xbows.

[Bill]

I'm sure some won't like it but I just don't see it as bad thing. I'm all about wanting a well placed shot and for the average guy practicing weekly and paper tuning a bow just doesn't happen. I've paper tuned one bow in my life and I can't even remember when that was.

Now I just have to figure out who makes a good one and the features that will be most important.

Right off the bat I'm thinking limb length? "width" could be an issue in some hunting circumstances.

 

[bwoods11]

At least 20,000 less deer around by the end of the year if you look at other states data.

More seasons, more harvest, more pressure.

 

[buckdeer1]

Yes it's funny how for all these years you couldn't have optics on a bow but when they make cross guns legal you can have a scope.i wouldn't have such an issue if they made them shoot open sites.Butt plate,forearm,safety,next will be the arrow air gun.Yes they make one

 

[JackTerp]

As an avid crossbow hunter, I remember the exact same statements about compounds when they came out. PA and SC both allow crossbows and we have not seen any substantial increase in the number of deer killed. We have seen more people getting involved with hunting through xbows though. I am in favor of anything that brings more people into the outdoors. I don't care what you hunt with as long as it is legal. If you really want to try the best xbow on the market, look at a Skorpyd. They are the fastest, accurate, quietest and well balanced xbow on the market. I do hunt with a compound, and a rifle and a muzzleloader and occasionally with a pistol. They are all great weapons.

http://www.scorpyd.com/crossbows/ventilator/

 

[bueller]

IMO choose a model with a width of 21" or smaller. To me the larger ones feel like they would be very difficult to maneuver in real life hunting conditions 20' up in a tree.

Also I know nothing about them but it seems like the reverse limbs models are quickly increasing in popularity.

 

[Bill]

Sadly, you will find the 2 day/year gun hunting fudds who never zeroed da rifle will now buy an xgun, pull the trigger twice and start flingin bolts well beyond effective range. You will see the pregun stick buck harvest go up. Vertical wheelie guys who couldnt get er done will convert. Dnr wants license sales, rifle dudes want an easier oppurtunity. What % of the 2 day fudds know how to bt a stick hit?

All of that is mat be true. Never thought about it because I'm in a cushion. All my neighboring properties currently have bow hunters who switch to a gun because it's another tag. I won't have many fudds close by.

As for 20K less deer in the state. Well the MDC already has that covered with CWD Zones and a mentality to kill young bucks in those zones.
CWD zones will kill more young bucks than fudds with an Xbow.

I had a realtor to my place and was prepared to sell based on what happened in the neighborhood because of the state pushing killing yearling bucks this season. So far I'm happy with the neighborhood.

As for the future I have a much greater fear of MDC's reaction to CWD then any weapon.


Jack and bueller,
Thanks for the suggestions

 

[QDMWRKS]

MDC will be in a no win situation with the CWD. If they shoot 'em up in CWD zones, those residents will be upset. If they don't, the neighboring residents will be upset when it starts spreading. As far as the crossbow thing, I am just really shocked at how fast it took off in WI.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

It's on fire in Pa. too. They used to call archery and flint-lock seasons " primitive weapons " seasons here. The came in-line muzzle-loaders that shoot well to 200 yds, and now x-bows with scopes and 390 ft. / sec. bolt speeds. I think " primitive " left the building some time ago. The next thing will be " SMART BOLTS " that hit where you're looking. Don't laugh. If it can be sold - it'll be made. The fact that I've seen bagged deer turds for sale in outdoor shops proves my point ........ if it can hold a price sticker, it'll be on the market !!
Laser-guided smart bolts .......... for the " ULTIMATE WOODSMAN " !!!!!:rolleyes:

 

[buckdeer1]

Really the whoile CWD thing is ran by a bunch of guys at the state that don't think anything out.You can't say lets kill every deer in this area and we will stop it.What about the deer that are say within a 2 mile border of that line.Do they not think they go back and forth.It is like most of the regular deer biologist said when this all first started.Let it go and it will be done sooner.It's a natural disease.I watched a show from Texas the other day that showed how their deer still die from anthrax from the old buffalo wallows.I do believe that most states DNR is the biggest threat or should I say the states government that pushes the laws because they don't care about the herds only about the dollar.But yes some areas of Kansas saw a big jump in xguns and yes as more and more people use them you will see less mature bucks.I just think of every buck I might have killed if I didn't have to go through the motion of drawing or could shoot 40 yards while aiming with my variable power scope.

 

[sandbur]

Minnesota will probably be facing more of the crossbow expansion issue. It has been presented to one chapter of the Minnesota Deer Hunters Association and at a regional meeting. Minnesota seems to be on a pattern of steadily increasing opportunities for hunters to kill deer.

it was not long ago that crossbows were approved for hunters over 60.
My personal feeling is that it will eventually pass in Minnesota, but we should go slowly at expanding any seasons with so many areas with low deer numbers.

The resource should always come first.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

No-Fo, I see there are changes being made to the weight of the bolts for x-bows so they penetrate better. I don't own a x-bow, but I read that in an article explaining the downfalls of the lighter bolts. We had a guy in our camp get a complete pass-through on a doe this year. Maybe he had some of the heavier bolts ?? Deer only went about 50 yds.

Was the guy in your group wounding and not finding those deer ??

 

[JackTerp]

My arrows, they are not bolts, weigh in at 425gr each. Neither I, nor anyone in my group has ever lost a deer shot with a xbow. It's the shooter, not the bow. I use a RDT, reverse draw technology, bow. They balance as well as almost any rifle. I use a red dot scope on it and can easily shoot 3" groups at 100 yards but will not shoot a deer beyond 50. I am beginning to sense some real animosity towards xbow hunters in this thread so that is all I am going to say.

 

[dipper]

If I'm understanding u, u are claiming a xbow isn't as accurate as a vertical bow? So more deer are not recovered w a xbow?

 

[chickenlittle]

Some folks have the store bore sight the scope on their new rifle, get a box of shells, and go hunting. Some folks don't practice much with their wheel bows and still hunt with it. The problem is not the weapon.

 

[chickenlittle]

No, far too many xgun users are newbs looking for the easy weapon and dont practice, hence not knowing thier own effective range. Having said that there is no way an xbow could beat a vertical in a 42 target unmarked 3d.

I assume you mean a compound bow with all the modern goodies, right? Not a real bow shot with fingers?

 

[John-W-WI]

One angle that is being missed here (for me personally anyway) is using a Xbow because of a physical issue.

Sadly, I bought a xbow this season because I've been holding on to hope that I would be able to continue shooting my vertical bow. I love my vertical and always will. But because of a shoulder surgery a couple years ago, I simply can NOT shoot it enough to be proficient with my vertical anymore.

In my limited experience, they are much easier to setup and shoot accurately. I almost think there will be less injured deer because of them (except for those that exceed the effective range). If a guy is only going to practice an hour per season, they will be more successful with a xbow.

Bill - I bought a reverse limb bow. They just seem to make a LOT more sense. They are balanced (the weight is on your holding hand, not out in front of it).

I believe this is the model I bought:
http://www.hortoncrossbows.com/shop/horton-storm-rdx/

My biggest complaint is carrying it to and from the stand. It is like hauling a small piano with you compared to my vertical bow. I really miss my vertical :(

-John

 

[JackTerp]

You talk like crossbows are some kind of fancy new technology. The only weapon used for deer hunting today that is more primitive then a crossbow would be a longbow. Even the recurve is a lot more modern than a crossbow. There are recorded incidences of kills being made with a crossbow at over 100 yards in the 1400's. Your bow is a masterpiece of modern technology. As long as you shoot with a release, sights, stabilizers, arrow rest, carbon shafts, plastic vanes, carbon fiber limbs and wheels, you have no room to criticize anyone else.

Yesterday was my 67th birthday. I have been shooting bows since I was 8 years old. Met Fred Bear when I was 10 and have been a bowhunter since I was legally allowed to hunt when I turned 12. I have killed over 300 deer with various weapons in my lifetime. I never owned a rifle until I was in my early 20's. I shot competitive archery until my late 20's. I wish I was physically able to shoot a 3D round with you, as my xbow would eat you alive. I shot barebow hunter class only. Used a recurve shooting fingers, no sights. I routinely shot in the low 300's. I quit competing when I would be the only contestant in my class so they would make me compete against the higher classes. I still won several trophies at that level but got tired of being criticized for my equipment. I attended, but did not compete, in a 3D shoot last year locally. All these "Big Time" shooters with all their fancy equipment. It was fun, but it's not archery as it used to be. But, times change. People don't. People still want instant gratification. I guess I really am getting old. I miss the " Old Days".

 

[Steve Bartylla]

I'll toss another perspective in here. I started trapping at 10 and was long lining from 16 on through college (would actually tell every professor the 1st day of winter quarter that I trapped to pay for school. If I don't trap, can't afford to be here. I'll be in class every day for the 1st 2 weeks and then you will never see me again, not for midterms, finals, nothing. What can I do in these 2 weeks to make up for it? They did backflips for me every year). Mt dream was to be a pro, long line trapper for a living, but the animals rights push killed that, just as I finished college.

Why were they successful in dealing a crippling blow to trapping (no, they didn't end it, but fur prices have never regained the level of my last year in college, and they were already depressed from the movement at that point), but haven't been able to dent hunting? I believe it's because there's a lot more hunters than there were trapping and there's definitely strength in numbers. Unfortunately, our numbers are stagnant or dropping in most areas. For our kids and grandkids to have the same opportunities we do/did, we need hunter numbers. God love the "fuds" and whatever weapon helps make them at least somewhat proficient. Like it or not, I firmly believe that we need every hunter we can get.

 

[tooln]

There coming. Not saying I'm for them but they are out there.

http://www.fxairguns.com/rifle/the-indy-arrow/

http://www.swivelmachine.com/html/rimfire.htm

 

[Bowsnbucks]

As to NoFo's comment about insane land prices and crazy lease rates & the kid down the road can't squirrel hunt because of a lease or sanctuary ....... I remember reading in one of Gene & Barry Wensel's books or written articles that money would be the cancer that kills hunting. How prophetic they were .... and accurate. It's getting so that if you want GOOD hunting, you better be able to afford a big parcel of land so you have it to yourself or be able to pay big $$$$ for a lease of similarly big acreage. Regardless of weapon, hunting access is requiring more and more $$$$$.

Public land here in Pa. for the most part is crappy deer hunting. NoFo's comment on low DPSM in the northern public lands of Wisc. also applies in Pa. Northern counties have WAY LESS deer than they used to. Lower hunter numbers are going to follow crappy deer numbers. Guys aren't going to take off work, lose pay, pay for licenses, tags, ammo & other sundries to see nothing. Plain & simple. My own camp has the same issues. Guys hunt the first day of rifle - see nothing - and go home ticked off. Very little shooting is even heard. Camps around mine close up early and guys go home. What NoFo described is becoming more and more common.

I'm no big fan of crossbows for the sake of " ease ", but I fear the bigger problem we face as hunters is greed ....... from the state agencies for more tag $$$$$$ and from " hunters " who feel they must kill as many deer as possible to satisfy their " manliness quotient ". I know 3 or 4 of those types personally. If it's alive - it needs killed. THAT'S my biggest fear. If we have fewer of those greedy types, states won't be able to sell huge numbers of tags.