Kip: Top 5 Factors Causing Deer Population Declines

[bat man]

I am sure it has an effect but I don't know if that can be determined by more guys being upset in one zone. Also the habit at is a lot different, there are more wolves, etc. .

I am talking about consistent differences between zone 1 and 2 in 11 total zones. Could be a coincidence, but I think its an extra week of rifle season.

I asked Leslie to look at opening weekend harvest over the last 15 years and told he she would see the herd trending. Hunter effort. It is not measured in MN.

Every year we hear wind rain and corn as the reason the harvest is so far off. Then we make up SOME of the harvest with the remaining 7 to 14 days of rifle.

Fewer deer with more hunter effort means the herd is down much further than our DNR cares to report.

 

[bat man]

He said you need lots of healthy does, to grow plenty of healthy buck fawns.
Lots of healthy buck fawns and the chance is there for aa better than average buck.

Every year I get plenty of pictures of mature bucks, and some chances afield. I just can seem to pull the string or the trigger on 115" bucks. I subscribe to the 'plenty of does dropping more bucks' ups the odds of what I consider 'quality' bucks.

 

[bat man]

115ish is about the best I've had a chance at here, and I can't shoot one either. I suppose if that remains the "best" I can do, then sooner or later I'll have to shoot one if I want some venison.

Optimistic those 115 inch deer will be 130 this fall with the no winter we had and the long growing season this spring/summer.

 

[bwoods11]

^^^Driving south of 94 from Sauk Centre to west of Glenwood/Alex...I just don't see how there are more deer there than here. I couldn't live down there...

Couldn't live down there?? Why? Alexandria/Glenwood/Starbuck area? Have you seen it?...hundreds of lakes and plenty of mature woods. It is not all open prairie and crop. I live on a lake that is 7100 acres, and has wooded hills all around it...it has made several top 10 views in MN lists. Alexandria is one of the fastest growing cities in MN outside of the metro.

The deer hunting is not as good as it should be, but we have plenty enough cover to support a lot of deer. The Terrace area south of Glenwood, looks exactly like Southern Iowa, and it should have an overabundance of deer.

 

[West Branch]

The last two years we were able to find out what happened to a few different bucks, ended up the neighbors shot them...

2013 Tall 9 - it was on east side of our property in July to early August. Shifted to west side into September and one of our guys saw it opening of firearms but no shot. Neighbor #1 shot it later that day. It was shot almost 1.5 miles west from where we had velvet pics in summer and 3/4 mile from where we had Sept-Oct pics.

2013 wide 8 short tines - I had it about 60 yards bow hunting in end of Sept. Neighbor #2 shot it opening weekend of firearms about 1/4 mile east of where we were seeing it. Big bodied buck, wish the neighbor had weighed it.

2013-2014 big 10 - East side of our place in summer 2013 hanging out with tall 9. Shifted around quite a bit and had daylight pics Nov 6-7 of 2013 but nobody had a shot at it while hunting. 2 pics in November showed that it covered about 3/4 of a mile in 20 minutes one morning during daylight. Only one pic in summer of 2014, no pictures until first week of November which were at the crack of dawn. Neighbor #2s grandson shot it during the first week of the season about 1.25 miles from where we had pics of it over a couple days just a few days beforehand. They never scored it but it looked like low-mid 130s in 2013 and probably broke 140 in 2014.

Neighbor #2 has 80 acres and they have shot four (3 by him 1 by grandson) 2.5+ year old bucks in 2012-2014. I think 3 of the 4 were 3.5+. Biggest thing he has going for him that we don't is that he is retired and only hunts when conditions are right. We are working on getting better with that.

 

[bat man]

. Biggest thing he has going for him that we don't is that he is retired and only hunts when conditions are right. We are working on getting better with that.

If he hunts smart and has a free calendar he has a huge huge huge advantage for killing deer. Most don't hunt smart or have a free calendar. Some do one or the other. I would rather be that guy than share a line for sure.

 

[bwoods11]

Yep, frequently. My step-daughter lives between Alex and Glenwood. I've also spent a number of hours driving around south of I-94 since moving here, just to get a feel for the area. Alex and north is great, south of Glenwood 15-20 miles...not so great. Alex being one of the fastest growing cities is certainly not a "plus" for me ;) I do enjoy being able to drive 45 minutes and get whatever I need, but being very close to that area (and all the Metro folks who visit) is not on my list of things to do. Have you been through the Padua/Greenwald area? That type of habitat is predominant for much of the area south of I94 that I've seen...not where I want to live.

I'm just pointing out that you might be in the minority on how you are viewing the area. Land prices are high in that area south of Alex, and cheap north of Alex. Supply and demand. I know of back lots near the lake, selling for more than a 40 acre parcel near Parkers. Everyone has their own comfort zone, I was just curious why you thought that area was any different than LP?

 

[wiscwhip]

Kip seems more like a dip(schidt) with every new article he writes. From a central WI point of view, I can tell you his list is pretty skewed. This is what I see in central WI and many other areas.
#1.) Intentional Herd Reduction=Overharvest allowed by our "trusted":rolleyes: resource departments. This is the number one reason for deer declines in most "upper" Midwestern states.
#2.) Falling Fawn Recruitment=Way too many predators on the landscape, and not enough tags being issued to control them. WI bear tags and the relisting of wolves comes to mind.
#3.) Severe Winter Weather=This is only really an issue in the northern 1/3rd to 1/2 of the extreme northern tier states(or in isolated pockets such as the Central Forest Zone in WI), it is a non-factor EVERYWHERE else!
#4.) Habitat Loss=Not really an issue in WI, at least as far as overall habitat loss is concerned. Small, localized areas, maybe. Bigger factor is likely a lack of logging to create young forest habitat, which is currently being somewhat addressed by both the State and Federal Forestry guys, by the increase in recent cutting.
#5.) Hemorrhagic Disease=Almost a complete non-factor in WI save for a few cases in a couple counties in extreme SW WI.

You would think being from PA, he would be more in touch with what is ailing the northern deer herds, but if Kip wants to keep toting the party line of the Association he represents, then he needs to concentrate on the south and the areas that his organization wants to be a part of and leave the northern deer management to the guys who don't wear full Carhartt's when it hits 45 degrees.:rolleyes:

 

[sandbur]

Yep, frequently. My step-daughter lives between Alex and Glenwood. I've also spent a number of hours driving around south of I-94 since moving here, just to get a feel for the area. Alex and north is great, south of Glenwood 15-20 miles...not so great. Alex being one of the fastest growing cities is certainly not a "plus" for me ;) I do enjoy being able to drive 45 minutes and get whatever I need, but being very close to that area (and all the Metro folks who visit) is not on my list of things to do. Have you been through the Padua/Greenwald area? That type of habitat is predominant for much of the area south of I94 that I've seen...not where I want to live.

I like out of the way places just like Stu.

 

[sandbur]

I've known for a long time that what I find desirable is much different than the majority of folks ;) I'm okay with being an odd duck

 

[sandbur]

Odd duck number 2, here.

 

[MNAaron]

I am too, but that goes back to my previous post...where did they go? I had pics of a buck late last fall and into January that appeared to be a 140"ish 4.5 year old. I'd sure like to see what he becomes this year.

Stu

When you say your bucks are leaving what do you mean? Are they using your ground as their home range or you simply getting fleeting pictures of them on and off? We find in our area the bucks we are shooting are the ones we are getting on camera. They are not travelling huge distances typically. Sure we get the typical traveler however usually 80% of the bucks on camera during the rut are hanging around our property or near our property during the year. If bucks are vanishing be careful how much time you are spending in the woods. Just my two cents.

 

[Terrific_tom]

I am too, but that goes back to my previous post...where did they go? I had pics of a buck late last fall and into January that appeared to be a 140"ish 4.5 year old. I'd sure like to see what he becomes this year.

Stu sort of in same boat. Always have bucks with great potential or great bucks that just disappear. Well last weekend I went to the neighbors rummage sale who sold their land. They found a really nice 2 1/2 yearold buck skeleton on their land this spring. I had lots of pictures of it. In 2013 I got a glimpse of a true booner during muzzle loader season and pics of him early in summer of 2014 only to find out that he was hit by car in October of 2014 about 3/4 mile from me. I also found this out at the rummage sale and saw pics made me sick. Then this weekend while I was spraying my beans another neighbor stopped by and told me that his neice had hit an 11 point buck crossing into my property in late December. It was a 4 1/2 year old buck that we had named Bullwinkle due to his palmated rack. Again I was sick to my stomach. Then to top it off as we were packing up to head home another neighbor stops to tell and show me the remains of a 10 point buck that he found in his woods which I had pictures of last year. I always thought the mature bucks just disappeared but after talking with neighbors this year a lot of the mature bucks that I had on camera died from car collisions and unknown causes. This season isn't looking to promising.

 

[biglakeba$$]

We get nice bucks even through fall but 110% nocturnal by oct 1st.

I have not captured a mature buck on a cam in the fall during daylight for a few years at least.

 

[Greta&Gus]

Take them with bow, gun, or some of each?

All with my gun. I am selling my bow, bad shoulder and no time equal rifle only. Would love it if they passed a crossbow season though. Might get one next year for our WI property. There are a lot of deer around there.

To Tom's post, I think many bucks die in all sorts of ways that we don't know about. It is a hard life out there from cars, to winter, to disease. You name it everything is trying to kill them.

Although some might cringe at this, QDMA has a number of studies on their website in regards to buck movements and home ranges. To Aaron's post, I think in 'some' areas bucks don't move much and in 'other' areas bucks move all over the place.

 

[wildfire]

I had 8 bucks harvested during gun season within 3/4 mile of our farm. All between 1.5-2.5 years old, small six to small eight. Also found 2 , 1 small six and 1 small eight dead on our farm last fall after gun season. I did not realize after trail cam pictures that there could be that many bucks. Would see 3 at mineral lick at one time. And yes I did get daylight pictures.

 

[wiscwhip]

I had 8 bucks harvested during gun season within 3/4 mile of our farm. All between 1.5-2.5 years old, small six to small eight. Also found 2 , 1 small six and 1 small eight dead on our farm last fall after gun season. I did not realize after trail cam pictures that there could be that many bucks. Would see 3 at mineral lick at one time. And yes I did get daylight pictures.

You obviously know why you don't have many 3.5+ yo bucks running around then. Hard to control the "other" side of the fence.:(

 

[MNAaron]

All with my gun. I am selling my bow, bad shoulder and no time equal rifle only. Would love it if they passed a crossbow season though. Might get one next year for our WI property. There are a lot of deer around there.

To Tom's post, I think many bucks die in all sorts of ways that we don't know about. It is a hard life out there from cars, to winter, to disease. You name it everything is trying to kill them.

Although some might cringe at this, QDMA has a number of studies on their website in regards to buck movements and home ranges. To Aaron's post, I think in 'some' areas bucks don't move much and in 'other' areas bucks move all over the place.

You said it so much better than me. Thanks

 

[bueller]

Stu sort of in same boat. Always have bucks with great potential or great bucks that just disappear. Well last weekend I went to the neighbors rummage sale who sold their land. They found a really nice 2 1/2 yearold buck skeleton on their land this spring. I had lots of pictures of it. In 2013 I got a glimpse of a true booner during muzzle loader season and pics of him early in summer of 2014 only to find out that he was hit by car in October of 2014 about 3/4 mile from me. I also found this out at the rummage sale and saw pics made me sick. Then this weekend while I was spraying my beans another neighbor stopped by and told me that his neice had hit an 11 point buck crossing into my property in late December. It was a 4 1/2 year old buck that we had named Bullwinkle due to his palmated rack. Again I was sick to my stomach. Then to top it off as we were packing up to head home another neighbor stops to tell and show me the remains of a 10 point buck that he found in his woods which I had pictures of last year. I always thought the mature bucks just disappeared but after talking with neighbors this year a lot of the mature bucks that I had on camera died from car collisions and unknown causes. This season isn't looking to promising.

:eek: Sounds like you need a deer crossing sign like those on the interstate

 

[biglakeba$$]

and there are just simply bucks that move further than other bucks in the same area....