To water or not to water?

[Knehrke]

After one of the most waterlogged summers I can remember, I planted all of the trees and shrubs that I'd grown in 1 gallon RM pots this year (~150 total, oak, chestnut, hazelnut, crabapple) toward the beginning of September. And as many of you have experienced, planting ensures a lack of rain . We've been dry now for at least four weeks with temperatures in the 80s (not hot to many, but plenty hot for September in upstate NY). I grew my plants in a 50/50 mix of Promix BX and mini pine bark nuggets, and my soil is a bit on the heavy side. I gave them each ~1/2 gallon of water last Sunday and was planning to water similarly this week, and again up until it rains. However, I know that the growing substrate will retain water more than the surrounding soil, so I don't want to overwater, and I also don't want to encourage new growth at this time of year. But I also don't want the trees to enter the winter stressed.

Hence, the title of this thread: to water or not to water? Opinions?

 

[Catscratch]

I don't know exactly what the right answer is, but if you are willing to water then water. I don't think it's ever a bad thing to water once a week or two. I check my trees often and if they are starting to show signs that they are dieing then I get them some water. Ultimately I don't want to have to water trees all the time, so this curtiousy only lasts a yr. After that they better be able to make it on their own cause I'm not babying trees the rest of my life.

 

[Brush farmer]

A rule that has served me well is to only water when I see leaves start to droop. You're experiencing the problems that have made me stay away from planting potted trees for the most part. When I have planted potted trees I usually won't even worry about water unless it's over a week and half without raining. I've gotten along fine doing things this way but local soils play a part in it also.
If you're soil isn't very permiable you can create a water well in the potting soil but I don't think that's an issue in a dry spell. It's times of frequent rain that really let the water pool. You might have to examine your planting method for problems in the future. My trees are all on slopes. I've taken the downhill side of the planting hole out and replaced that soil with something more permiable when planting on a site with a high clay content.

 

[yoderjac]

What kind of soil do you have? Sandy, Clay, Loam?

 

[Knehrke]

Good advice and stuff I've thought about...we have mainly clay, parts of the property are not particularly well drained, and planting from pots can certainly created an amended base where it retains water (and dries out more quickly, too: double dragon). I've restricted planting from pots to the fall season where there's an opportunity for the roots to grow into the native soil even as the tree is going dormant. So far, with two years to judge, it's been relatively successful, and with as wet as it was this summer, I might have expected to lose some of the chestnut to soggy feet. Finger's crossed, but they still look healthy.

I did end up watering yesterday. The trees weren't showing frank signs of stress but there was some subtle drooping and browning. But the ground is starting to crack some from a month without rain. Crazy year. Well...every year seems to be crazy in one way or another lately.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

I am far from a professional, but if my fresh planted trees dont get rain for a couple weeks, I add about 2.5 gallons of water to each fresh planted tree. I do this only for about 2 months after planting. After that, they are on their own. I have had people tell me that I need to keep them watered, and they will grow faster. But it isnt an easy task for me to do so, and my theory is if I dont give them water, the trees will have to grow roots to find water on its own. If they can make it the first year on their own, then they have developed a good root system, and should survive, even in most of the drier summers. I would have to think that my trees that have to find its own water the first year will have a much better root system then one that was pampered its first year, and didnt have to grow roots to survive. At least that is my theory, and the only trees that hasnt made it for me, are the ones that I didnt fence.

 

[yoderjac]

Good advice and stuff I've thought about...we have mainly clay, parts of the property are not particularly well drained, and planting from pots can certainly created an amended base where it retains water (and dries out more quickly, too: double dragon). I've restricted planting from pots to the fall season where there's an opportunity for the roots to grow into the native soil even as the tree is going dormant. So far, with two years to judge, it's been relatively successful, and with as wet as it was this summer, I might have expected to lose some of the chestnut to soggy feet. Finger's crossed, but they still look healthy.

I did end up watering yesterday. The trees weren't showing frank signs of stress but there was some subtle drooping and browning. But the ground is starting to crack some from a month without rain. Crazy year. Well...every year seems to be crazy in one way or another lately.

Here is what I do for planting from RB2 containers into my heavy clay.

1) I use a tractor auger that is very slightly larger than the container I'm planting from.
2) I auger the hole between 2 and 3 feet deep.
3) I back fill the bottom of the hole with quarry stone (quarter size).
4) I add fertilizer at this point regardless of the time of year. I use the wrong end of the shovel to make sure it falls down into the stone.
5) I add a thin layer of clay (less than 1/2") just to protect the roots from contact with any fertilizer that doesn't filter down.
6) I add the tree. My total backfill level is such that the top of the medium will sit about 1" above ground surface level.
7) The spot I pick is not a low spot where ground water will drain into the hole, but I use the native clay to build a slight ramp from the ground level to the top of the medium. This also helps keep ground water from draining in.
8) I cover it with landscaping material and put more quarry stone on it to hold it in place and act as permanent mulch.

We get very wet periods in the spring where the medium can act as a pond. By augering that deep hole and backfilling with stone, any rain water that does enter naturally (not ground water drain) ponds in the stone below the root ball so the tree doesn't have wet feet. During dry periods in the summer, the landscaping material and stone mulch help reduce moisture loss without attracting rodent nesting. The reason the auger size is very slightly larger than the root ball is so that the lateral roots don't have far to grow to get into the native clay. The clay under the top few inches will retain water well.

If you have the ability to provide supplemental water in the field when it has been dry for a while, do so. Your clay will be dry and the promix will not hold water better than the clay. When it is dry, the clay will suck the water from the promix and the promix will dry out more quickly than the clay.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[H20fwler]

My area is heavy clay loam, I water if I plant trees in early fall if rains are thin. Anything I have in the ground a year or less I will water if they start to look or act even a little stressed...sometimes I water them just for my own peace of mind, I don't want to put the effort into them and loose any over something I could have easily prevented.

 

[TreeDaddy]

jack,

What type of fertilizer and how much are you using?


bill

 

[Knehrke]

I love your ideas Jack, but they're somewhat impractical for the spaces I'm putting some of the trees...and I sold my tractor because I wasn't using it :). Probably a mistake I'll regret in future years. We are in the midst of the emerald ash borer and I'm trying to get a leg up on the loss I'm likely to experience. Many of the stems are too small to harvest commercially, but there's enough "stuff" around to make getting a tractor in difficult. Hence, it's been a labor of love, all by hand. Many hundreds of trees a year, and literally thousands of wildlife shrubs to combat the flux of invasives we're sure to experience as more light reaches the soil. Thanks for the advice though: good stuff.

 

[yoderjac]

jack,

What type of fertilizer and how much are you using?


bill

I've just been dumping in a cup or so of 10-10-10. I'm not really trying to fertilize the tree. Most trees don't do well (especially chestnuts) when the root ball in inundated with water, but trees often grow naturally right next to water sources. I believe the difference is that when roots grow into water, they do it slowly and are smart about it. Only a percentage of the roots rather than the entire root ball contact the water source and those trees tend to perform well. I'm kind of trying to create that artificially by placing my clay pond below the tree. Most of the roots will grow laterally into the native clay but some will work there way down through that stone over the years. The fertilizer is just used for the future. With my heavy clay nutrients travel very slowly. I just figured I'd add some fertilizer that will probably just sit in the bottom of that pond for a few years until some roots get to it. I don't think the amount or type is critical since it is not being applied directly to the tree.

Thanks,

jack