I have a large Tuffline ATV disc that works great. However, I haven't been using it the past two years and just been going with the no till, throw n mow, which has worked good. One advantage of the no till is building OM. What's the advantage of using the disc to terminate a plot? My thoughts are that you can do it without spraying and can save on the herbicide, but even some spray 10 days prior to discing. Another reason I'm thinking is discing will terminate an old perennial plot easier and quicker . I know discing in lime works quicker etc, but on say a 1/4 acre plot, if my recent plot is Buckwheat n IC Cowpeas, why disc vs throw and mow with a brush hog? What are people's thoughts on throw n mow vs disc? You see big differences if you disc vs throw n mow? I honestly haven't.
Atv disc vs no till
- Thread starter BobinCt
- Start date
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Typical you need to use a bottom plow to turn over soil to actually kill weeds to the root level. Discing would need to be pretty deep. You have all the negative aspects on soil health when you disk as well. If you want to understand the aspects of no-till verses tillage, I suggest watching some of Ray the Soil Guy's videos. You will probably notice better results faster using traditional tillage. The problem is that it is not as sustainable over the long run and requires much more input.
With traditional tillage, you deplete the soils natural cycle and try to compensate for it by adding lots of fertilizer. Year after year, as the soil biology crumbles, it can take more and more inputs like fertilizer and over time the soil degrades to the point your yields begin to drop. That is one reason old-time farmers would "rest" fields for a year or two if they could economically.
So, if you want to compare no-till to traditional tillage, you can't compare one field you plant this year to another. You need to plant the same way in the field year after year and compare how the fields perform in 10 years.
Having said that, folks are in lots of different situations. There are times when tillage is needed, but they are generally infrequent special situations. Throw and mow may work better in some situations than others. A not-till drill is a great option if you can afford one. Also, there are downsides to using herbicide for weed control.
I'm personally moving more and more to minimizing tillage (both depth and frequency) to the extent I can. I'm also becoming more tolerant of weeds and spending more time looking at the big picture.
Thanks,
jack
With traditional tillage, you deplete the soils natural cycle and try to compensate for it by adding lots of fertilizer. Year after year, as the soil biology crumbles, it can take more and more inputs like fertilizer and over time the soil degrades to the point your yields begin to drop. That is one reason old-time farmers would "rest" fields for a year or two if they could economically.
So, if you want to compare no-till to traditional tillage, you can't compare one field you plant this year to another. You need to plant the same way in the field year after year and compare how the fields perform in 10 years.
Having said that, folks are in lots of different situations. There are times when tillage is needed, but they are generally infrequent special situations. Throw and mow may work better in some situations than others. A not-till drill is a great option if you can afford one. Also, there are downsides to using herbicide for weed control.
I'm personally moving more and more to minimizing tillage (both depth and frequency) to the extent I can. I'm also becoming more tolerant of weeds and spending more time looking at the big picture.
Thanks,
jack
Tap
5 year old buck +
I'm trying to get more serious about T 'n M but I have mixed results with it. For my soil, it seems like a slight perforation of the soil helps with germination. I'm talking about just barely breaking the surface of the soil with discs set at a slight angle. I'm sure that soil type and compaction, moisture, amount of thatch and the size of the seed used for M 'n T has as much to do with success as tillage does.
I sold my moldboard plows a couple years ago. I'll never turn my soil again, but there are times that I think a chisel plow would have applications on my place.
I sold my moldboard plows a couple years ago. I'll never turn my soil again, but there are times that I think a chisel plow would have applications on my place.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I have heavy clay soils that tend to crust because of the low OM. One of the techniques I use is to set my tiller so high that I actually have to lift it with the 3-pt hitch, It barely touches the soil. It chops up weeds and gets a little dirt on them but tills less than 1" deep. This breaks any crust, but when I'm done, my field looks like a field of thatch rather than a freshly disked field. I typically wait about 2 weeks for those weeds to start growing again from their root systems. While the shoots are young and actively growing, they are very susceptible to herbicide. That is when I spray and surface broadcast my seed.
Thanks,
Jack
Thanks,
Jack
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
You are absolutely right. Throw and Mow works fine for most of the cool season small seeded crops that surface broadcast well. For large seeded warm season annuals, a no-till drill or planter is the best option.
Keep in mind that we use "no-till" as a short-cut but minimizing tillage is only part of the equation with no till. It also includes things like keeping the soil covered and smart crop selection. It works so well for food plotters because many of the cover crops farmers use to benefit the soil happen to be great deer foods.
Thanks,
Jack
Crimson n' Camo
5 year old buck +
Great discussion........:)
