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Baiting, I know this has been discussed and discussed this is just my rant....LOL

Then why is everyone doing it?

Its ubiquity is the best gauge of its effectiveness.
Who knows. They see pictures of deer and think they'll get lucky. People keep using lots of things that they feel helps them, but actually doesn't. One of the studies in North Carolina showed how not baiting was more effective than hunting over bait. Several studies document that. But, people will still hunt over it to their own detriment. Deer can be conditioned to not use certain parts of their habitat at certain times. Even food plots and ag fields are one of those places that they can be conditioned to avoid. Now, if deer aren't as conditioned to avoid places, they will use them alot more during the day. That can be a bait site. Or, it could be a yard, food plot, field, etc.
 
There’s a guy on social media I’ve seen killing bucks with a spear. Bait pile at the base of his tree. Multiple kills every fall. It freaking WORKS!
There's a guy on social media I've seen killing bucks with a bow. Food plot at the base of his tree. Multiple kills every fall. It freaking WORKS! Just joking with you, but they do work. I've seen more bucks killed over food plots than bait sites.
 
There's a guy on social media I've seen killing bucks with a bow. Food plot at the base of his tree. Multiple kills every fall. It freaking WORKS! Just joking with you, but they do work. I've seen more bucks killed over food plots than bait sites.
Now do spears.
 
Many hunters falsely believe in absolutes. Brassicas attract deer on my land, so they work everywhere kind of thing. Deer management and deer hunting wouldnt be as fun if deer always did the same thing everywhere. In my experience, Ben is correct - mature bucks can be very difficult to kill, hunting over a bait pile - on my property. I have right around fifty hunts over the last four years for my same target buck - and have yet to catch a glimpse of him - but have gotten hundreds of pictures of him and he has eaten hundreds of pounds of bait. We have also not seen him in a food plot - where we kill about 75% of our mature bucks.

Dawgs is also correct, mature bucks are not that difficult over bait - on my neighbor’s 1100 acres. My buddy has killed three 140+ inch bucks, in three years - over bait- with a compound bow, hunting less than five days each year.

I usually have around five mature bucks - regularly on my place - each year. I have fourteen adjacent landowners - all who allow hunting on their land - with baiting used on all but one of those lands. They all kill multiple deer each year if they choose to - many of those deer over bait. Most of them do not kill a mature deer.

Oddly enough, the first year I set out to kill a truly big deer over bait - with a crossbow nonetheless - I killed my biggest deer ever - on the first evening I hunted him. In addition, I killed a bear with my compound five days before the deer - on a bait barrel I was running on my lease. That was my week, evidently.

I knew better than to think the bear kill came easy - I had been baiting bears for six years - and that is work with no guarantees. I was inexperienced with hunting a mature buck over bait - and my quick success made me think I had it figured out. I am still waiting to kill my second mature buck over bait - six years later.

In fact, I have only killed one deer since then - by choice. I had purchased a .350 legend rifle for my grand daughters to use in our new straight wall cartridge season - early modern gun season I call it. They failed to kill a deer with it. About halfway through modern gun season, I decided I would hunt with that new rifle - and went to some nearby public land, sat on the ground in a strutter chair near a patch of overcup oaks, and killed a decent mature buck in two hours.

Hunting those oak trees was a lot easier than hunting a bait pile. At least that is how some people think about hunting - because that is how it happened once - it must be like that everywhere, every-time. But, I have spent enough time hunting deer around oak trees on public land to know better. I have probably killed 75 deer - or more - with a compound or recurve doing that - and it is far from easy.

If I had to kill a deer - any deer - I would go to a bait pile. If I had to kill a mature buck from mid oct to the end of Feb, I would go to a food plot. That is on my land - and that may be true no where else on earth - and I would not claim it to be based solely off my experience - like some might claim things based off their experience.

In my area, I would not agree that baiting increases deer density. Maybe on a specific property - but not in general. Our G&F permits baiting in an effort to help reach harvest goals - not to increase deer density. I would agree that supplemental feeding in spring and summer does increase deer density in my area.
 
Food plots can enter the baiting debate when people are commonly spreading triple cleaned corn or rice bran over acres at a time. Until that is a common practice, they shouldn’t be in the same discussion.

It’s a shame this is even a topic of interest on the HABITAT forum.
 
Food plots can enter the baiting debate when people are commonly spreading triple cleaned corn or rice bran over acres at a time. Until that is a common practice, they shouldn’t be in the same discussion.

It’s a shame this is even a topic of interest on the HABITAT forum.
Lots of people use food plots as bait. I'd say a majority of people using them, use them as bait. If someone is against unnaturally attracting deer to an area, then they should only be working on native food instead of introducing non-native foods.
 
My buddy has killed three 140+ inch bucks, in three years - over bait- with a compound bow, hunting less than five days each year.

Oddly enough, the first year I set out to kill a truly big deer over bait - with a crossbow nonetheless - I killed my biggest deer ever - on the first evening I hunted him. In addition, I killed a bear with my compound five days before the deer - on a bait barrel I was running on my lease. That was my week, evidently.
I appreciate this post; this may the best representation of the real conundrum. But you aren’t exactly toeing the party line. 😉
 
I’m gonna wade into this gently…when a non hunter asks me why I bait with my trees and and clover and turnips and WR that I plant only for wildlife..my answer is always because it is fun to see things grow and that it helps that wildlife year round…then I inform them I don’t consider it baiting as yes it is to draw wildlife into range of my chosen weapon but it is not baiting as that food is available year round and it’s not just a bag of corn or whatever slung out there at the beginning of the hunt..actual time, money, physical effort, planning research and sweat equity are all involved (yes you could say that about year round baiting at times also..) I spend 10X more time planning out plot configurations and what seed a to plant when and tree and stand locations than I do actually physically working and it is a joy for me to do so… just wish in my no bait-allowed state that the rules would be enforced…
 
Lots of people use food plots as bait. I'd say a majority of people using them, use them as bait. If someone is against unnaturally attracting deer to an area, then they should only be working on native food instead of introducing non-native foods.

I consider my food plots bait - wheat and apple trees are not native to my area. We have killed far more deer out of food plots than over bagged bait.
 
I’m gonna wade into this gently…when a non hunter asks me why I bait with my trees and and clover and turnips and WR that I plant only for wildlife..my answer is always because it is fun to see things grow and that it helps that wildlife year round…then I inform them I don’t consider it baiting as yes it is to draw wildlife into range of my chosen weapon but it is not baiting as that food is available year round and it’s not just a bag of corn or whatever slung out there at the beginning of the hunt..actual time, money, physical effort, planning research and sweat equity are all involved (yes you could say that about year round baiting at times also..) just wish in my no bait-allowed state that the rules would be enforced…
Wade comfortably and confidently. There is sufficient research to support the difference between food plots and bait piles, as it pertains to unnatural deer-deer interaction.

With that said… I’d gladly give up my sad food plots to rid this region of the scourge that is baiting.
 
I consider my food plots bait - wheat and apple trees are not native to my area. We have killed far more deer out of food plots than over bagged bait.
To me there is quite a difference..look at what someone who has no connection to the outdoors would think (not that I usually care what said people think)..but if you said yeah I dumped out some corn and shot this deer over it two hours later OR I worked this land and planned out where my fields should go and what I should put in them and when should I plant it and what trees should go where to drop their fruit at the best time..which would draw a more positive reaction? I get it that I’m romanticizing it a bit but we do at some point have to start looking outside our echo chambers and work to gain favor with the average (think George Carlin) person…and I am in no way denigrating baiting..my brother was lucky enough to marry into an Oklahoma family with several leases and they shoot great bucks near their year round feeders…they spend way more money a year in corn than I do on seeds and trees and their deer are huge and totally unpredictable…
 
With that said… I’d gladly give up my sad food plots to rid this region of the scourge that is baiting.
I would gladly welcome this if it was illegal to hunt on any planted or poured food.
 
Wade comfortably and confidently. There is sufficient research to support the difference between food plots and bait piles, as it pertains to unnatural deer-deer interaction.

With that said… I’d gladly give up my sad food plots to rid this region of the scourge that is baiting.

I am just the opposite - I would give up deer hunting before food plotting. I spend far more time planting and maintaining food plots, watching them grow, looking at game cam pics from my food plots, etc - than I do hunting. To be honest, I have pretty much quit deer hunting already. I could shoot a deer pretty much any time I hunt a food plot on my property and have chose not to do so in at least eight years. I probably fall under the category of wildlife observer more than deer hunter. “Deer season” just gives me an excuse to go👍🏻
 
I would gladly welcome this if it was illegal to hunt on any planted or poured food.
You think they’re equivalent in terms of disease transmission risk?

ETA: I get the ethics debate… not interested in that.
 
I believe it. Last year I put out a block of some cheap deer feed, and it was mostly still there in the Spring. The deer didn't seem to want it. I think a lot of deer bait is full of junk we don't want deer to eat. This winter I gave them corn, soybeans, molasses, and goat mineral. I did sprinkle in maybe two pounds of Acorn Rage that I found leftover in the garage. If I feed them again next winter, it will be corn and soybeans, since that's what they eat off the nearby ag fields. They should be able to get minerals from the mineral site near the food plot.

It makes sense when you back into the math. A bag of sweet feed 16% is $11/bag. When you figure a retailer needs about 40% to keep the lights on, we’re down to $7/bag. Then throw in $1 to bag it, $1 to ship it. We’re down to $5, and we still have to Pelletize it and move the raw materials to the factory.

The retailers can’t figure out how to get corn under $10/bag, so what could it really be made of other than bi-products?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
You think they’re equivalent in terms of disease transmission risk?

ETA: I get the ethics debate… not interested in that.
No, well, usually not. I've already stated I believe baiting can raise risks for disease transmission. But, I have seen and planted food plots that were browsed to a level (good use for exclusion cages) that were also a risk vector for disease transmission. I've also seen plenty of areas under some hot oaks that looked like a well used bait pile.
 
I am just the opposite - I would give up deer hunting before food plotting. I spend far more time planting and maintaining food plots, watching them grow, looking at game cam pics from my food plots, etc - than I do hunting. To be honest, I have pretty much quit deer hunting already. I could shoot a deer pretty much any time I hunt a food plot on my property and have chose not to do so in at least eight years. I probably fall under the category of wildlife observer more than deer hunter. “Deer season” just gives me an excuse to go👍🏻
I’m in your same category..couple years ago on the first day of archery here in PA I sat over our biggest plot just to see what would come out…and boy did they come out..had almost 30 deer in the plot at one time and I never even touched my bow..took some great video and watched what part of the plot they went to the most..I know my Dad and my brother and his kids will put some on the ground so I know I have no fear of going hungry…
 
No, well, usually not. I've already stated I believe baiting can raise risks for disease transmission. But, I have seen and planted food plots that were browsed to a level (good use for exclusion cages) that were also a risk vector for disease transmission. I've also seen plenty of areas under some hot oaks that looked like a well used bait pile.
The data is out there if you’re really interested. I cant read this and understand how you’d defend baiting on the habitat forum. If hot oaks were a disease concern this forum wouldn’t exist.

@Bill, I’m doing my best to boost traffic. I expect a check in 30 days.
 
The data is out there if you’re really interested. I cant read this and understand how you’d defend baiting on the habitat forum. If hot oaks were a concern this forum wouldn’t exist.

@Bill, I’m doing my best to boost traffic. I expect a check in 30 days.
we are still in the infancy of a debate here

 
To me there is quite a difference..look at what someone who has no connection to the outdoors would think (not that I usually care what said people think)..but if you said yeah I dumped out some corn and shot this deer over it two hours later OR I worked this land and planned out where my fields should go and what I should put in them and when should I plant it and what trees should go where to drop their fruit at the best time..which would draw a more positive reaction? I get it that I’m romanticizing it a bit but we do at some point have to start looking outside our echo chambers and work to gain favor with the average (think George Carlin) person…and I am in no way denigrating baiting..my brother was lucky enough to marry into an Oklahoma family with several leases and they shoot great bucks near their year round feeders…they spend way more money a year in corn than I do on seeds and trees and their deer are huge and totally unpredictable…

I do a fair little bit of native plant management - especially for ducks but quite a bit for deer. I spray it, mow it, disk it, etc and have even planted some native plants. I dont consider these areas food plots, and wildlife uses most of that ground very well. I consider my food plots and orchard non native plantings - same as baiting to me. Providing non native food for the wildlife to eat.

But, I feel hunting a food plot or my orchard more ethical than baiting with corn or dumping a basket of pears on the ground - in my mind, my labor makes the difference.

My “baiting” program is fairly intensive also. While I have three spin feeders, I also have six more locations where I protein feed - pouring the feed on the ground every few days. My program is much more effective than any of my neighbors - who only provide bait/feed during deer season. I believe my feeding starting four months before season is the main reason I have been successful holding deer on my property for more time. My deer weights have also increased greatly. I know folks who put a few feeders out, fill them with feed a couple times a month, and call it good. That is barely a start for me. While there is a differentiation between supplemental feeding and baiting, I believe supplemental feeding greatly improves the effectiveness of baiting. If hunting was illegal within 200 yards of a location providing bagged food - I would still do it for the purpose of trying to keep deer off my neighbor’s property more hours of the day - and the benefits to wildlife the feeding provides.
 
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