What is the mental dynamic involved

Howboutthemdawgs

5 year old buck +
In shooting small bucks. This is not a bash post at all, I’m intrigued by the mental makeup of hunting decisions. I see people all the time shoot immature bucks as opposed to a doe and for the life of me I cannot figure this decision out. Im talking deer where the antlers are sawed off and thrown in the corner of the garage and never looked at again. The drive to fill a buck tag as if it’s some arbitrary goalline is interesting to me. Is it a pride thing? A skill (or lack thereof thing)? A fear of failure if someone doesn’t fill a buck tag? A I just want to be done and drink thing? I’m thinking of my neighbors, they shot 2 deer they won’t mount in a top area of the country for big buck potential. Why??? We have so many damn does if you need meat. Heck i saw both of those deer in bow range and they didn’t have a clue I was in the world yet I’ve been busted by several old nanny does this season. Tell my which one is more weary and a bigger “trophy”. I know to each their own, if its legal why do you care, yadda yadda, but I think all of us hunters would love to sit in the woods and see top end representations of mature deer in our area, yet we can’t get out of our own way. It hurts my head to try to rationalize so im curious if anyone has some explanations.
 
Buck only zone where I’ve hunted for the last 10 years. If you are not allowed to shoot a doe, and don’t want to eat tag soup, a guy will end up shooting a small buck.


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Buck only zone where I’ve hunted for the last 10 years. If you are not allowed to shoot a doe, and don’t want to eat tag soup, a guy will end up shooting a small buck.


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That makes some sense there. I definitely get that dynamic. I will say that has to be a unique one across the whitetails range
 
In shooting small bucks. This is not a bash post at all, I’m intrigued by the mental makeup of hunting decisions. I see people all the time shoot immature bucks as opposed to a doe and for the life of me I cannot figure this decision out. Im talking deer where the antlers are sawed off and thrown in the corner of the garage and never looked at again. The drive to fill a buck tag as if it’s some arbitrary goalline is interesting to me. Is it a pride thing? A skill (or lack thereof thing)? A fear of failure if someone doesn’t fill a buck tag? A I just want to be done and drink thing? I’m thinking of my neighbors, they shot 2 deer they won’t mount in a top area of the country for big buck potential. Why??? We have so many damn does if you need meat. Heck i saw both of those deer in bow range and they didn’t have a clue I was in the world yet I’ve been busted by several old nanny does this season. Tell my which one is more weary and a bigger “trophy”. I know to each their own, if its legal why do you care, yadda yadda, but I think all of us hunters would love to sit in the woods and see top end representations of mature deer in our area, yet we can’t get out of our own way. It hurts my head to try to rationalize so im curious if anyone has some explanations.


I shoot small bucks! Today, things have almost reversed from when I was growing up. Back then folks looked down on folks who shot does. Deer numbers were low in my part of the state at the time. You could shot 1 deer per year. In order to shoot a doe, you had to enter a county lottery (one county at a time) and pay a fee. Doe season was after buck season, so if you shot a buck, your doe tag was void. Folks would much rather shoot a buck, any buck, than a doe.

Today, young buck are starting to take the place of does in the general ethic. Folks are starting to look down on others who shoot young bucks.

So, why do I shoot young bucks? Why not? Well, it depends.

In order to have an impact on age structure you need scale. In some places, there are regulations that impose antler restrictions which help. With no such restrictions, you probably need to have cooperation on a minimum of 1,000 acres on average to impact age structure by letting young bucks walk. We only own about 400 at the pine farm and have another 400 of adjoining land that are intentionally or unintentionally cooperating. Given that, I, and other experienced hunters on our farm choose to let young bucks walk. We target 3 1/2 year old and older bucks. However, we also have competing objectives. One other objective is to introduce young hunters to the sport. We let them shoot any deer they want. While we are light on scale, we are still trying to do QDM with, at least, some minor success.

We purchased retirement property about 15 minutes from the farm. We have two 8 acre lots. I got 2 neighbor with 20 acres and a new one with 60. The rest of the land is broken into smaller parcels and it is between suburban and rural somewhere. The habitat is very good for our deer numbers. There is plenty of open planted land, hardwoods for fall acorns and some clear-cuts nearby. We could use more deer in this area. We get 3 buck tags in my state. If I have the option to shoot a young buck or a doe on this property, I'll choose the young buck.

Why?

- Saving the doe increases the population which is well below the BCC in this area.
- For the same amount of processing work, I get more meat
- There is no way to improve age structure without a much broader antler restriction in the area.

I always save one buck tag for a true shooter and I can't remember a season when I burned all three. Doe tags are unlimited for all practical purposes.

I have no qualms about shooting any deer that fills my objectives in the particular situation.

Thanks,

Jack
 
Gotta add
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This day will go down as one of my favorite hunting experiences of all time. Opening day of riffle season. The year we found out dad had cancer. Wouldn't trade the feeling and memory for the world.

But, in hindsight, guess we all should have held out for "trophies" to make it really special.
 
We can all find reasons to justify why we do or don’t shoot this or that.

If someone shoots a legal deer and has a smile on their face, go shake their hand and congratulate them.

It can be hard to do, I know.


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Cause it's a blast.

Honestly not sure why anyone gives a rip what anybody else shoots.
Cause we all share the neighborhood. So decisions neighbors make affect other neighbors. I’m just curious of why people do it. Just as I’m curious why people pass on certain deer. It’s helps understand decisions people make and maybe a person can have a better understanding of what makes a neighbor or another hunter tick.
 
We don't have many deer around. If you want one and it's in range you better take it, buck or doe. Pass it and you may not have another chance til next year or the year after.
 
I just dragged my 75 year old dad’s 3 point for 2 hours out of a swamp. Did I enjoy this? Hell no, it was brutal. To answer your question he sits behind the house and shoots the first deer he sees. Been that way for a few years now. He thinks this year is a great success because it is opening day and he doesn’t need to hunt any more. Would he like to shoot a big buck? Of coarse, but it better be the first one he sees.
 
Cause we all share the neighborhood. So decisions neighbors make affect other neighbors. I’m just curious of why people do it. Just as I’m curious why people pass on certain deer. It’s helps understand decisions people make and maybe a person can have a better understanding of what makes a neighbor or another hunter tick.

That is why we have a political system. We balance our individual desires with how it impacts others. We vote in representatives that may appoint others to boards and commissions and such that put together regulations. In our state, there is a two year regulation cycle. Every other year, the DWR holds public meetings and solicits comments on proposed regulation changes. They try to balance hunter desires with biological factors and such and based on that, the board votes in or out each proposed change. When enough folks in an area push to restrict harvest based on antler size, regulations are adopted regarding that.

I don't find anything inherently good or bad about shooting any particular deer. It all depends on objectives. There are folks who like to organize that have put together voluntary QDM cooperatives with neighbors. Your neighbors are different than mine. The only way to understand a neighbor's personal perspective is to get to know them. I don't think you will find a single answer to your question. It will be a variety of answers.
 
I just returned from my second year of Deer Camp with some "Crawford County" (Missouri) old timers. On my personal property I have been practicing QDMA since purchasing the place--and to date have limited my harvest to does for management purposes. At "Deer Camp" the adage of "Brown it's Down" is a practice that prevails for most hunters participating in this annual ritual. This small 20 acre private property has been host to deer camp for many generations. It is surrounded by thousands of acres of state & federal property. The cabin has been on the property well over 100 years. While I may not agree with their harvest--two button bucks, three spikes and one doe during my three days at camp, all were legal animals. No one forced me to pull a trigger on a fawn or button buck, although last year I harvested a 2 1/2 year old buck.

The mental makeup for these hunters is "food on the table." Once shot, the deer are processed and packaged by the younger folks, while the older folks prepare the meals. They joke about their "Spoon & Crockpot" deer and are aware of the movement towards harvesting older bucks. But, for these hunters, Deer Camp is once a year event using the same 8x8 raised blinds used for many years. Likely, few mature bucks frequent the location, but each year the group harvests eight to twelve deer--mostly fawns and yearlings--which comes out to --about 1.5 deer per person. This meat provides protein for their freezers and great Deer Camp memories.

As the only non-Crawford County hunter invited to Deer Camp, I am privileged to participate in a generational tradition that focuses on family, traditions and self-sufficiency--even if the harvest goals are not ones I personally share.




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I only have the 14 acres that I live on, those girls are my savings acount, if things go really bad well?
 
Not everyone has the same goals. I personally don't care at all about horns. I want the meat. I shot a yearling this morning for 2 reasons, 1. Because i havent pulled the trigger in 2 years and wantwd to blow the dust out of the barrel, 2. Because now the boys can have at it and i can devote whatever i have to that.
A big buck is every hunters dream. Maybe im weird because its not mine i guess.
 
There are many different reasons, and I think they all come down to one thing: that individual doesn’t really care about shooting mature bucks. Hunters who are serious about shooting mature bucks know you absolutely have to pass the small ones and commit to that practice to the point that they are willing to eat tag soup. The majority of hunters don’t care that much and will fill the tag at the first opportunity. Period. And they’ll shoot small bucks for any number of reasons, some I can understand and sympathize with, others I don’t agree with but that’s the nature of deer hunting. These are wild free range animals, with lots of hunters pursuing those animals for varying reasons.

Hell I wish everyone would pass that 140” 10 pointer 3 year old and shoot the 5 year old stubby 8 point, but if they’re both standing out there next to each other, most hunters will shoot the 10 point with oodles of potential. I guess I have to be happy that most forkhorns around me get a pass.


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Because they like to kill stuff! Lol.

Some folks have limited time - they don’t want to wait for the “big one” to step out. Work, Kids, Activities, Plowing Snow….etc.

Some folks don’t really care - can’t eat the antlers. It is cool to hunt in an area with mature bucks running around doing mature buck things, but not all of us have that opportunity.

Shot 3 deer this year with a bow (1 in VT, 2 in Ohio, 2 does, 1 small buck) and my 11 year old son shot 1 (small button buck). All public land, (leaving my 100 acres for my dad and maybe my 9 year old daughter to harvest a doe).

I shot the doe first on a hunting trip to Ohio, and probably should have waited, but a 4pt walked by and I just couldn’t help myself. Lol. Seriously though I’ve shot nothing there last 2 years in bow season, the double up felt good. I’m there for 5 days, so not a lot of time to be selective.

I really don’t think I’m a good enough of a hunter to be passing up deer. I need about 50 more deer under my belt before I start hunting big bucks.

We have 1 buck on our private that I’d shoot,(10pt 2/3 years old) and we need more deer in Northern NY, so I don’t need to shoot does. No need for me to go over there and shoot young bucks. Leave that to the kids and grandpas.

I think most hunters are more selective depending on the situation. One buck limits and early antler-less seasons help.
 
I will add this for newer hunters. I found trigger control and bowhunting to be one of the best teachers when it comes to hunting. When I was young and lived in an area with few opportunities to harvest deer, I jumped an any opportunity as they were few and far between. When I took up bowhunting something fundamental happened. Since I needed to have deer 20-30 yards away for a shot, I now had long periods to observe deer out of bow range that would have been killed immediately had I been gun hunting. I learned an immeasurable amount about deer behavior. As I moved to areas with higher deer populations and exercised trigger control during gun season, I began learning even more about deer and how they relate to each other and the terrain and vegetation.

While this has nothing to do with what deer you decided to shoot, the fact that you don't shoot at your first opportunity can make you a much better deer hunter.

Thakns,

Jack
 
I will qualify this answer by saying I wont personally kill a buck unless it scores 130 plus - in a region where the average 5 plus year old buck scores 104 B&C. Kentucky has some of the best quality deer in the country. You cant assume everywhere is like KY. Kentucky 3 yr old deer probably average much larger than our 6 yr olds. There is so much more to deer hunting than antlers - and the answers to your question would comprise a long list. In short, things like buck potential, property potential, time to hunt, reasons to hunt, financial status, other interests - and on and on.
 
I don’t think there is much to read into the mentally. Of it all. I’ve hunted here in NY for 47 years now. The majority of bucks harvested is, and always has been 1.5 year olds. Usually 45-55 percent by volume LOL. almost the entire rest of the buck harvest is 2.5 year olds. There has never been an interest by the average hunter for anything but that. Way it’s always been here anyways. Guys looking at 3.5 and up are almost non factors in buck hunter numbers.
 
Cause it's a blast.

Honestly not sure why anyone gives a rip what anybody else shoots.
It’s also a blast to pass deer and keep hunting. Shoot the first buck that moves and it’s a short season !! Especially in a one buck limit state.

I don’t care what you shoot, but honestly passing deer is one of my favorite things about deer hunting… especially archery !!

It’s a blast to have young bucks, medium bucks, even a nice one under your stand and you just get to watch him !!
 
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