Turning a clover food plot into a horse pasture

[eclipseman]

All,
I will be turning one of my 2 acre deer food plots into a horse pasture for my wife. We are planning to get the pasture established this summer and then bring the horse there next summer to give the pasture a good amount of time to establish roots. As an FYI this is in upstate NY. Currently the plot is half dirt (brassica fall plot which has been eaten to the ground) and half ladino clover. I was told by locals that for horse pasture I would want to plant Kentucky blue grass mixed with orchard grass and possibly add in some ladino clover and timothy. This pasture will be for one horse and will be divided in half so we can rotate the horse between both halves.

My first question is, as stated above, half of the plot/pasture currently is a ladino clover deer food plot. Should I spray with glyphosate now (the clover is already starting to come back from winter dormancy)? Then till it up in 2 weeks and plant the above seed mix? I heard ladino clover is hard to kill and sometimes will bounce back after being sprayed with glyphosate. If this happens, is a lot of clover a bad thing for the horse? If so, what should we do? Thanks!

 

[mglenn005]

IMO, you should just overseed the clover with the grasses. You may want to go a little heavy on the seeding rates. I would avoid tilling the ground at all cost.


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[TreeDaddy]

Just be DAMN certain of your plan before seeding/sprigging bermuda grass,etc

Once its established, nearly impossible to eradicate..........

bill

 

[eclipseman]

IMO, you should just overseed the clover with the grasses. You may want to go a little heavy on the seeding rates. I would avoid tilling the ground at all cost.


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So the excessive clover wouldn’t be bad for the horse?

 

[eclipseman]

Just be DAMN certain of your plan before seeding/sprigging bermuda grass,etc

Once its established, nearly impossible to eradicate..........

bill

We are certain she will have a horse here. Is there something else I’m forgetting?

 

[homerj]

So the excessive clover wouldn’t be bad for the horse?

Sounds like you and the wife have some learning to do about horses. Google is your friend. Your vet will be another great source of info.
https://equimed.com/news/health/clover-and-your-horses-health
https://extension.umn.edu/horse-nutrition/feeding-clover-your-horse
https://www.manitobacooperator.ca/livestock/clovers-can-affect-horse-health/
https://wagwalking.com/horse/condition/red-clover-poisoning

 

[eclipseman]

Sounds like you and the wife have some learning to do about horses. Google is your friend. Your vet will be another great source of info.
https://equimed.com/news/health/clover-and-your-horses-health
https://extension.umn.edu/horse-nutrition/feeding-clover-your-horse
https://www.manitobacooperator.ca/livestock/clovers-can-affect-horse-health/
https://wagwalking.com/horse/condition/red-clover-poisoning

Thanks. I am new but she has owned horses all her life but they were kept at her parents house and mostly had a hay/grain diet. Her parents property did not provide for good pasture. Our property does provide decent pasture so if we can save some money on pasturing versus buying a lot of hay that would be great, if not...no big deal. From the research i did, I know ladino clover is often put in pasture mixes for horses but i wasnt sure if you had a field with a LOT of clover, would this be bad. From the links you provided, the answer is "maybe". It depends if the clover gets moldy. The good news is we do not have crazy hot or wet summers (typically) so I would think mold should not be an issue.

Would your advice be to simply overseed the clover with blue grass, orchard grass and timothy....or should I spray and try to kill the ladino...till it up and start fresh?

 

[homerj]

Would your advice be to simply overseed the clover with blue grass, orchard grass and timothy....or should I spray and try to kill the ladino...till it up and start fresh?

I am not a horse guy, in fact I strongly dislike them. However, if I were going to have one around I would do all that I could to reduce vet costs. I'd be spraying that ladino plot with a broadleaf herbicide that has at least some Banvel in it to get rid of as much clover as possible. Then seed it to a horse pasture grass mix.

 

[eclipseman]

I am not a horse guy, in fact I strongly dislike them. However, if I were going to have one around I would do all that I could to reduce vet costs. I'd be spraying that ladino plot with a broadleaf herbicide that has at least some Banvel in it to get rid of as much clover as possible. Then seed it to a horse pasture grass mix.

Yeah that is what im thinking. Thanks for the advice! Never heard of Banvel. I typically have used glyphosate in the past to try and knock clover out...but sometimes it bounces back. I will have to check around for Banvel.

 

[homerj]

Yeah that is what im thinking. Thanks for the advice! Never heard of Banvel. I typically have used glyphosate in the past to try and knock clover out...but sometimes it bounces back. I will have to check around for Banvel.

Clover laughs at glyphosate. Banvel (dicamba) is expensive but will eliminate clover. I'd look for something like this https://www.domyown.com/triplet-sf-...LTxG9DG5VhoKWqq-e24qdsc2jRQMJ-DgaAqMIEALw_wcB

 

[eclipseman]

Clover laughs at glyphosate. Banvel (dicamba) is expensive but will eliminate clover. I'd look for something like this https://www.domyown.com/triplet-sf-...LTxG9DG5VhoKWqq-e24qdsc2jRQMJ-DgaAqMIEALw_wcB

yeah thats what I thought when I tried glyphosate last year on some clover portions. Thanks! Hopefully I can find it locally. so below are the ingredients to what you mentioned. are all three ingredients key to stopping the ladino clover or is it mainly just the dicamba? This stuff is expensive per acre haha but it will be worth it if it works! Thanks!

2,4-D 30.56%
Mecoprop-p 8.17%
Dicamba 2.77%

 

[homerj]

yeah thats what I thought when I tried glyphosate last year on some clover portions. Thanks! Hopefully I can find it locally. so below are the ingredients to what you mentioned. are all three ingredients key to stopping the ladino clover or is it mainly just the dicamba? This stuff is expensive per acre haha but it will be worth it if it works! Thanks!

2,4-D 30.56%
Mecoprop-p 8.17%
Dicamba 2.77%

All three will impact the clover, but the Dicamba is the most important component. I did not do a lot of digging for the best price on a product like that, so you may be able to find it for a better price with web searching. If you have a co-op there it would also be worth giving them a call.

 

[eclipseman]

All three will impact the clover, but the Dicamba is the most important component. I did not do a lot of digging for the best price on a product like that, so you may be able to find it for a better price with web searching. If you have a co-op there it would also be worth giving them a call.

Just called my local coop and they said to just use roundup which has me doubting their knowledge now because isnt roundup just glyphosate? They said if I use what you described above I would need to spray and then wait 30 days or so. Is that true? I will do whatever it takes to knock out the clover and it sounds like you have better knowledge than they do.

 

[Mortenson]

From the same site as homerj linked, the Triad is about $10/quart cheaper and very similar.

https://www.domyown.com/triad-select-herbicide-p-17098.html

 

[Mortenson]

Here it's even cheaper on Keystone. $24.95/quart

https://www.keystonepestsolutions.c...92-737?zenid=53ef0e9ea7cfc9f058092a9f8c340e0b

 

[homerj]

Just called my local coop and they said to just use roundup which has me doubting their knowledge now because isnt roundup just glyphosate? They said if I use what you described above I would need to spray and then wait 30 days or so. Is that true? I will do whatever it takes to knock out the clover and it sounds like you have better knowledge than they do.

Round up is glyphosate. You must not be in an agricultural area. Yes, there is a wait time to re-seed after using dicamba. Since you said you were bringing the horse next summer (2020?) I don't think the wait time is a big deal. The best time to establish/re-establish a grass pasture is late summer/early fall.

 

[eclipseman]

Round up is glyphosate. You must not be in an agricultural area. Yes, there is a wait time to re-seed after using dicamba. Since you said you were bringing the horse next summer (2020?) I don't think the wait time is a big deal. The best time to establish/re-establish a grass pasture is late summer/early fall.

hmm ok so now im more confused haha sorry for all the questions. I was told I can grow the grass anytime in my area since im in NY because our summers really arent too bad for heat and droughts but optimum would be spring/early summer or late summer/early fall. It sounds like I cant even spray the clover until it is growing well since this chemical needs to be absorbed through the leaves which means waiting until May-ish time frame. So from the sounds of it...I shouldnt spray the clover at all until maybe end of July...because then a month later would be end of August bringing me right to that later summer time frame to plant the new grasses? If I sprayed in May then I couldnt plant until sometime in June which may not be optimal time to grow grasses? Thanks!

 

[homerj]

hmm ok so now im more confused haha sorry for all the questions. I was told I can grow the grass anytime in my area since im in NY because our summers really arent too bad for heat and droughts but optimum would be spring/early summer or late summer/early fall. It sounds like I cant even spray the clover until it is growing well since this chemical needs to be absorbed through the leaves which means waiting until May-ish time frame. So from the sounds of it...I shouldnt spray the clover at all until maybe end of July...because then a month later would be end of August bringing me right to that later summer time frame to plant the new grasses? If I sprayed in May then I couldnt plant until sometime in June which may not be optimal time to grow grasses? Thanks!

I don't know your area at all, so I cannot give first hand experience. In northern latitudes when establishing a seeded lawn it is generally recommended to aim for late August/early September. I'd imagine you could try it in spring, but if you get a dry spell/drought in the summer then you may be starting over come fall.

 

[eclipseman]

I don't know your area at all, so I cannot give first hand experience. In northern latitudes when establishing a seeded lawn it is generally recommended to aim for late August/early September. I'd imagine you could try it in spring, but if you get a dry spell/drought in the summer then you may be starting over come fall.

ah ok. Thanks a lot for all the info. I ordered the chemicals so thanks again!

 

[mglenn005]

I know we had clover in our horse pasture 15 years ago. I can’t tell you what type or how thick it was compared to grasses. But we never sprayed it. Horses mAde it to almost 30 years old.


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