I’ll leave this here…glyphosate

[westonwhitetail]

It’s not an income problem, it’s a math skills problem. Junk food costs more than premium meats and chem free produce. Start looking at prices through a cost per pound lens. Convenience store snacks run $12-$18/lb.

You can buy 100% grass fed, grass finished no-vax, no hormone, non-mRNA hamburger for $9/lb. Pasture raised non gmo fed heirloom ground pork for $9/lb.

Here’s a classic lunch I pack for myself to take to work:

$4.50 - couple 1/4 lb campfire hamburgers naked
$1.40 - 1/4 lb of pistachios (In shell)
$1.25 - apple
$1.00 - green pepper
$0.70- sliced Colby to lay on green pepper
———————
$8.85 for a poison free nutrient dense complete meal. How much is a lap around any drive thru choke and puke?


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When you compare it to fast food, healthy food is not expensive. But healthy food is not convenient and in general people are lazy and/or poor planners

I can be guilty of this too but have come a long way in the last couple years

 

[Baker]

I've watched this thread with great interest for a variety of reasons. I started the transition of my farm to regenerative practices a couple of years ago and offer several observations. First my primary motive is philosophical. Having studied the principles for 30 years now going back to Alan Savory and his writings on intensive rotational grazing up to the current wealth of information coming out on how soil health works I finally elected to take the leap.I've learned a lot in the last couple years .

First hats off to Farmer Dan and anyone that makes a living as a farmer or rancher. It's a tough gig with upside down economics. Yet it is our food supply along with a host of other absolute necessities to our way of life.

Second. It is refreshing to see that on a website like this there is an awakening to where food comes from, how it is produced, what its nutrient density is, how it effects our health, as well as what the real cost of such is in the big picture. To me this is reflective of a growing trend worldwide and will continue to increase as pandemics are thrust upon us, outbreaks happen resulting from current production practices such as salmonella etc , the impact of obesity and feeling shitty from eating shitty food, the destruction of soil and its smorgasbord of chaos including dustbowl type events...and I think thats just the start.

Yet the challenges are real. To no large degree ag in the U.S. today is dependent on the farm bill for success. Again Farmer Da and others can opine on this far more than me but it is my impression that the bill is geared to the conventional model of ag with little [ if any ] support for regenerative practices . IMO it would be extremely valuable for the govt to financially support transition to regenerative practices because its extreme difficult for the typical farmer to get off the hamster wheel of convention ag and take any risk to 'new' practices.

Indeed from this perspective economics drive both sides of the paradigm . On the one hand it is very expensive to start a regenerative farm of any scale. Yet at the same time the economics of conventional farming are becoming more challenging every year from increase costs of inputs. Yet again IMO the conventional method of ag is dysfunctional and will fail in time. Whereas the regenerative model both at the micro level and macro level will succeed because it works in harmony with nature and that coupled with an awakening consumer will reach a tipping point. This is a role I think the govt could provide value with .

My experience . I have the luxury of investing significant funds in my farm to start from scratch and absorb P&L losses as well as cash flew out the door losses. I know thats a blessing. It looks like it will take 3-4 years before I see any material positive cash flow. I started with cows, goats, and layers. I now only have cows and chickens and I'm scaling back the layer business. Death from diversity. It takes focus and with cattle having the safety valve of auction houses thats the best focus. Candidly, growing the customer base is the biggest hurdle.

We sell both thru auction barn and direct marketing. I'm in rural La. and price is still the deciding factor for many consumers. I believe many farmers may be great at production but when you add production, marketing, sales, finance, etc to the job description it is challenging to be good at all. Building a customer base is one of our biggest challenges and balancing that with production demands points out how complicated the business can be.

I am already seeing a marked improvement in my soil. I like that! I have been completely organic for two years with absolutely no problem. In fact using the cattle to 'manage ' the crop fields has been working very well. They are also improving the hurricane damaged woods.

Lastly...and I could go on forever!!... I have been creating Savannah's out of the worst damaged areas. About 100 acres so far in a mosaic designed to graze and optimize wildlife utilization. Bluntly I think because of this I can increase my deer carrying capacity as well as cattle numbers. Win Win. And that is the ultimate driver behind al this. I'm pushing the envelope exploring new territory to create the highest quality deer herd on earth . Humility may not be my strongest attribute.

 

[Troubles Trees]

Dont know much biology.........

But, without herbicides, pesticides, and synthetic fertilizers someone's going to be without a meal somehwere. It'll trickle down the economic food chain. To do without these things we will need more people and more land to provide for the masses. Certainly gona take more diesel......

Do you really think that’s true?
We can’t grow good crops without pesticides, herbicides and synthetic fertilizers? Are you not seeing the evidence to the contrary? Because there are many good examples.

 

[Baker]

I had dinner with Will Harris and his son in law a while back . he's a hoot!

 

[Bill]

Wasn't that guy an actor in the 80's?

 

[FarmerDan]

Do you really think that’s true?
We can’t grow good crops without pesticides, herbicides and synthetic fertilizers? Are you not seeing the evidence to the contrary? Because there are many good examples.

And then there's the evidence. I don't have time to fully explain. See the chart below. It illustrates corn production (could be any major crop) in the USA for the last 123 years. I've divided the time series into three groups; 1900 to around 1958, 1959 to the late 1990s and from there to today. The straight lines are the simple trend lines. The wobbly lines are annual estimates of production (billions of bushels).

The years from the 1960's to the late 1990's are what I think of as the golden years. The increase in production was because, as a country, we invested in seed research - the drive to install greater yield potential in each seed. Without synthetic fertilizers, herbicides and insecticides it would have been impossible to realize the yield gains experienced. From a soil fertility point of view there just aren't enough nutrients in the soil at the right time to experience the production we did. Production over the last 10-15 years has been flat. I will leave you to ponder that.

 

[Skeeter]

And then there's the evidence. I don't have time to fully explain. See the chart below. It illustrates corn production (could be any major crop) in the USA for the last 123 years. I've divided the time series into three groups; 1900 to around 1958, 1959 to the late 1990s and from there to today. The straight lines are the simple trend lines. The wobbly lines are annual estimates of production (billions of bushels).

The years from the 1960's to the late 1990's are what I think of as the golden years. The increase in production was because, as a country, we invested in seed research - the drive to install greater yield potential in each seed. Without synthetic fertilizers, herbicides and insecticides it would have been impossible to realize the yield gains experienced. From a soil fertility point of view there just aren't enough nutrients in the soil at the right time to experience the production we did. Production over the last 10-15 years has been flat. I will leave you to ponder that.

View attachment 58997

I'm not sure that overall production proves the point that you think it does. A better stat would be to break it down by yield per acre planted. Likely still an increase, admittedly. However, nutrient density in those crops has waned, and I would suspect that we haven't gotten any more efficient at extracting nutrients per acre, just calories.

 

[FarmerDan]

It wasn't meant to prove anything. And, at least for corn, it's commonly accepted that yields are increasing annually.