end all decision, wheat or rye?

[bbcoach]

I've planted WR, WW, Oats and Trit, in mixes and by themselves, and I don't see any difference with any of them. When the leaves fall off the trees and agricultural crops are gone, any of these grains will be a major draw for wildlife. I've had 6 to 8 inch tall green mixes mowed to the ground, within a month, come January and February. They also rebound in early spring and give deer a quality food source before spring green up. My choice is use a mix because deer are browsers and eat different things. In colder climates, that have frosts in September, I would eliminate the oats or not plant just oats by themselves, as oats will winter kill when the temps hit 20-25 degrees. IMO with PH's above 6, grains are Great, have their place in our food plots and provide quality nutrition well into early spring for our deer. Paul Knox aka Lickcreek / Doubletree has some GREAT reads on rye vs winter wheat and they can be found on this forum under the Lickcreek thread. Very informing.

 

[sagittarius]

Keep it simple, keep it cheap. Spring planting - bin run feeder oats. Late summer/Fall - bin run feeder wheat(usually winter wheat). Cheap, great germination. No weed issues from the seed, just normal from soil tillage. Wheat or oats is either a nurse crop for clover, or just a temporary filler, ground cover, before next plot. By planting a temporary mono plot of grain, even for a couple months, you can use a broadleaf weed killer such as 2,4-D to control problem weeds before next planting.

 

[Ben Glantz]

I have pretty crappy sandy soil. When I first started using this ground for food plots, PH was about 5. We have it up to a little over 6 now. I have been planting winter rye, oats, clover,peas and radish and for the past couple years. The plots have improved a lot from barley being able to grow the WR to now we have nice plots of clover. The WR has been adding OM and helping the clover come along. I am also using WR in my wooded plots with really poor soil and at the very least, I have something green in the woods in November.

 

[mikmaze]

winter kill on oats is a 100% thing here where I plot, for me oats are a spring thing, nurse crop, cheap filler. Never tried trit, Biggest goals are winter draw and food for the deer after all else is brown, and the addition of om to the soils which for me are largely red clay based.

some great info so far, without reading the lc thread for days, this is what I wanted, best info in the first 2 pages.

wish we could add a wiki section to the first post that could be edited by users till perfect, then locked once done.

 

[nitro27]

I like a mix of oats and WR. I've watched deer walk thru the rye to feed on oats and vice versa. So I figured why not plant together.

 

[Tree Spud]

winter kill on oats is a 100% thing here where I plot, for me oats are a spring thing, nurse crop, cheap filler. Never tried trit, Biggest goals are winter draw and food for the deer after all else is brown, and the addition of om to the soils which for me are largely red clay based.

some great info so far, without reading the lc thread for days, this is what I wanted, best info in the first 2 pages.

wish we could add a wiki section to the first post that could be edited by users till perfect, then locked once done.

Well that wish will never be realized ... not possible when opinions count as much as experience.

Always best to define your goal or end result you are trying to achieve,.

Read LC's thread again ... the answer is there. It is also here, just clouded by opinions.

 

[Peplin Creek]

Pick either or and add Oats. I think oats are really strong draw and then once vegetation starts dying in the fall the rye or wheat will shine. It's really up to you results will be pretty close to the same.

 

[rocksnstumps]

Well that wish will never be realized ... not possible when opinions count as much as experience.

Always best to define your goal or end result you are trying to achieve,.

Read LC's thread again ... the answer is there. It is also here, just clouded by opinions.

Or go to Iowawhitetail site and read the first two pages of dbltree posting on this topic where Paul posted before he carried over the same info to other forums with the Lickcreek handle much later. I like going back to the source material myself.

 

[Catscratch]

Easy one for me as I've planted them sided by side several times and on multiple properties. My conclusion; deer like to east winter wheat and don't like to eat winter rye. (as said somewhere above; site, location, and individual deer preference play a role).

Both stay green all winter.
Both produce seed the next summer (I planted awnless wheat and it was a hit this summer! They mowed the seed heads down.).
Both will grow in the bed of your truck.
Neither need fertilizer or lime where I'm at.
Deer walk through WR to get to the side of the field with WW before dropping their head down and grazing.
As Paul pointed out; WR has a LOT of benefits for the soil and I certainly don't leave WR out of my mix... but if I want deer to eat in my winter plots I plant WW.

I realize my experinces are different than other peoples so take my observations with a grain of salt. But do know I've done the side by side plantings many times and this is what I've found to be the case here. But I also found many yrs ago that my deer don't like PTT. Turnips are a waste of space on my places and everyone else seems to have great luck with them.

 

[Catscratch]

Here are a couple of pics of a doe eating the Awnless wheat heads. They eat the head whole and just leave the stem. I've always known that deer eat wheat seed but I was really happy with the summer use the Awnless produced this yr.

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[Nova]

Hands down winter rye on our farm. Both get eaten equally, but the added benefits of rye make it a no brainer for me.

 

[Tree Spud]

Or go to Iowawhitetail site and read the first two pages of dbltree posting on this topic where Paul posted before he carried over the same info to other forums with the Lickcreek handle much later. I like going back to the source material myself.

That is what I was referring to. Paul Know aka LickCreek, aka DblTree, and ake LC here ... pretty much created several threads that have become phenomenal guides for commons topics raised here.

You can also read LC's tread on cereal grains on this site ...
http://www.habitat-talk.com/index.php?threads/cereal-grains-for-whitetails.1381/

 

[Tree Spud]

Easy one for me as I've planted them sided by side several times and on multiple properties. My conclusion; deer like to east winter wheat and don't like to eat winter rye. (as said somewhere above; site, location, and individual deer preference play a role).

Both stay green all winter.
Both produce seed the next summer (I planted awnless wheat and it was a hit this summer! They mowed the seed heads down.).
Both will grow in the bed of your truck.
Neither need fertilizer or lime where I'm at.
Deer walk through WR to get to the side of the field with WW before dropping their head down and grazing.
As Paul pointed out; WR has a LOT of benefits for the soil and I certainly don't leave WR out of my mix... but if I want deer to eat in my winter plots I plant WW.

I realize my experinces are different than other peoples so take my observations with a grain of salt. But do know I've done the side by side plantings many times and this is what I've found to be the case here. But I also found many yrs ago that my deer don't like PTT. Turnips are a waste of space on my places and everyone else seems to have great luck with them.

Cat ... I think that is the point, there is no one size fits all answer.

For us in the north, we broadcast WR in early Sept. It will never reach full growth before the snows come, but the young green sprouts that are 5-8" are sometimes the only green forage come late Oct to Nov. It then greens up first thing in the spring along with the clover providing early found source.

 

[WTNUT]

I see no reason to not add winter wheat into the winter rye, and also toss in some oats.

Winter wheat also grows late into the fall, it also comes in rather early spring as well, just as well as the winter rye the years I planted them together. Also winter wheat isn't as hard to deal with in the spring, because it doesn't grow 5 feet tall. I like winter rye for the weed suppression, and I like the OM it adds, and I always add it to my plots in the fall, but it isn't a huge draw, so I don't put it in as a sole planting. I will either have a mixture, or seed winter rye into an existing standing crop.


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I have struggled with choosing between rye, wheat and oats for 17 years now when it comes to foodplots. First, always think about why you are planting it and your goals. I have always mixed a cereal gain in with a new clover plot to provide forage and quick growth taking pressure off the clover. Then the following spring I allow it to go to seed so that it germinates in the fall and provides a food source after the clover goes dormant. I am far enough south that all three grow well and all three will easily survive our winters. I use to prefer rye and have planted many test plots of each. I preferred it for two reasons, it germinates in colder soil than the other two if necessary and MY deer MAYBE NOT YOUR DEER seemed to prefer it late winter (not necessarily any other time). However, I have now decided for me the best is a mix of all three - rye, wheat and oats. When I only plant rye, the second spring and thereafter the rye is way too thick. It literally chokes the clover to death or near death. A 3 way mix provides more variety which deer seem to like. My two cents for free.


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[IkemanTx]

I have struggled with choosing between rye, wheat and oats for 17 years now when it comes to foodplots. First, always think about why you are planting it and your goals. I have always mixed a cereal gain in with a new clover plot to provide forage and quick growth taking pressure off the clover. Then the following spring I allow it to go to seed so that it germinates in the fall and provides a food source after the clover goes dormant. I am far enough south that all three grow well and all three will easily survive our winters. I use to prefer rye and have planted many test plots of each. I preferred it for two reasons, it germinates in colder soil than the other two if necessary and MY deer MAYBE NOT YOUR DEER seemed to prefer it late winter (not necessarily any other time). However, I have now decided for me the best is a mix of all three - rye, wheat and oats. When I only plant rye, the second spring and thereafter the rye is way too thick. It literally chokes the clover to death or near death. A 3 way mix provides more variety which deer seem to like. My two cents for free.


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I was planning on buying straight WR this season for my cereal component. But, as mild as our winters are in Texas, I think the mixture would do well all the way through spring. Also, I found out recently that a local seed company does a WR/WW/Oats/peas mix for cheaper than I can buy/ship a bag of WR.
So all I need is a few pounds of clover and a pound of radishes to round it all out.


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[TreeDaddy]

Not sure where you are in north texas but check easttexasseedcompany in tyler,texas

May be worth a 1.5- 2 hr drive

They have everything you describe

bill

 

[TreeDaddy]

But I also found many yrs ago that my deer don't like PTT. Turnips are a waste of space on my places and everyone else seems to have great luck with them.[/QUOTE]

My PTT plots were picturesque .... They stayed that way because no one touched them but me

I stopped planting brassicas 2 years ago

Its still hard to beat oats in east texas(bob,jerry,tom,mo,larry,curly,etc) for attraction

bill

 

[mikmaze]

catscratch, looks like your doe is wearing a toupee....

so funny yesterday down working plots, farmer took the oats off last week now the deer don't know what to do, field is just stubble, surprised to see as many out in it as I did, I think they were eating weeds. Turkeys were out looking for dropped grains. At this late date in zone 6b what do you hink the farmer would try for a late crop? quick corn? quick soy??

 

[Catscratch]

catscratch, looks like your doe is wearing a toupee....

so funny yesterday down working plots, farmer took the oats off last week now the deer don't know what to do, field is just stubble, surprised to see as many out in it as I did, I think they were eating weeds. Turkeys were out looking for dropped grains. At this late date in zone 6b what do you hink the farmer would try for a late crop? quick corn? quick soy??

Lol, she is easily recognizable!

Most guys here (I'm in 6) that double crop put short season beans in right after wheat harvest. I never see corn go in this late in the yr.

 

[mikmaze]

yeah, I hope he does beans. we are right at 100 days till frost here, I see corn with 85 days needed , am sure there are shorter day grow than that as well.

funny how you can recognize the toupe doe, by my folks house there was a pair of fawns about 10 years ago with long tails, now there is half the herd with this trait, seems almost double the length of the other deer.