Air Pruning Containers DIY - Transfered from QDMA forum

[yoderjac]

thanks jack, I looked the farfard mix. Since I'm adding vermiculite to mine, the only thing I'm missing is the bark. I wonder if I get mulching material and that would do it? Or get bark from one of the dead trees in the woods?

I think the bark they use is starting to decay. I wouldn't go with fresh bark. I'd probably try some from a mulching material that has been processed.

 

[yoderjac]

thanks, I have a mulch at the woods that I haven't used yet. The bark I'm thinking of getting from the woods is stuff that's peeling off the tree or laying on the ground.

I'd probably try the stuff that has been decaying. Keep in mind that the professional mixes are sterile, so when you mix your own, you may end up with stuff you won't want. That is generally not an issue in nature when things are balanced out, but when we isolate thing in a pot you can get funny things going on. They could advantage you or disadvantage you.
Good Luck,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

what do you mean? Like bugs and weeds? I have a wood pile full of soft wood with decaying bark that crumples in my hand. I just of something else to do air pruning. How about that hardware cloth? Now it be harder to work up versus the rubber shelf liner. I have hardware cloth laying around in the woods from my cages. At the very least a guy could make baskets for the rubber ones.

Sure, anything could be in there. Could help or could hurt. Just keep in mind that if you do have issues, they may be different that the issues others have if you have introduced another element.
You could probably make baskets from large holed HW cloth and use the rubber liners to line it. That may provide the support you need.
I didn't consider that because I would have had to purchase it, and you quickly get close to the cost of the rootmaker pots. Personally, I'd just buy the pots. The cost savings was only substantial because I grew 600 persimmons in cells last summer and it only takes a minute to make the small cells.

 

[yoderjac]

I understand that and think I might get wood chips from my bag mulch I already have. I looked at bigrocktrees and looks like 6 one gallon root maker pots would be 26 bucks. I found smaller roll of the shelf lining but its white. Does that matter? Oh and can a guy start chestnuts in something bigger than the 18 cell?

Sure. You could direct seed which is a container the size of the planet! Seriously, of course. Just keep in mind that you won't get the full root pruning benefit, but I'm doing it with a few persimmons to see if the longer tap root has any survival benefit.
The concept with the multiple sized containers is that the tap root gets a few inches long and pruned quickly. That forces the tree to produce secondary and tertiary roots. It looses the natural drought resistance that it needs in nature but gets the benefit of faster growth. This is because the tree is fed from the root tips. The more branching, the more water and nutrients it can uptake given they are available. Since you can control water an nutrients in a container, you get all the benefit with no risk.
Once the cell is filled, it begins to work against you. The tree growth slows if when it becomes root bound. You then transplant it to a larger container. Each time a root hits the air on the sides, it desiccates forcing more up stream branching. For maximum growth with maximum root pruning, Whitcomb recommends a 4" rule. That is 4 inches on each side and the bottom. So in reality, the best size container to use after a cell is a High 5. Keep in mind, there is a difference between what is optimal and what will work.
I think this sizing is largely driven by the commercial market where getting trees to market size faster with better root systems is money.
For us, the root system is the most important thing. Starting a tree in a 1 gal rootbuilder II container would work just fine. It would simply take a bit longer for the tap root to hit the bottom of the pot and get redirected to an outside hole where it would be pruned. So, it will take longer for secondary and tertiary roots to develop. In the end, I believe you will end up with just a nice of a root system. It will just take you a bit longer to get there.
Also, keep in mind that we all have different applications and what works well for me may not be the best fit for you. For example, I'm planting my trees directly out of the cells (for the most part). I'm taking a risk. Since there is no tap root to speak of, if water is not available in the top foot or so of soil before the root system gets deep enough, I could loose trees. Some folks can mitigate this with supplemental watering. With hundreds of trees each year, I don't have the time available to water them, so I'm taking a risk. I live in an area where this risk is manageable, but someone living in a drought prone area may be better off direct seeding or stepping up container sizes if they can't field water.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Thanks jack, I was thinking making my dyi root makers the size of a gallon pot cause if I go smaller I would have to go bigger or transplant in early August. Which I doubt the tree would survive. So 4 inches on each side? So if I make them to be 8 inches in diameter would likely work? Thanks for all the help.

Keep in mind the 4" rule is Whitcomb's guide maximum growth. It is a 4" increase. So, if you start with a cell which is roughly 4x4x4, the second container would be 12" in diameter and 8" deep. That is roughly a high 5. Keep in mine, if you plan to plant after the first season, you can probably get away with a 1 gal rootbuilder II pot. I doubt it will fill the container in 1 season.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

ok I think you just confused me! LOL. Is that why most solid tree tubes are 4'inches in diameter? Or is it a totally different thing. So I guess it be better to go down to 6 inches? I think the one gallon pots were 8-9 inches tall.

This doesn't have anything to do with the size of tree tubes. This is related to balancing cost/effort and growth. Lets say you went from a 4" container to a 5" container. Not long after you transplanted it, it would fill the pot and it would be time to move to the next size container. Not only is this more cost and effort on your part, but there is some shock and setback each time you transplant a tree.
If you went directly from a 4" container to a 40" container, you would not be building a good root system nearly as fast since no root pruning would occur for a long time.
I'm just passing on the 4" rule. You can read about Dr. Whitcomb's rationale for it on the rootmaker web site. I certainly don't have enough experience to contradict or justify it. I'm just passing on my understanding after reading his site and papers.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Thanks jack, I decided to make mine 5 inch in diameter and no deeper than 6 inches. I can always make bigger ones. I changed my mind for making my rack
I have a chunk of cattle panel. So I'm going to make a frame out of 2x4s about 20 inches tall. About 20 inches wide and cut down the cattle panel to fit the frame. Then place it on top. Make my baskets to fit in the squares.
I did read some of those articles on the root maker site. One about moving a catapla tree from a 18 cell to a 3 gallon root maker pot. It filled that pot in 12 days.

With the tree varieties I've been growing, I think a 1 gal transplant would be fine for the first growing season. Good luck with your project!
By the way, I just transplanted 20 persimmons from my DIY cells into 1 gal rootbuilder II pots tonight. All had nice root systems.

 

[yoderjac]

that's awesome!!! As you probably know by now I like doing DIY projects. Yes it takes up a little time but to me that is not a big deal.

I got my stand built about a week ago. Used a piece of concrete remesh instead of cattle panel for the top. Made my baskets out of the hardware cloth. My air pruner containers about 5 inches in diameter and maybe 5-6 inches deep. My mix is the one I told you about but bought mini pine bark mulch to add to it. Broke it up alot more than added everything together. Transferred my weeping willow 2 bud cutting to one these containers....made lids for my 4 chestnuts so the squirrels don't rob me. The water runs right through my mix!!! Plus I'm collecting rain water.

Post a pic! :D

 

[yoderjac]

I will try to get some pics in the next day or 2. I used 2x4s but really should of just used 2x2s. I'm happy with it. I even painted it!

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looks good BF
todd

thanks, had to put the lids on the chestnuts to make sure I didn't get robbed by squirrels. The nuts are starting to split. I have a couple more baskets made along with my containers. I just need something else to grow.

 

[yoderjac]

Normally I would start my chestnuts indoors under lights and remove the nuts before taking them outdoors alleviating the need for the squirrel cages. I would either plant them directly from cells in the spring, or transplant them to larger containers and keep them through the summer, let them go dormant, and plant them in the spring.
With the rootbuilder II pots, I can simply mulch them in over winter for protection. Since you are just getting these started now, when do you plan to plant them? In general, I don't like to plant an actively growing tree in the fall. Some folks do it and have success. I prefer that trees have time for the root system to establish before they go into dormancy and have to deal with winter.
If you do plan to wait until early next spring to plant them before they break dormancy, you need to start thinking about how you will over winter them. You will somehow need to figure out how to keep those bags from freezing while keeping the tops dormant. You might be able to burry the bags somehow.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

I am going to buy some Dunstan chestnuts at wal-mart that are 3-4 ft tall and hold them at my house until the fall and then plant them. Do you think I should leave them in their 3 gallon buckets they came in from Chestnut Hill or make a home version of the 3 gallon rootmaker pot like you did?

 

[yoderjac]

jack, I'm planning on planting them around mid to late August. That will give them another 6 weeks before first frost. That will give them 12-14 weeks of growth. They are already push up a small shoot for the tree. I also plan on cut a small hole in the lid for the tree.

As long as you can keep them watered until they go dormant you should be fine. I'm planting in mass, so I can't keep mine watered. That is what keeps me from summer/fall planting.

 

[yoderjac]

I am going to buy some Dunstan chestnuts at wal-mart that are 3-4 ft tall and hold them at my house until the fall and then plant them. Do you think I should leave them in their 3 gallon buckets they came in from Chestnut Hill or make a home version of the 3 gallon rootmaker pot like you did?

I'm presuming your wal-mart containers are smooth walled. If that is the case, you are going to need to deal with potential circling and j-hooking roots by hand pruning.
I'm not sure if this shelving material will support the weight of 3 gallons of mix and rootball when suspended. Unless cost is a major issue or you are talking about a high volume of trees, I'd pony up the $15 per pot for some rootbuilder II High 5 containers. You will be able to reuse these year after year, and once you start planting trees, it becomes addictive.
Thanks,
Jakc

 

[yoderjac]

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