Do you remember it being colder

[Howboutthemdawgs]

There’s a lot of truth in what you were saying. And that’s definitely why I keep an open mind about things. I think the duck scenario is multifaceted. I do believe there is a huge aspect that is pressure, a huge factor is also open water and food up north and one that is gaining a ton of traction is the genetic make up of the modern mallard has been so hybridized by pen raised preserve birds that they don’t act anything like a natural mallard. I linked a fascinating podcast by mossy oak that speaks to two researchers on this topic. It’s wild.

But yes the pressure in places like Arkansas is absolutely insane. My buddy sent me a video last week of them going down the White River in the dark and it was nothing but lights of other boats getting set up. Everyone has a 25k gator trax with a surface drive and led light bars and led interior lights and radios and social media account and $1000 waders. I’ve hunted the bayou meto when it was so bad there was a line for the boat ramp and people were parking down the street. We killed one wood duck.


But it’s my understanding even a 2 degree difference has huge impacts on flora and fauna. I have no idea if that’s true. And for the record I’m probably not willing to make any changes to my life based on a maybe this will bring down temps. But I’m also being open minded that maybe a couple billion people on a finite ball could possible impact the temperature.

And I absolutely hate that about Illinois. We keep lowering the bar to where a giant will be a 2.5 year 110” deer in a couple years unless you control 2000 acres

 

[omicron1792]

I'm curious to know where a person would sled in the Cities proper? Down by the G.F. Memorial?

Pretty sure nobody is riding a sled in the Cities and nobody has for many years. In the 'burbs? Sure, in high snow fall years. MN is not a high snowfall state, with the possible exception of the North shore.

We got 3” of snow in Alabama and we sledded the hell out of it. Ha

 

[omicron1792]

There’s a lot of truth in what you were saying. And that’s definitely why I keep an open mind about things. I think the duck scenario is multifaceted. I do believe there is a huge aspect that is pressure, a huge factor is also open water and food up north and one that is gaining a ton of traction is the genetic make up of the modern mallard has been so hybridized by pen raised preserve birds that they don’t act anything like a natural mallard. I linked a fascinating podcast by mossy oak that speaks to two researchers on this topic. It’s wild.

But yes the pressure in places like Arkansas is absolutely insane. My buddy sent me a video last week of them going down the White River in the dark and it was nothing but lights of other boats getting set up. Everyone has a 25k gator trax with a surface drive and led light bars and led interior lights and radios and social media account and $1000 waders. I’ve hunted the bayou meto when it was so bad there was a line for the boat ramp and people were parking down the street. We killed one wood duck.


But it’s my understanding even a 2 degree difference has huge impacts on flora and fauna. I have no idea if that’s true. And for the record I’m probably not willing to make any changes to my life based on a maybe this will bring down temps. But I’m also being open minded that maybe a couple billion people on a finite ball could possible impact the temperature.

And I absolutely hate that about Illinois. We keep lowering the bar to where a giant will be a 2.5 year 110” deer in a couple years unless you control 2000 acres

Why do you think the earth will stay static and not change? Serious question.

 

[omicron1792]

Guess I'm done with this thread. People can be intelligent and still deny that it's warmer. I'm in VT and we have: species that don't leave for the winter, new species who have migrated north, less snow, less ice, hotter summers, warmer winters, more extreme storms, stronger winds etc.
People will deny climate change while ignoring multiple years of drought.
I don't get it. I don't want the government in charge of every aspect of my life, but that won't make me deny both the data and what I see.

Someone thinks different than you so you walk away? That might be part of the problem. Hearing all sides is how an informed decision is made.

Climate change deniers have certainly heard both sides. No way not too….info on climate change is everywhere. The people on the other side are generally the ones that refuse to hear anything contrary to their set beliefs.

 

[homerj]

We got 3” of snow in Alabama and we sledded the hell out of it. Ha

People in Alabama own snowmobiles?

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Why do you think the earth will stay static and not change? Serious question.

100% I do. Science has shown that. It’s the rapid change that I’m not sure the cause. The sad thing is we will all be dead before we know who was right!

 

[Telemark]

Don't pike thrive in Alaska and all over Northern Canada?

Yes. They call them "jack" up there.

Northern pike have a circumpolar distribution, across Alaska and northern Canada, and from Scandinavia, through Siberia to the Russian Far East. It is very easy to establish new populations in water bodies that previously did not contain them.

 

[omicron1792]

100% I do. Science has shown that. It’s the rapid change that I’m not sure the cause. The sad thing is we will all be dead before we know who was right!

That I agree with.

I think the earth is warming. Just most likely from natural cycles. I think it is important humans protect and care for the earth, but in ways that uplift the actual humans living here on it.

 

[Telemark]

Does anyone actually deny that climate change exists? I thought it was well understood that climate change is a natural condition of the planet.

The issue I have with climate change hysteria is that a small group of people tell me if I just pay more money and stop traveling, I can stop climate change. First of all, I don't think climate change is nearly as big a problem as the Chicken Littles of the world say it is. Second, I don't think humans can stop it, because it is a natural condition of the planet. Also, the people hollering about climate change tend to be the worst offenders, which makes me think they are lying.

 

[homerj]

"Climate Czar" John Kerry's wife's plane emitted over 300 metric tons of carbon in the last 4 years. Meanwhile Kerry says climate change is an "existential crisis"...lol.

Look it up

 

[Mortenson]

Everything changes.

 

[omicron1792]

People in Alabama own snowmobiles?

Haha. I thought you meant me sitting on a sled, going down a hill. Think Christmas vacation. Haha

 

[Mortenson]

Sledded the hell out of it. Lol

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Hell, my toddlers have been sledding the hell out of 3" of snow in our front yard and some eager folks have even been hitting the snowmobile trail that is 40' from my yard. Cold snap in bound, forecasted high of -7 on monday..

 

[MadMadHoosier]

Does anyone actually deny that climate change exists? I thought it was well understood that climate change is a natural condition of the planet.

The issue I have with climate change hysteria is that a small group of people tell me if I just pay more money and stop traveling, I can stop climate change. First of all, I don't think climate change is nearly as big a problem as the Chicken Littles of the world say it is. Second, I don't think humans can stop it, because it is a natural condition of the planet. Also, the people hollering about climate change tend to be the worst offenders, which makes me think they are lying.

Totally agree! The earth has warmed and cooled, multiple times, without humans being around. IMO - this warming cycle, however long it last, is doubtful the result of human presence. It is even more doubtful that ANYTHING we humans might try to do could change this natural cycle. I feel anyone trying to place the blame on humans, obvious or not, has found a way to profit from global climate change hysteria. YMMV

 

[West_Fork]

Should be easy enough to provide a source for that claim...And by source I mean from a peer-reviewed journal that has an impact factor of 1 or more. Should be easy enough, right?

The vast majority of published studies show CO2 concentrations rise before temperatures. I am not even sure this is debatable at this point. It is like saying rain is more likely on cloudy days than sunny days.

Global warming preceded by increasing carbon dioxide concentrations during the last deglaciation - Nature

A reconstruction of global surface temperature is used to show that deglacial temperature is correlated with and generally lags carbon dioxide concentration, a result that contributes to the explanation of the temperature change that occurred at the end of the most recent ice age.

www.nature.com

View attachment 72988

Should be easy enough to provide a source for that claim...And by source I mean from a peer-reviewed journal that has an impact factor of 1 or more. Should be easy enough, right?

The vast majority of published studies show CO2 concentrations rise before temperatures. I am not even sure this is debatable at this point. It is like saying rain is more likely on cloudy days than sunny days.

Global warming preceded by increasing carbon dioxide concentrations during the last deglaciation - Nature

A reconstruction of global surface temperature is used to show that deglacial temperature is correlated with and generally lags carbon dioxide concentration, a result that contributes to the explanation of the temperature change that occurred at the end of the most recent ice age.

www.nature.com

View attachment 72988

Sorry buddy, but I cited Nature first and regardless you have got some splaining to do.

So it appears you are trying to support your position by demonstrating co2 controls temperatures, and thus changes in co2 lead to changes in temps. Right? Maybe go ahead and extrapolate that out to mean that co2 controls climate? Eh?

Being that you are a well versed expert on soil, carbon, and such you can explain in simple terms how this co2 leading temps work, correct?

What mechanism is it that is producing the co2 and leading to temperature changes? My (and others) understanding that during the last several hundred thousands of years or so, that this is driven primarily biologically and volcanically. My and others understanding is that the biological sources of co2 is constrained by climate (biological production).

So which came first? The climate change that led to changes (decreases) in biological production and change in co2, or did the change in co2 lead climate change and decreases in biological production? Is that dreaded positive feedback loop they have been warning us about? Or did a volcano erupt somewhere killing everything?

Either way, it does not work.

Your proxies are based on ice cores. Ice cores do not capture warm periods. Speleothems do capture warm periods, as well as biological production. Now look at this (the most resolute climate proxy known to man) and see how that fits with your "co2 is God" model.

Also notice the word in the caption of your graphic; "simulations." Those simulations do not take in to account the PDO, ENSO, AMOC, and I would be willing to be they do not take in to account orbital control. "simulations" are not evidence of anything but weak computing power and poor understanding.

According to Lachniet and others, the climate and climate change is controlled by changes in Earth's orbit at a scale of greater than 5,000 years. Changes in oscillations control changes in climate at scales less than 5,000 years and scales relevant to humans. All during this time, co2 is only along for the ride, and often shown to be completely decoupled from climate.

Do you know what else reconstructions from speleothems do? This:

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/A-2500-yr-rainfall-reconstruction-for-central-Mexico-and-comparison-to-cultural-change-d_fig3_236648672

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236648672_A_2400_yr_Mesoamerican_Rainfall_Reconstruction_Links_Climate_and_Cultural_Change

You and all the co2ist want to throw virgins in volcanoes again with your new age religion. That's god damned hilarious. CO2 isn't god.

 

[West_Fork]

By a raise of hands, who knows what this is?


A convective thunderstorm ejecting a huge amount of infrared energy in to space.

Warmer air increase evaporation.
Warmer air holds more moisture.
More moisture in the air is very likely to lead to more clouds.
More clouds mean more infrared energy is reflected in to space.


But if you give me your money, I will make the weather pleasant.
If you don't your kids will die.
Have a nice day!

 

[Buckly]

100% I do. Science has shown that. It’s the rapid change that I’m not sure the cause. The sad thing is we will all be dead before we know who was right!

That’s right, we’ll all be gone by then anyways. How long have people actually lived on the Earth? I’m not too concerned if people are here for only 900,000 years instead of a million. Pretty selfish I know. LOL. I’m of the opinion that the only answer to some of these people is for all the humans to evacuate the Earth and then it will be saved. But, then who’s going to manage the cows? They’ll end up destroying the planet without us.

 

[Barndog56]

Just when I start to believe it's getting warmer all the time, we've got 3 nights that will approach -35 wind chills. I certainly don't remember it being much colder than that.

Our first and last frost dates for 2024 were right in line with our historical averages. How long will it take climate change to lengthen our growing season by a couple of weeks?

 

[homerj]

65 mph winds in western MN/NoDak. Windchill pushing -40 and lower.

It's really getting warm out