Grow Lights - Gardens on the Mind

[trampledbyturtles]

Looking to expand the garden three fold this spring, an have always just bought my starts from the local greenhouse.
But there are varieties of peppers an tomatos I would like to try that are not available locally.
Plus there is just a little more satisfaction in growing your own from start.

Have tried starting seeds indoor prior with no artificial light system, complete bust.

I know there are few on here that like to garden, or start their trees indoor under grow lights.

So any recommendations as far as brand/set up.
Looking to purchase sometime this week to get set up in time for spring.
Thz

 

[Northbound]

If you have time and patience and live in a state with medical marijuana you could try a grow store. I stopped at one in Michigan as we thought about getting a light set up to start vegetables. Problem was the hippy worker was so slow it would have been spring before he explained the light systems. Think he over medicated himself that day

 

[trampledbyturtles]

Nope, conservative state here.

Looking at amazon, live out in the boonies as is, need it delivered to the door, hence the desire to triple the size of the garden.
thz though

 

[yoderjac]

I don't have a good answer for vegetables. For starting trees indoors, fluorescent shop lights are pretty cost effective. Light energy diminishes with the distance squared. Hot lights like sodium need to be hung far away. They are expensive but put out a lot of light (and consume a lot of energy thus putting out a lot of heat). Much of the light energy is lost over that longer distance. I'm not saying that inexpensive shop lights rigged to be adjustable and kept a few inches from the trees are better. I'm saying they provide sufficient light and are much less expensive to buy and operate. Keep in mind, this is for starting trees indoors:

• Trees are often grown from nuts and larger seed that has a lot of stored energy.
• The fraction of a tree's life spent in doors under lights is tiny.
• A seedling tree has only one part of the life cycle, vegetative growth.
• The light color (K) has little impact on the overall tree for such a short percentage of life cycle.

As for vegetables, they spend a lot larger percentage of their lives indoors. Fluorescent shop lights may be fine, but I've never tried it and just don't know.

One aside, I use fluorescent shop lights for trees because they were the most cost effective when I built my setup. The price point on LEDs and configurations available have changed significantly since then. If I were starting from scratch today, I would do another analysis and LEDs in some configuration may win since they are cool too. The key is lumens per dollar with the distance to the plants as short as possible.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[ToddG]

I am using the led grow lights from amazon to start my tomatoes. They are working out better then expected. I think I started them to soon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01IVQ96KY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[trampledbyturtles]

Those look pretty wicked Todd. How many starter flats can you fit under a light?

 

[ToddG]

Those look pretty wicked Todd. How many starter flats can you fit under a light?

The starter flats I have are 15-1/4" L x 10" W and it takes one light per plat. The lights would normally do more but I like to keep it within 2" of seedlings so they don't get tall and spindly.

 

[yoderjac]

I am using the led grow lights from amazon to start my tomatoes. They are working out better then expected. I think I started them to soon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01IVQ96KY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Couldn't find anything on the link about how many lumens the output. Do you have that info?

 

[ToddG]

Couldn't find anything on the link about how many lumens the output. Do you have that info?

Here is what I have:

Brand Name: Roleadro
Series: Grow light panel series--HY-MD-D169-S
Red leds: 117pcs 660nm; Blue leds: 52pcs 450nm
Spectrum Ratio: 2.25:1
Actual power:25.2±5% watt
Lumen: 4546.2 Lux
Size:276*276*14mm
Weight: 0.95KG
Input voltage: AC 85-265v
Working Frequency: 50-60hz
Lifespan: 50000 hrs
Certificates: CE, FCC, ROHS

 

[yoderjac]

Todd,

The conversion from lux to lumens includes area and is generally measured with a lux meter. For a ball park, lets say are growing area is 3' x 4' or 12 sqft. The 4546 lux would be about 5000 lumens. A typical 4' fluorescent bulb is 2900 lumens and there are 2 in a shop light fixture or around 6000 lumens. For my seedling trees, I use 3 or 4 fixtures to cover a 3'x4' growing area. So they are putting out 3 to 4 times the amount of light intensity for the same growing area.

Keep in mind, for trees, wavelength (frequency) is not really a factor, but it may be for vegies. The spectrum listed for a fluorescent bulb is a broad average and the amount of light at any specific wavelength could be anything.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[KDdid]

I’ve been starting my veggies using the “winter sowing “ method-I’ve had good results, and the plants are already hardened off when you are ready to transplant them.

The plants I start this way seem to take off and grow faster than the ones I buy.


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[ToddG]

I’ve been starting my veggies using the “winter sowing “ method-I’ve had good results, and the plants are already hardened off when you are ready to transplant them.

The plants I start this way seem to take off and grow faster than the ones I buy.


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This looks promising. I may give it a try.

 

[KDdid]

It’s a lot of fun. Basically you put the jugs out in the garden in late March, (I’m in zone 6, check local listings) and when they get enough warmth they germinate and slowly grow. You do have to be diligent if you get freezing nights when the plants are big enough to touch the plastic (cover the jugs with old sheets) or give them some shade if you have an early heat wave. I’ve started hundreds of tomatoes and peppers this way the last two years. Also a good way to start flowers.



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[trampledbyturtles]

To clarify a bit.

The reason I'm looking into a light system is to hopefully solve a few issues I am currently facing.

With the relatively poor soil I am working with, (still in the process of building) I am running a deep mulch system.
Large seeds like bean, peas, squash, zucchini an the like have no issues getting up an going.

Beets, lettuce, spinach, kale an the like on the other hand, due not far well both to insect but primarily bird pressure.
The idea was to start tender seeds indoors in flats, let them germinate under ideal conditions in the warm house.
Then move under lights for 3-4 days to allow some root formation, then move and plug outdoors.

As the season progresses I would just start new flats an plant out accordingly.

Plan is to build a greenhouse this summer, and use that next year to solve these issues, until then I need to find a quick temporary solution.
Do not feel like having my beet crop wiped out for a second consecutive year.

Edit: Zone 4, usually the earliest I can risk getting anything into the garden is May 10th - 5th is pushing it, have lost multiple tomato an pepper plantings in the past trying to get a jump start.

 

[KDdid]

To clarify a bit.

The reason I'm looking into a light system is to hopefully solve a few issues I am currently facing.

With the relatively poor soil I am working with, (still in the process of building) I am running a deep mulch system.
Large seeds like bean, peas, squash, zucchini an the like have no issues getting up an going.

Beets, lettuce, spinach, kale an the like on the other hand, due not far well both to insect but primarily bird pressure.
The idea was to start tender seeds indoors in flats, let them germinate under ideal conditions in the warm house.
Then move under lights for 3-4 days to allow some root formation, then move and plug outdoors.

As the season progresses I would just start new flats an plant out accordingly.

Plan is to build a greenhouse this summer, and use that next year to solve these issues, until then I need to find a quick temporary solution.
Do not feel like having my beet crop wiped out for a second consecutive year.

Edit: Zone 4, usually the earliest I can risk getting anything into the garden is May 10th - 5th is pushing it, have lost multiple tomato an pepper plantings in the past trying to get a jump start.

Yep, I’m familiar with deep mulch-I’ve gone to laying down potting soil in rows dug into the mulch to get small seeds started, downside is that if you have any grass/weed seed in your mulch it will sprout where the seed/soil contact occurs. I like the idea of seedling “plugs” that you can drop into the mulch. I also get some slug damage, they love the deep mulch habitat. Sluggo works pretty well, and is appropriate for organic systems. Bummer about the bird damage, though. I might try a floating row cover for insect protection.


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