A story of frustration, and a less than awesome solution

[Howboutthemdawgs]

reviving this old girl...

We've gotten worse around our land. Funny thing is, we had 1 neighbor who was willing to feed more than we did and drew deer off of ours. Now a new neighbor is willing to feed WAY more than he does and he's calling us saying "we gotta do something here..."

Lol

There are 2 kinds of hunters and fishermen in the world. Those in your party, and the a$$holes

So are they killing good deer or young up and comers that you guys have as regulars?

I fed 11,200 lbs of defensive corn during deer season last year. It wasn’t good enough to lose three regulars to neighbors. The bucks I did have make it are completely missing this summer. I don’t know if I’m going to drop the coin this year. The juice wasn’t worth the squeeze thus far.

 

[roymunson]

So are they killing good deer or young up and comers that you guys have as regulars?

I fed 11,200 lbs of defensive corn during deer season last year. It wasn’t good enough to lose three regulars to neighbors. The bucks I did have make it are completely missing this summer. I don’t know if I’m going to drop the coin this year. The juice wasn’t worth the squeeze thus far.

almost exclusively up n comers...

2 and 3 year olds with muley forks, big frames, and 13 typical points kinda deal... The kind that turn into stallions after 4 and 5 years old

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

almost exclusively up n comers...

2 and 3 year olds with muley forks, big frames, and 13 typical points kinda deal... The kind that turn into stallions after 4 and 5 years old

Of course. Same here

 

[roymunson]

not illegal, and truthfuly, I have no issues with a kid shooting them. Heck my kids would shoot them.

My frustration is the guy who measures his value on whether or not he kills a buck and has killed the same 138" 3 year old for the last 6 years.

But I digress. Unless I'm going to by a county in Ohio and keep everyone off, we'll always be fighting this battle somehow.

 

[SwampCat]

You can high fence your place - or deal with it. I consider it part of the playing field. Maybe switch to another bait that bucks like more than corn. We loose a 1/3 of our better bucks to our neighbors, a 1/3 make it through season- and we kill a 1/3.

Where I hunt, there is no such thing as a 135” 3 1/2 yr old. Maybe one out of ten 5 yr old would make 135”.

Not many perfect places - except maybe Native’s.

 

[roymunson]

You can high fence your place - or deal with it. I consider it part of the playing field. Maybe switch to another bait that bucks like more than corn. We loose a 1/3 of our better bucks to our neighbors, a 1/3 make it through season- and we kill a 1/3.

Where I hunt, there is no such thing as a 135” 3 1/2 yr old. Maybe one out of ten 5 yr old would make 135”.

Not many perfect places - except maybe Native’s.

nowhere is perfect. But we have genetics and habitat to rival Iowa and Illinois... We just can't get our age class up to snuff...

And I can't/won't be able to financially out compete some of the neighbors.

 

[FarmerDan]

Sometimes I wear a blaze orange (or camo) hat. Sometimes I wear others or none at all. As a hunter my initial reaction is to hold my nose to hunting over a bait pile. Then I take off my hat and think, if only for myself, "wait a minute." Here in Virginia it's illegal to hunt over bait, but we have a deer season in some places that starts the first Saturday in October and ends the first Saturday in January - in at least half the state. It's followed by an urban archery season of nearly 3-months around some major high population density areas. To pile onto that, we buy deer tags in a block - five at a time. Use all of those and one and buy more.

Is this our Ohio corn pile?

My perception is, no matter where you hunt it's extremely difficult to get a buck into the desired age class however you want to define it.

So, my question - is if baiting were outlawed...and let's assume for the sake or argument and discussion...compliance ensues...what changes? I'm going to suggest that the mission to keep the deer herd in balance remains the same as it should be in my opinion. Sure, as a hunter I want lots of deer, but the number one objective of a majority of deer hunters is to harvest a deer. However, as a forest owner I want the herd balanced. I willing to accept balance. Same for being a crop producer. The insurance companies and anyone who drives wants to minimize deer-vehicle collisions for obvious reasons.

Kill deer. Any deer. So, I'm at odds with myself over the issue.

I think I will just leave it hang there. And give a shout to Roy for recycling a thought provoking thread!

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Sometimes I wear a blaze orange (or camo) hat. Sometimes I wear others or none at all. As a hunter my initial reaction is to hold my nose to hunting over a bait pile. Then I take off my hat and think, if only for myself, "wait a minute." Here in Virginia it's illegal to hunt over bait, but we have a deer season in some places that starts the first Saturday in October and ends the first Saturday in January - in at least half the state. It's followed by an urban archery season of nearly 3-months around some major high population density areas. To pile onto that, we buy deer tags in a block - five at a time. Use all of those and one and buy more.

Is this our Ohio corn pile?

My perception is, no matter where you hunt it's extremely difficult to get a buck into the desired age class however you want to define it.

So, my question - is if baiting were outlawed...and let's assume for the sake or argument and discussion...compliance ensues...what changes? I'm going to suggest that the mission to keep the deer herd in balance remains the same as it should be in my opinion. Sure, as a hunter I want lots of deer, but the number one objective of a majority of deer hunters is to harvest a deer. However, as a forest owner I want the herd balanced. I willing to accept balance. Same for being a crop producer. The insurance companies and anyone who drives wants to minimize deer-vehicle collisions for obvious reasons.

Kill deer. Any deer. So, I'm at odds with myself over the issue.

I think I will just leave it hang there. And give a shout to Roy for recycling a thought provoking thread!

It’s a fair thought. Anecdotally I think it would potential protect more young bucks. A 110-120” 8 point is apparently like crack to a Biden in my neck of the woods. Those deer are generally 2.5 maybe 3.5 in some cases. 2.5 year old bucks are dumb. 3.5 are just slightly less dumb but definitely not smart. They lose their mind over a corn pile. So they are low hanging fruit. Maybe with the loss of bait those deer make it? Maybe not but it’s a chance I’m willing to take!

 

[Native Hunter]

You can high fence your place - or deal with it. I consider it part of the playing field. Maybe switch to another bait that bucks like more than corn. We loose a 1/3 of our better bucks to our neighbors, a 1/3 make it through season- and we kill a 1/3.

Where I hunt, there is no such thing as a 135” 3 1/2 yr old. Maybe one out of ten 5 yr old would make 135”.

Not many perfect places - except maybe Native’s.

I guess you forgot about our 2.5 year old double droptine getting shot by a neighbor last year. Just saying........

 

[SwampCat]

I guess you forgot about our 2.5 year old double droptine getting shot by a neighbor last year. Just saying........

Ok - then if Native’s place is not perfect, nobody’s is.

I have a neighbor with almost 1300 acres. There are bucks that travel his place, my place, and his other neighbor. Even if you owned 10,000 acres - some of the bucks are going to cross property lines. I have a neighbor with 1400 acres under high fence. Animals regularly escape that fenced area. Holes under the fence, trees across the fence, failing to secure the gate, flooding. It has its benefits - axis are fine eating.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Gone…by a guy who has shot bigger deer. Why!?!?! He had such potential

 

[SwampCat]

It’s a fair thought. Anecdotally I think it would potential protect more young bucks. A 120” 8 point is apparently like crack to a Biden in my neck of the woods. Those deer are generally 2.5 maybe 3.5 in some cases. 2.5 year old bucks are dumb. 3.5 are just slightly less dumb but definitely not smart. They lose their mind over a corn pile. So they are low hanging fruit. Maybe with the loss of bait those deer make it? Maybe not but it’s a chance I’m willing to take!

Our G&F dept sets harvest goals. The fact that they allow baiting to help hunters reach the harvest goals pretty well tells you baiting makes deer easier to kill. I have seen nothing that would indicate baiting makes deer harder to kill. I would love for baiting to be illegal - as long as food plots were still legal

 

[BenAllgood]

I don't have any concrete data of how small an area you can do it on or how long it takes to get there, but you can definitely get some mega giants routinely on a sanctuary type property surrounded by baiting and brown it's downers. I've seen it enough times to believe it.

 

[roymunson]

View attachment 54781
Gone…by a guy who has shot bigger deer. Why!?!?! He had such potential

that hurts my heart

I'm convinced I can shoot just about any 3 year old on the property with the use of corn. Most of our 3 year olds are big enough to look good to 80% of the hunters out there, and dumb enough to get killed by 70% of them.

My proudest buck was this fall's. We watched him for 2-3years and I know he was 6. he scored 134" and i'm tickled.
But some day I wanna kill a 180" 6 year old.

 

[SwampCat]

View attachment 54781
Gone…by a guy who has shot bigger deer. Why!?!?! He had such potential

I am curious how old you think that deer is. I hesitate to guess ages from deer outside my local area - as I am usually wrong. From the size of the brisket and the straight lines on the chest into the stomach - I would guess that deer a 4 1/2 - at least - in my hunting grounds. How old do you guess him?

 

[hunts_with_stick]

Isn't putting a food plot in similar to baiting? I mean, both are food for wildlife. Foodplots are probably a lot more costly. IDK, I have no interest in putting in a food plot. I have also lost interest in putting out corn. I was thinking, why am I spending the money for this?

 

[hunts_with_stick]

That being said, I have planted a ton of apple and pear trees. For both people and wildlife consumption.

 

[Bill]

I am curious how old you think that deer is. I hesitate to guess ages from deer outside my local area - as I am usually wrong. From the size of the brisket and the straight lines on the chest into the stomach - I would guess that deer a 4 1/2 - at least - in my hunting grounds. How old do you guess him?

Mid November, that deer is pumped up for the rut. I could be wrong but I see 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 with loads of potential.

He’s what dreams are made of at 6 1/2.

 

[Native Hunter]

Mid November, that deer is pumped up for the rut. I’m could be wrong but I see 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 with loads of potential.

He’s what dreams are made of at 6 1/2.

Agree 100% and lean toward 2 1/2 based on my observations of KY deer.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

that hurts my heart

I'm convinced I can shoot just about any 3 year old on the property with the use of corn. Most of our 3 year olds are big enough to look good to 80% of the hunters out there, and dumb enough to get killed by 70% of them.

My proudest buck was this fall's. We watched him for 2-3years and I know he was 6. he scored 134" and i'm tickled.
But some day I wanna kill a 180" 6 year old.

Yeah I love a huge rack but age is super impressive to me. To kill one 6 is to kill a warrior. Good job.