TC Encore Pro Hunter 300 Win Mag thoughts

[Telemark]

Do you (or anyone) know of anyone who has done sound intensity measurement at the shooter position of a 300 WM with and without a muzzle break?

It has been a long time since I read about it, but there is plenty of info out there. The conclusion, as I recall, is that without a suppressor, it is likely to cause hearing damage, especially in the left ear.

 

[yoderjac]

It has been a long time since I read about it, but there is plenty of info out there. The conclusion, as I recall, is that without a suppressor, it is likely to cause hearing damage, especially in the left ear.

I haven't found any actual data. There is a lot of talk and characterization but I haven't seen data. There is no doubt it causes hearing damage, especially to the unprotected left ear of a right handed shooter as the blast from pretty much any rifle will. The reason I was looking for data is that I'm trying to figure out how much isolation is needed, regardless if it is done at the muzzle which is expensive or at the ear which is much less expensive.

I've got a buddy with very good hearing. He is a turkey hunter and has the same 10 gauge setup I have. He pops in ear plugs when the turkey gets close. I'm not that talented and can't seem to get away with that much movement. My hearing was damaged when I was young. I'm paying the price now.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Telemark]

Here's a test with a .308:

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/08/07/muzzle-brakes-sound-test/

 

[yoderjac]

Here's a test with a .308:

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/08/07/muzzle-brakes-sound-test/

Thanks! So it looks like about 150 db at the shooter with +5 to 15 db for a break. That is exactly what I needed. Well conducted testing by the way.


Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

I don't think you can go wrong with Leupold scopes.

Yes. I have quite a few of them and I'm happy with them all. Tree Spud mentioned earlier in the thread that I should consider Vortex. He said he had two of them in addition to his Leupold scopes and was impressed with Vortex. I was hoping he would report back with specifics comparing his Leupold scopes to Vortex and what advantage/disadvantages Vortex offers. I will probably wait until after the first of the year to order the scope.

I took a cursory look at them online. I don't see anything in their features that appears to stand out as a fit for me over Leupold. At this point, I don't plan to actually put my hands on one unless I hear there are specific advantages that relate to my use. But I'm open minded. If I hear sound reasons, I'll take the time to look at one in person before i decide.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Tree Spud]

I

Yes. I have quite a few of them and I'm happy with them all. Tree Spud mentioned earlier in the thread that I should consider Vortex. He said he had two of them in addition to his Leupold scopes and was impressed with Vortex. I was hoping he would report back with specifics comparing his Leupold scopes to Vortex and what advantage/disadvantages Vortex offers. I will probably wait until after the first of the year to order the scope.

I took a cursory look at them online. I don't see anything in their features that appears to stand out as a fit for me over Leupold. At this point, I don't plan to actually put my hands on one unless I hear there are specific advantages that relate to my use. But I'm open minded. If I hear sound reasons, I'll take the time to look at one in person before i decide.

Thanks,

Jack

I have the Vortex Viper VMR 1. Have several 15 year Leupold Vari 3X and a 8 year old Nikin with BDC. The big difference has been the glass at low light conditions and very good clarity through thickets shrubs on the Vortex. Been very happy with it.

 

[yoderjac]

I


I have the Vortex Viper VMR 1. Have several 15 year Leupold Vari 3X and a 8 year old Nikin with BDC. The big difference has been the glass at low light conditions and very good clarity through thickets shrubs on the Vortex. Been very happy with it.

Good to know! Looks like it is a glass improvement verses features. I wonder if Leupold glass has improved over that time. It looks like the list prices on your Viper and your Leupold are pretty competitive. I'm looking a litter higher end scopes. I know he Leupold glass pretty well. I think I might find someone that carries Vortex locally and look though the equivalent model to the Leupold I'm looking at and see if the glass is a big improvement.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Well, my Rem 760 Gamemaster .30-06 failed today. I'll be taking it into the gunsmith tomorrow, but who knows how long it will be in there. I don't have a shipping date yet on the barrel. I doubt if it will arrive in time for me to use it this season, but since I've lent out the 12 gauge I previously used before our county allowed rifles, my only option is my muzzleloader. I was going to wait until the barrel arrived to order the scope, but I figured I'd just order it now in case both came in before the season was over. I ended up ordering a Leupold VX-6HD 4-24x52mm. I was hoping to get it with a firedot reticle but they don't have that option for this scope. I ended up getting the T-Mil dot instead.

I'll report back as things come in and I start working with them.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Barrel just shipped. I may be able to take some test shots when it arrives, but without the scope, I can't use it to hunt. Most of the scope accessories (lens covers, rings, base) have shipped, but no word on the scope. I think we are last on the list for sending product.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

New thought and plan! The barrel should be here by mid-week, and the scope accessories should be here by Thursday according to current tracking. I just realized, I'm using a one piece QR base and rings on my scopes. I'm not 100% positive, but I'm guessing the distance between the ring holes on the base is the same, regardless of the firearm the base is drilled for. If that is the case, I should be able to install the base on the new barrel and swing by the gunsmith and pull the scope off my .30-06 and put it on the TC. If that doesn't work, I'm sure I can pull the scope off the muzzleloader since it is the same base.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

I stand corrected. Your 20-30db NRR rated plugs will give a real-world attenuation of 6.5-11.5 decibels IF worn correctly, likely less if altered or worn incorrectly.

https://www.coopersafety.com/earplugs-noise-reduction

Since we previously discussed this, I did some digging looking at NIH sponsored studies and stuff. It looks like we were both looking at wrong standard. NRR is an OSHA thing that is really aimed at long exposure to continuous loud noise. For shooters the right standard appears to be Impulse Peak Insertion Loss (IPIL) rating. This is aimed at very short high impulse sounds like a gun shot. IPIL ratings are not a fixed number. It is typically measured at 132, 150, and 168 db. So the rating might look like IPIL: 37.3/44/42 and the NRR rating might only be 26. IPIL ratings are not yet mandatory on hearing protection, but it is the best standard for hunters to use. So, I'd look for this rating when considering hearing protection and buy something that dose label with an IPIL rating.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

By the way, the barrel arrived today. Looks nice. I'm now waiting for the Leupold base. It is supposed to be here Thursday.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Bad news for me. I unpacked the barrel and tried to install it. I found it was missing the stand-offs that go between the barrel and the forearm. It looks like it is tapped for them but they were not on the barrel. I'm not sure if I ordered the wrong barrel or if the stand-offs were just missing or if they need to be ordered and installed separately. Regardless, it looks like I'm out of luck for this season. I sent an email to the company. Regardless, but the time it is resolved it will be too late for this season.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Telemark]

Since we previously discussed this, I did some digging looking at NIH sponsored studies and stuff. It looks like we were both looking at wrong standard. NRR is an OSHA thing that is really aimed at long exposure to continuous loud noise. For shooters the right standard appears to be Impulse Peak Insertion Loss (IPIL) rating. This is aimed at very short high impulse sounds like a gun shot. IPIL ratings are not a fixed number. It is typically measured at 132, 150, and 168 db. So the rating might look like IPIL: 37.3/44/42 and the NRR rating might only be 26. IPIL ratings are not yet mandatory on hearing protection, but it is the best standard for hunters to use. So, I'd look for this rating when considering hearing protection and buy something that dose label with an IPIL rating.

Thanks,

Jack

That was mentioned in the first article I linked. I've never seen an IPIL rating on hearing protection, so I use plugs and muffs at the range, and a silencer when I hunt. And I avoid indoor ranges, and I won't shoot near people using brakes or short barrels.

And of course I avoid loud bars, clubs, concerts, etc.

 

[yoderjac]

That was mentioned in the first article I linked. I've never seen an IPIL rating on hearing protection, so I use plugs and muffs at the range, and a silencer when I hunt. And I avoid indoor ranges, and I won't shoot near people using brakes or short barrels.

And of course I avoid loud bars, clubs, concerts, etc.

There are a number of hearing protection devices with IPIL ratings but they are all pretty high end. Since it is not yet required for labeling, I presume only companies that have IPIL ratings high enough to be beneficial in their marketing are using them so far.

I think I have found a good path forward. I have a good audiologist that dispensed and programmed my hearing aids. She has a good handle on both the technical aspects of hearing as well as my personal hearing loss. All of the hearing protection I've seen so far that is IPIL rated is a partially in-the-canal design. These require ear molds that are done by an audiologist. I presume this is because the require a tight seal with your ear so as little as possible sound is received directly without going through the device electronics. So, after the first of the year, I plan to make an appointment with her and go from there.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Bad news for me. I unpacked the barrel and tried to install it. I found it was missing the stand-offs that go between the barrel and the forearm. It looks like it is tapped for them but they were not on the barrel. I'm not sure if I ordered the wrong barrel or if the stand-offs were just missing or if they need to be ordered and installed separately. Regardless, it looks like I'm out of luck for this season. I sent an email to the company. Regardless, but the time it is resolved it will be too late for this season.

Thanks,

Jack

Well, I called the company today. As it turns out, a different forearm is required for that barrel which I did not know. So, I ordered that today. They said they will send it priority mail. So, it is possible I'll have something to try out next week.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Telemark]

Sounds good. Best of luck with the new set-up.

 

[yoderjac]

Things seem to be working out. I headed to the farm with my muzzleloader and shot a nice doe yesterday. Just as I finished quartering her and cleaning up, as I was starting to clean my muzzleloader, we lost power at the farm. So, I decided to head back home rather than staying and hunting for the next couple days. I cleaned the muzzlelaod when I got home. My scope base and rings were at the house when I got back.

I checked my email and it looks like the forearm is scheduled for delivery on Monday and the scope on Tuesday. I installed the scope base on the 300 WM barrel. Hopefully, I'll be able to sight it in and hunt with it between Christmas and New Year.

 

[yoderjac]

Well, I got a pleasant surprise today. Not only did the forearm arrive as expected, the Leupold scope arrived a day early. I installed everything tonight:

I am very impressed with the new Leupold scope. The built in leveling function makes installation a breeze. I got an adjustable torque wrench for this kind of work so I was able to tighten everything to the Leupold torque specs. It also has a nice feature that my previous Leupold scopes don't have. It has a motion sensor for the illuminated reticle. After a few minutes of being stationary it turns off to save battery but the minute you move the firearm, it turns itself back on. I did not take off the buttstock flexloader for the muzzleloader. I may buy a buttstock ammo holder for when I use it as a rifle.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Finally got it to the range today. I put about a box and a half through it. I got it sighted in good enough to hunt with tonight (especially since I didn't see anything), but I'm not happy with it yet. I was getting some vertical stringing. I think the barrel got too hot since I was in a hurry. I hope to get it back on the range tomorrow to see what I can do. No real recoil issue from a kick stand point. Another possibility for the vertical stringing could be muzzle jump. If I can't get it under control, I may have a brake added after the season.

Thanks,

Jack