Another Hunting Pressure conundrum...

[roymunson]

I'm blessed to hunt some fantastic ground in Knox County Ohio. It's my favorite place on earth, even without the deer hunting.
I have good folks for neighbors, although we don't share the same goals in the woods and I'm trying to figure out if I'm becoming one of those grouchy old selfish men, or if I'm justified.

I preface all of this by saying, I don't think anyone's breaking the law. So the bottom line is there's nothing to worry about from a legal standpoint.

My buddy and I combine to own about 350 acres. We manage it and try to take 5 year olds off of it.

We have about 5 people that hunt it fairly regularly.

The other day I counted how many people will be in the woods on our property and on property adjoining ours and the number was over 30. 1 neighbor has killed 5 of their 6 bucks already and, although they know they have 2 boone and crockett deer running around, the largest one was a 132" 8 point. There are teen hunters involved there, so I offer some grace there.

So far on our property and the adjoining properties this year 11 bucks have been killed that I know of. 2 were 4 years old and older. the others were the "up and comers" that we'd passed multiple times on our place that scored 125-135" as 3 year olds.

I know no one is breaking the law. But the guy going 5 for 6 before firearms season is feeding deer by the ton. Literally. Last October he told me he was over 14 tons already by mid october.

We feed some, but I'd quit if everyone else did. I feel Ohio's doing a disservice to the next generation of hunter who doesn't know how to find a funnel or a pinch point. I Don't want to kill deer strictly over corn or feed. But he who has the largest yellow pile, gets the deer.

I completely understand climbing that ladder of bigger and more mature bucks. but when you've shot 130" deer 5 straight years, and your ground has the potential to create 150+, don't you at some point get tired of that younger buck? I've had they guy consistently shooting smaller deer say he's frustrated when he got up to the deer that it was so small.

Any ideas on how to help this situation?
Only thing I can think of is 1. Out bait them or 2. Share a ton of pictures and try to convince them to let some of the 3 year olds walk.

Our area is known for big deer. We just need the age to go with it.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

I hate to sound like a smartass, but buy more land. Unfortunately it’s the only plan I know of that helps protect some deer. Obviously it won’t protect all but if a couple can make it at least you enter every season with something to chase. I feel your pain and honesty don’t think there is a solution. People management is way harder than deer management.

 

[roymunson]

I completely agree on buying more land. Buy, lease, rent, whatever, but get more land under your umbrella. But at what point am I being just as selfish with my desires in the woods over the good of the herd as the guy shooting his 3 year old 10 point?

Fine line between complacency and contentment. Toeing that line can be very tough.

 

[Mortenson]

I'd try talking to them. Can't hurt. If you're close enough to know everything they're killing, I think you're close enough to gently start nudging them.

 

[Telemark]

2. Share a ton of pictures and try to convince them to let some of the 3 year olds walk.

I would do this. Especially if you can share pictures of the ones they already shot rather than give them an inventory of what's left to shoot.

You have a decent chance since it seems so many of his group already shot smaller bucks. Should be easier to ask them to hold out for older bucks from now on.

One bit of advice if you go this route: plan your arguments thoroughly, well in advance of your conversation(s) . Maybe even watch a few YouTube videos on how to negotiate. Consider that one of the most difficult things to do is to convince someone to change their mind. It is unlikely you will get him to come around to your way of thinking after one conversation. It might take dozens of conversations over a few years. Be strategic. Don't be pushy. Learn to read him, and be ready to drop the issue for the time being if you sense he is getting defensive or uncomfortable in any way. People do change their minds, but generally not quickly and not easily. Best if he thinks he came up with the idea all on his own.

 

[roymunson]

I don't wanna be pushy. I just have a vision that we'd all have a lot of fun if we could put some age on them. I know guys who go door to door at neighbors places and say "don't you dare shoot this one or this one"

That's BS.

And honestly, in the heat of the moment, people are gonna shoot what they want. We're known as the "only wants to shoot big ones" group, and they're known as the "well, we enjoy ourselves" group. but there's a different type of fun with it when you've delayed gratification. Because you worked for it. It means more.

 

[BenAllgood]

Does he do habitat work? Maybe get those conversations going and offer information and maybe help if it seems he's interested.

Also, see if he's willing to share jawbones. Put them on a board with their pictures and weights. Include yours as well. Write the ages underneath. There's two jawbones, so give him a board and you get one. It may help to have a visual of potentials.

 

[roymunson]

Does he do habitat work? Maybe get those conversations going and offer information and maybe help if it seems he's interested.

Also, see if he's willing to share jawbones. Put them on a board with their pictures and weights. Include yours as well. Write the ages underneath. There's two jawbones, so give him a board and you get one. It may help to have a visual of potentials.

He does. I'm jealous of his switchgrass stand...

He's a good dude and I like him. But I wish he'd ask "what do we gotta do to kill some BIG deer around here"

 

[BenAllgood]

He does. I'm jealous of his switchgrass stand...

He's a good dude and I like him. But I wish he'd ask "what do we gotta do to kill some BIG deer around here"

Maybe if he saw what you were consistently killing vs what he was killing, he would ask how he could do that. That was my thinking behind the board. It's like getting your toes wet in the cooperative pool. I've seen and helped with boards like that, and it does get the talk started about "how do we do that?"

 

[Catscratch]

Share a ton of pics, talk with them over beer and a fire, out bait them, and make your place a sanctuary (more cover and less intrusion). Do ALL of it! I'd put the blame on myself and not them. Tell them you really want to shoot older bucks. Ask them for advice on how to make that happen? Ask them questions about yourself that will force them to reflect on themselves. Most people would rather do what they thought was their idea rather than someone elses idea.


My FIL leased his place for a while. Great guys who I enjoyed visiting with! I showed them trailcam pics, the lay of the land, and where all my stands were with my blessing to use them. They were very good hunters who only harvested the biggest deer around. Within a couple of years they had shot several large bucks (150 and above), then they started shooting 130's, then 120's. They always shot the biggest deer around and never the dinks.... until only the dinks were left. It took a long time for the place to recover after that. Point being, get started soon so that your place can get back to it's potential soon.

 

[roymunson]

Maybe if he saw what you were consistently killing vs what he was killing, he would ask how he could do that. That was my thinking behind the board. It's like getting your toes wet in the cooperative pool. I've seen and helped with boards like that, and it does get the talk started about "how do we do that?"

He knows. We talk regularly. When a decent buck walks in, he and his hunters get all worked up and kill em... It is what it is.

But communication is the answer. I agree.

 

[Telemark]

but there's a different type of fun with it when you've delayed gratification. Because you worked for it. It means more.

I totally agree. I think it's actually a biological fact. But don't let the goal distract you from the journey. And don't let perfect be the enemy of good.

 

[bueller]

I agree with the jawbone and weight suggestion. I've been doing that to show others the hard evidence and for my own record keeping.

Another option, ignore them. What you don't know can't hurt you. Hunt hard and control what you can control. Pay no attention to their harvests.

 

[T-Max]

I feel like if you shared pics of those up and comers with him, and explained your intent to pass them, he would have a harder time killing them knowing that. Then he would have to be content killing a buck he knows isn’t up to the neighborhood standard.


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[Bill]

Could you pick 1 deer next year that's got the potential to blow up in one more year and discuss that one? If you could get him/them to pass one to see what "did" happen rather then talking about what "can" happen might make a difference. Especially he shoots it the next year.

 

[swat1018]

Not to be a dick, but you have 5 guys hunting 300 ares pretty regularly. Some people would think that's excessive. Not everyone agrees on what deer management is...

 

[AppyHappy]

Not to be a dick, but you have 5 guys hunting 300 ares pretty regularly. Some people would think that's excessive. Not everyone agrees on what deer management is...

What you say-350 acres is plenty. Don't get into the game of trying to outbait them. Need to have those mature bucks feel secure during daylight on your property. Without all the facts it is either you need more security cover areas or you're own hunting pressure is hurting your land.

 

[Angus 1895]

A Boone and crocket deer is 130 ?

I thought it would be 165

 

[hillrunner]

I wouldn't consider 5 guys on 350 acres to be low pressure at all unless they don't hunt much. There's only so many decent spots for each wind direction to go around. I'm not telling you to give anyone the boot as this is probably your families hunting with you. I'm just saying if you want your property to stand out to those deer as a safe haven, it needs to lack intrusion compared to the rest. The bucks don't know they are safe by you if they are constantly coming across human scent.

 

[SwampCat]

You have two more b&c deer running around than 90% of the deer hunters in the country. Pretty sure no b&c deer has EVER been killed in my county. How many 5 yr old bucks do your five hunters kill in an average year and do you kill any lesser bucks?