2016 WI Spring CDAC Meetings

[wiscwhip]

Only way to achieve anything close to that is through EAB and(not or) Bonus Buck. The issue with that is, now that we have call-in registration, there is nothing stopping anyone from just calling in multiple antlerless kills to earn their buck validation and then calling in even more antlerless kills to get Bonus Buck tags. Zero does actually killed, 3 or 4 buck tags for everyone. I said from the get-go that doing away with live registration was a BAD idea.

To paraphrase the immortal words of "Pyscho" Ted................

When in doubt, I'll call it in.
I got me a Bonus Buck Tag!
It's a free for all!

 

[BJE80]

Only way to achieve anything close to that is through EAB and(not or) Bonus Buck. The issue with that is, now that we have call-in registration, there is nothing stopping anyone from just calling in multiple antlerless kills to earn their buck validation and then calling in even more antlerless kills to get Bonus Buck tags. Zero does actually killed, 3 or 4 buck tags for everyone. I said from the get-go that doing away with live registration was a BAD idea.

To paraphrase the immortal words of "Pyscho" Ted................

When in doubt, I'll call it in.
I got me a Bonus Buck Tag!
It's a free for all!

Gotta admit. I like the call in registration for selfish reasons but you got a point Wisc. If someone can get more buck tags just for making a phone call people will do it. No doubt about it.

 

[wiscwhip]

Call-in reg is probably great from certain aspects(if I ever get to use it, I will let you know what I think), but it will never improve herd monitoring or accuracy of data collected. Too much margin for abuse even without EAB or Bonus Buck type rules.

 

[bueller]

Gotta admit. I like the call in registration for selfish reasons but you got a point Wisc. If someone can get more buck tags just for making a phone call people will do it. No doubt about it.

I highly doubt they will allow any type of earn a buck or bonus buck with call in or online registrations. IF and that's a big IF earn a buck or bonus buck is ever put in play they will have to come up with something like mandatory in person registration in those counties for the affected seasons.

 

[bueller]

Call-in reg is probably great from certain aspects(if I ever get to use it, I will let you know what I think), but it will never improve herd monitoring or accuracy of data collected. Too much margin for abuse even without EAB or Bonus Buck type rules.

It is very conveinent. Heck I registered one last year from a moving vehicle enroute to the processor.

It WILL be abused. My guess is that antlerless harvest numbers will increase in counties with high DPSM being threatened with antlerless only years. People will start calling in their free antlerless tags as filled to boost those numbers without actually harvesting a doe.

 

[wiscwhip]

I agree bueller, no way it could be done without opening some sort of in person reg stations again, and abuse will be more prevalent than ever now that the writing is on the wall for the antlerless only seasons.

 

[BJE80]

Call-in reg is probably great from certain aspects(if I ever get to use it, I will let you know what I think), but it will never improve herd monitoring or accuracy of data collected. Too much margin for abuse even without EAB or Bonus Buck type rules.

I love it for personal reasons. I mean its really nice. But I'm an honest guy and just like the convenience.

 

[Tree Spud]

Marquette county recommended that we "maintain" population goals. Bit surprised as we are in top 5 highest dpsm counties. They did state that "deer mgmt tools are needed" such as EAB.

I would like to see EAB return, way too many folks in our area that refuse to shoot a doe. Many of the old timers are a lost cause so we need to teach the younger hunting crowd the importance of herd balance (#'s and sex ratio).

 

[dipper]

It appears maintain is the dnr giving up on lower a population and calling broken arrow.

 

[Tree Spud]

It appears maintain is the dnr giving up on lower a population and calling broken arrow.

I think you are correct ... specific mtg minutes by board members stated ... "we need EAB or something that will reduce the herd" ... yet they vote to decide to "maintain" population.

 

[wiscwhip]

The whole "maintain" status was turned into a damn joke by CDAC's in counties like Waupaca, Shawano, Marquette and many others that had high deer numbers. Those counties should have took a page from the Buffalo Co CDAC and recommended a "decrease" designation from the start. The use of the "maintain" status in those high density counties p!$$ed off the members of the Natural Resources Board and the only reason they let it slide was because this was the first go-around for the new CDAC process. I will guarantee that will not fly when the 3 year goal setting meetings happen again late 2017. The NRB has already said they will override any CDAC recommendations they do not agree with the next time it is up for reevaluation.

 

[Tree Spud]

The whole "maintain" status was turned into a damn joke by CDAC's in counties like Waupaca, Shawano, Marquette and many others that had high deer numbers. Those counties should have took a page from the Buffalo Co CDAC and recommended a "decrease" designation from the start. The use of the "maintain" status in those high density counties p!$$ed off the members of the Natural Resources Board and the only reason they let it slide was because this was the first go-around for the new CDAC process. I will guarantee that will not fly when the 3 year goal setting meetings happen again late 2017. The NRB has already said they will override any CDAC recommendations they do not agree with the next time it is up for reevaluation.

So CDAC was formed to encourage involvement & policy development at a local level, and to get more hunter involvement ... but if DNR/NRB doesn't like the decisions, they will overrule?

And people wonder why there is such distrust & resentment with these agencies.

 

[Tree Spud]

Waupaca is now horn porn Tdm crazy. Way too many camps are now Tdm vs. Qdm. So here we are now faced with a no buck season in 2016? Fantastic results. Imo, this is what will happen.Look at the 2015 harvest numbers. 5,300 bucks/6200 antlerless. What will these numbers be in 2016 with 3 free doe tags only? a)guys don't trust the dnr numbers so many will not take doe without consequences for 2017. b)Guys only have so many days to hunt so they will head to adjoining counties and hunt a relatives place or the big woods with a chance at a buck for the opener, creating undue pressure on those herds and not in Waupaca doing the Tdm camps heavy lifting.c)After thanksgiving weekend nobody hunts anymore. Look at the mz, 4 day rifle doe, late season bow harvest. It's a joke. My guess is 2016 doe harvest will be 8,000. Far short of the Cdac/Dnr goal but ohoh, 5,300 bucks are still vertical for a net net of an additional 3,500 deer standing.BTw, fawns and old bucks are winterkill first. Winter overbrowse gets worse, crop damage gets worse. What happens in 2017 with no consequences for anyones actions in 2016? Don't shoot doe and go back to Tdm. With this proposal i predict many more deer standing on 1/1/2017 then 1/1/2016. And the Tdm crowd will hunt out of state guided and dream of what 1 year will do to antler growth. As I stated, I know 2 properties in Waupaca county that are true Qdm. Btw, I will not take 2 trips to Waupaca costing $2,000 for a 2 hour 6 doe harvest. Sturgis is a TDM guy, dont fool yourself. That's what his clients pay him for. It's always someone elses problema, Si!

NoFo ... is this the softer, gentler you? Marriage is doing wonders ... :)

Your own observations tell the story ... this is a hunter mgmt vs. a deer mgmt issue. It is a 80:20 rule situation. You have to focus the process on the correct target who can change the results you want to achieve.

If you can't influence, change, or impact the behavior of the 20% (TDM, QDM wanna be's, etc), because they can wait it out, then you have to focus on the 80% who will hunt under any rules.

I know you have concerns about an EAB type approach, but the DNR failed their own process with EAB. One of the key failures was allowing folks to carry over a tag from one year to the next. This allowed harvest efforts in the previous year, to have no impact the following year.

At the end of the day, some group/agency has to get serious and take a lead role is changing hunter behavior. Unfortunately the DNR keeps failing as they are more worried about license sales revenue than proper mgmt programs. I mean really ... if the deer herd is decimated in the northern units, why would you continue to allow baiting? Just so you can keep the allusion alive ... and drive license sales?

As my old boss used to say ... finding a solution is easy ... the real issue is identifying what the correct problem you are trying to solve ... ;)

.

 

[BJE80]

I have no issues with eab, ever. The majority on this site pontificate Qdm and in reality they are Tdm as Sturgis now writes the mag as a qdm wannabe. Am I pissed? Yep. I take 314 antlerless the last 10 years while my local buddies take 30? But they fly the Qdm banner? LOL. Frankly this site is a joke with deer wannabes. After 40 years of doing the moral killing, we are lumped in with the wannabes who are now getting chubbies thinking how much more Tdm horn could be grown. Talk about self centered ego stroking? Waupaca is literally miles from the wolf pack over run. We all make our delusional bed and now get to sleep in it. Yes, glad marriage took my edge off.LOL Btw, mdoofus is still the uneducated CFP dj wannabe who for a wrap fee will gladly managers R yur $$$. haha

I've heard this from several people. "Oh that's awesome. Imagine the bucks next year." Jesus people get a clue. I hate tdm and the obsession with antlers more than Obama.

 

[BJE80]

Welcome to Waupaca county circa 2010. Many camps have figured out the Sturgis way. Sit for mega bucks, let the neighbors do the qdm thing, and stroke my ego. This entire site is an ego stroke. You either walk the walk or stroke the stroke. Bloviate away boys.

Well I don't have to worry about that. I still get a shot of adrenaline when a fawn walks out. Lol. The way hunting should be.

 

[shawnv]

It just seems like the system needs a little more common sense built in with more flexibility so we don't have to have extreme deer management.

 

[tooln]

It depends on your area, some counties will suffer and some not so much. Remember the 70's, buck only and party doe tags.

 

[shawnv]

It's impossible to get consistent results even within a county. My county is not happy that the deer population is going up based on the "maintain" status because the kill was lower than expected last year (maybe their estimate was off and it should have been to "increase"). I disagree with them as in my local area the population could use another 20% uptick just to get in the right level of having deer but not too many. Travel 4-5 miles and it's a different story, they are probably at the right level.

 

[BJE80]

Spoke with a Cdac member. Here's the big DNR hammer in the toolbox. Dnr claims we have 82 dpsm(habitat only, no ag land), they want 30 dpsm. So the Dnr claims we now have 5 deer/40 acres and they want 2.2 deer/40 acres. How many guys in Waupaca want 5 or less deer/40? The hammer? Unless dpsm goes down, no Mfl contracts will be renewed. No regen, no need for MFL. Ouch!

Wow.

 

[bueller]

Spoke with a Cdac member. Here's the big DNR hammer in the toolbox. Dnr claims we have 82 dpsm(habitat only, no ag land), they want 30 dpsm. So the Dnr claims we now have 5 deer/40 acres and they want 2.2 deer/40 acres. How many guys in Waupaca want 5 or less deer/40? The hammer? Unless dpsm goes down, no Mfl contracts will be renewed. No regen, no need for MFL. Ouch!

Deer densities sound so much different when spoken in terms of 40 acres instead of square miles. It's pretty fair to say I've got 5 deer per 40, but my neighbors probably don't.