New strategy

[nwmn]

I'm sure this has come up plenty in light of the current environment.

Due to costs of inputs I've decided to construct plots consisting of high diversity mixes with little to to no inputs while hoping to smother weeds and build soil.

I've got tons of acreage to work with, so I feel providing many acres of 'ok' food will be adequate, while focusing on a few acres of managed plots including sugar beets and corn.

My high diverse mix ideas are:
Flowering mix - buckwheat, sunflowers, canola, crimson clover, and hairy vetch.
Legume/forage mix- cowpeas, sunflowers, soybeans, sunn hemp, buckwheat, and maybe add in corn for climbing structure.

Anybody heading this direction? Any tweaks to seed mixes? I want a flowering mix so I have some nice aesthetics as well as serving a purpose.

 

[SD51555]

I'm sure this has come up plenty in light of the current environment.

Due to costs of inputs I've decided to construct plots consisting of high diversity mixes with little to to no inputs while hoping to smother weeds and build soil.

I've got tons of acreage to work with, so I feel providing many acres of 'ok' food will be adequate, while focusing on a few acres of managed plots including sugar beets and corn.

My high diverse mix ideas are:
Flowering mix - buckwheat, sunflowers, canola, crimson clover, and hairy vetch.
Legume/forage mix- cowpeas, sunflowers, soybeans, sunn hemp, buckwheat, and maybe add in corn for climbing structure.

Anybody heading this direction? Any tweaks to seed mixes? I want a flowering mix so I have some nice aesthetics as well as serving a purpose.

Echoing Wild Thing, make sure you cover all your food groups. Throw a grass in each of those mixes, or nature will send you some grasses that aren't so easy to wrangle. If you're planting into the warm season throw a dwarf sorghum in there.

You're not losing anything by not using fertilizer, you're gaining. After your first year, and certainly your second, you're going to tap into natural biological fertility and your forage quality will be superior to anything following a fallow period fertilized with synthetics. The mineral content of your forage will be sky high.

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

Id add milo or exchange it with the corn.

 

[nwmn]

Id add milo or exchange it with the corn.

Is that thr same as sorghum, or something different?

 

[nwmn]

Echoing Wild Thing, make sure you cover all your food groups. Throw a grass in each of those mixes, or nature will send you some grasses that aren't so easy to wrangle. If you're planting into the warm season throw a dwarf sorghum in there.

You're not losing anything by not using fertilizer, you're gaining. After your first year, and certainly your second, you're going to tap into natural biological fertility and your forage quality will be superior to anything following a fallow period fertilized with synthetics. The mineral content of your forage will be sky high.

So add in oats? Or maybe winter rye come fall?

Ideally I could get this into a no till operation. Want to test it out first before diving into full scale!

 

[SD51555]

Both.

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

Is that thr same as sorghum, or something different?

It is grain sorghum. it is shorter and produces a seed head that offers a food source.

 

[Wild Thing]

Is that thr same as sorghum, or something different?

Milo and Sorghum are often referred to in the same context, and yes Milo is a Sorghum, but there are different types of sorghums. The shorter variety that S.T.Fanatic is referring to is more of a "Forage" Sorghum like WGF (Wildlife Game Food???) Sorghum which many of us prefer to plant for forage. They only grow about 3' tall or so but they have a large seed head which is great forage when it matures. There are other types of grain sorghum that have smaller seed heads but grow very tall and are preferred for making screens. These are often mixed with a Sudan Grass and called Sorghum/Sudan.

 

[Wild Thing]

Here is a photo of the WGF (Wild Game Food) sorghum nwmn. The short stuff with the large seed head. There was also some taller Grain Sorghum/Milo, some corn...and a lot of other stuff in this "Jungle Plot" I planted many years ago...

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Milo and Sorghum are often referred to in the same context, and yes Milo is a Sorghum, but there are different types of sorghums. The shorter variety that S.T.Fanatic is referring to is more of a "Forage" Sorghum like WGF (Wildlife Game Food???) Sorghum which many of us prefer to plant for forage. They only grow about 3' tall or so but they have a large seed head which is great forage when it matures. There are other types of grain sorghum that have smaller seed heads but grow very tall and are preferred for making screens. These are often mixed with a Sudan Grass and called Sorghum/Sudan.

Next question - Millet vs Milo, is there a difference?

 

[nwmn]

Here is a photo of the WGF (Wild Game Food) sorghum nwmn. The short stuff with the large seed head. There was also some taller Grain Sorghum/Milo, some corn...and a lot of other stuff in this "Jungle Plot" I planted many years ago...

View attachment 42827

View attachment 42828

Great stuff! Very Helpful. I'll look into grain sorghum, or something with more wildlife value. Is there a specific variety that I should note? (I have ZERO experience with this stuff).

I'm assuming the doves are in there pretty thick as well? That's another thing I wanted to create is a dove hotbed and give me an additional new hobby come fall :)

 

[nwmn]

Next question - Millet vs Milo, is there a difference?

Only thing I know is that Japanese Millet is a plant species that I have at my place lol.

Interested to know this answer as well.

 

[CarolinaDawg]

Next question - Millet vs Milo, is there a difference?

Both millet and Milo are grasses that produce seed heads. Millet is to Milo as Cowpeas are to Lablab or Soybeans. They are the same family and not super easy for a novice to tell apart at certain growth stages, but they are indeed different plant species

 

[Skeeter]

Next question - Millet vs Milo, is there a difference?

In my experience, milo is a little longer maturity crop than millet. Also has a thicker stalk than most millets. German millet is similar to foxtail. Japanese millet does well in wet soil. Brown millet looks a bit like a smaller version of milo when I have planted both. Pearl millet gets a decent size stalk

 

[Nightvision]

Corn is too expensive and needs too much water. Definitely swap it out with grain sorghum.

 

[yoderjac]

I'm sure this has come up plenty in light of the current environment.

Due to costs of inputs I've decided to construct plots consisting of high diversity mixes with little to to no inputs while hoping to smother weeds and build soil.

I've got tons of acreage to work with, so I feel providing many acres of 'ok' food will be adequate, while focusing on a few acres of managed plots including sugar beets and corn.

My high diverse mix ideas are:
Flowering mix - buckwheat, sunflowers, canola, crimson clover, and hairy vetch.
Legume/forage mix- cowpeas, sunflowers, soybeans, sunn hemp, buckwheat, and maybe add in corn for climbing structure.

Anybody heading this direction? Any tweaks to seed mixes? I want a flowering mix so I have some nice aesthetics as well as serving a purpose.

I've been going that route long enough that I don't use any fertilizer anymore. As far as the mixes go, I like to shoot for 50% legumes and 50% N-seeking crops. Within those broad categories, there are lots of options. Some of the selection will depend on your equipment. If you are using a no-till drill, you have more flexibility as you can plant larger seeds like soybeans, but most large seeds don't surface broadcast well. The other piece of advice I'd offer, unless you have very fertile soil, start with crops that will tolerate infertile soil until you can build OM and improve nutrient cycling. It takes time for the soil to heal itself after deep and/or frequent tillage.

You are on the right track, planting more acreage with less intensity for deer management. Unless you have a specific weed problem, become weed tolerant. They contribute to diversity as well. Deer don't need yield. They need sufficient volume and any crop that doesn't end up in the belly of a deer after the stress period you are planting for is over, it is not contributing to QDM.

You are starting down a good long-term path. Be patient.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[pilotpip]

I've posted this in another thread, but I'm taking our acre and a half field and going perennial clover this year. I had about 1/5 of it clover, the rest I was trying to do fall plots. The last couple years the fall plots haven't gone well, but the clover on the other portion is well established. This Feb/March we spread 1500lbs of pell lime into it, tilled it to break up some very nasty clay, and planted a clover mix similar to what I have on the established side along with some cereal rye as a cover crop. I'll throw some brassicas into it this summer but I'm going to otherwise leave it alone and let the clover establish. I've refocused my efforts on TSI, creating some bedding, and making a couple small staging plots that won't require much work once they're ready.

Our 90 acres is almost all hardwoods, with a ton of oaks. When they're producing acorns I don't have to do jack squat to keep deer on my property. Last year was bad for whites and reds so the deer were pretty sparse. It made me realize I need to focus on the rest of the property to keep them there. With our warmer winters the established clover hasn't done bad and we've also started supplemental feeding when it's legal outside of the season because frankly, I'm pretty sure our some of our neighbors are hunting over corn piles.

 

[yoderjac]

I've posted this in another thread, but I'm taking our acre and a half field and going perennial clover this year. I had about 1/5 of it clover, the rest I was trying to do fall plots. The last couple years the fall plots haven't gone well, but the clover on the other portion is well established. This Feb/March we spread 1500lbs of pell lime into it, tilled it to break up some very nasty clay, and planted a clover mix similar to what I have on the established side along with some cereal rye as a cover crop. I'll throw some brassicas into it this summer but I'm going to otherwise leave it alone and let the clover establish. I've refocused my efforts on TSI, creating some bedding, and making a couple small staging plots that won't require much work once they're ready.

Our 90 acres is almost all hardwoods, with a ton of oaks. When they're producing acorns I don't have to do jack squat to keep deer on my property. Last year was bad for whites and reds so the deer were pretty sparse. It made me realize I need to focus on the rest of the property to keep them there. With our warmer winters the established clover hasn't done bad and we've also started supplemental feeding when it's legal outside of the season because frankly, I'm pretty sure our some of our neighbors are hunting over corn piles.

The problem tilling to break up very nasty clay is that is just makes the problem worse over time and the clay crusts. I've converted old logging decks that were highly compressed clay because of the heavy equipment. Weeds would not even grow on them when I started. The first step was decompression. This is a form of tillage I guess. I used a single shank ripper to relieve the compression. I rotated WR/CC and Buckwhet for 2 years using min-till methods. By min-till, I mean holding a tiller so high with the 3-pt hitch that the tines barely touch the top inch at most. It is just enough to break up the crust. Then surface broadcast and cultipack. After that, I planted perennial clover with a WR nurse crop in the fall.

The problem with tilling clay is that it burns what little OM you have. Minimizing tillage and cycling the right crops over time builds OM and improves nutrient cycling in addition to solving the crusting problem. Today, I can T&M the plots with no crusting issues at all.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Bassattackr]

Next question - Millet vs Milo, is there a difference?

Yes, big difference. Milo is a true sorghum, a cousin to corn..

Millets are from a much different part of the world, albiet still in the "grass" family. Millets are planted at higher rates. Milo is planted a much lower rates, typically planted as a row crop, again like corn.

 

[Brian662]

Tillage radish will allegedly break up a hard pan without the need for a sub soiler or ripper, from what I've read at least. Never needed to use it.