The "Un-Hit List"

[BenAllgood]

Had this idea bandied about lately and thought I'd be interested in the takes here.

The farm I primarily hunt has hunters from several stages of life. The most mature passed a 160" class 10 point this year because his body looked to only be 3. The least mature would fall into the "thrilled to shoot a 120" 2 year old" category. And we have a mix of everything in between.

We generally come up with a list of deer by age class each year and Most Mature is usually after a 5 year old. The rest are usually on 4.5 and older.

The neighbors will shoot anything thats a "big 8 point or more" kinda thing. Not a lot of concern for age class. And with only 300 acres it's hard to really manage.

The thought we had brought up to us was, what if we came up with a "Reverse Hit List" of 4 or 5 deer that we could all agree with being off limits. It's not contractually bound, but it's a good way for that 3 year old that's gonna be a stud to get thru. Then, if you need a buck and a 2 year old strikes your fancy, shoot it.

I think that idea would be an easier sell to the neighbors and we've got no shortage of those younger bucks. We don't have enough hunters to kill all of those in a 1 buck state. So if you NEED a buck this year, shoot one of those, but treat those "Deer of Potential" almost as a slot limit.

Once again, not commanding neighbors to obey our rules. But they may be interested in having their own list and maybe have some co-op style collaboration on a couple deer that'd be really exciting to see next year.

Might be a pie in the sky idea, but wondered what your thoughts were. We have good relationships with our neighbors and it's not combative. Thought that may be a better approach than having one killed and getting the "he coulda used a year, but I couldn't help myself"

Instead of sending them pics of bucks you want them to agree to not shoot, maybe text them pics of bucks as you pass them while hunting. Something like, "This buck was moving this morning. I decided to let him go because I'd love to see him next year, plus I'm looking for this one." If he knows you're actively passing on them, he may be more apt to pass them.

 

[roymunson]

For sure - everyone’s piece of ground is different and hunters are different. Folks in my area consider does freezer fillers due to the efforts of our g&f a dozen years ago. “Balance the herd” they said. “Shoot your does down” to balance the herd. A lot of folks took them at their word. Now, with declining fawn recruitment numbers all across the south - and hunters treating does like squirrels - we are paying the price. It is a lot easier to shoot your does down than get them back. That is the position we are in. I understand there are areas with too many does - that would not ever happen here. I have 350 acres and we kill one or two does. There are eight folks that hunt my place at least a day or too. We would all like to kill a doe - but we realize the does are our the key to us having deer in the future. I have not killed a doe in maybe 8 years. I would go kill two or three today for hamburger and sausage if I thought we could spare them - but we cant.

Come to Knox County Ohio. Its different.

I saw 10+ different antlerless deer yesteday and about 7 bucks within gun range. My sons sat 2 other spots and saw 12+ others, 2 other guys saw 30+ (combined) and that's all on our little 330 acre mini-coop. And we didn't do the killing yesterday. The neighbors did.

 

[gunther89]

The issue we have with the amish is they always say they want to shoot big bucks and shoot deer like my cousin and I shoot. The only issue is, they see a buck that's out to the ears and just have to kill them. If they don't want to kill big bucks then just come out and say it but saying every fall they will pass 2 and 3 yr olds and then when the first 3 yr old walks by, it gets shot, that's what I have an issue with.

 

[SwampCat]

Come to Knox County Ohio. Its different.

I saw 10+ different antlerless deer yesteday and about 7 bucks within gun range. My sons sat 2 other spots and saw 12+ others, 2 other guys saw 30+ (combined) and that's all on our little 330 acre mini-coop. And we didn't do the killing yesterday. The neighbors did.

We see plenty of deer - one afternoon last week - I saw 26. The problem is, I have 15 adjacent landowners - a lot of them are small acreage and hunt. I know of one 30 acre neighbor who has killed four does, one 15 acre neighbor has killed five does, and one forty acre neighbor has killed six bucks - I know of a few other deer the neighbors have killed - but not their totals. Our fawn recruitment numbers run .3-.4 per adult doe. We need a lot of does to produce a few fawns. We dont shoot our does so that our neighbors can.

 

[Tree Spud]

If a neighbor printed off a no-shoot poster, those bucks would be my main targets for the year.

Exactly! Some petty folks will shoot those just to spite you even though they know the potential.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

Exactly! Some petty folks will shoot those just to spite you even though they know the potential.

I’m not being petty, I just don’t like someone telling me what I should and shouldn’t shoot on my land! There is a difference.

I do tell some of my neighbors what kind of deer I pass in general, but I know some just want to shoot any deer and that’s fine too as long as they don’t break any laws

 

[Tree Spud]

I’m not being petty, I just don’t like someone telling me what I should and shouldn’t shoot on my land! There is a difference.

I do tell some of my neighbors what kind of deer I pass in general, but I know some just want to shoot any deer and that’s fine too as long as they don’t break any laws

Not saying you were being petty, sorry if that was mis-interpreted. But the sentiment of what you said is what rings true. People own land because they want to do what they do and they pay a lot of money to have that right.

If you try and tell folks what to do in any way, no matter how crafty you are with your approach, many will push back.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I do think you can get neighbors to follow your lead if they see you having better luck than they have. They sometimes ask advice and that’s the time to bring up land improvements, trigger restraint, etc.

I’m impressed with co-ops that are successful since it is so hard to get people to have the same goals

 

[matinc]

Our mile has one ten acre parcel who moved in the neighborhood last year that killed 6 or 7 1.5 year old bucks this year. Trespassed across my land tracking a small buck without my permission and when confronted said he wants to get along with the neighbors. Basically wiping out all bucks for next year as our neighbors take 3.5 year old bucks and above. I actually found another arrow bolt on my land this year also. Sorry to rant

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

Our mile has one ten acre parcel who moved in the neighborhood last year that killed 6 or 7 1.5 year old bucks this year. Trespassed across my land tracking a small buck without my permission and when confronted said he wants to get along with the neighbors. Basically wiping out all bucks for next year as our neighbors take 3.5 year old bucks and above. I actually found another arrow bolt on my land this year also. Sorry to rant

Man, that really sucks. Did he say why he has so many people hunting on a 10 acre property?

 

[swat1018]

I don't bother with the neighbors some are Amish they shoot everything. I do have a no-fly list for the guys that hunt with me on my ground. It's usually some 2, 3, and sometimes 4 year olds that are off-limits.

 

[Maddog66]

Here is one for the brain trust here to consider…..

I let my best friend and his son hunt on my land for gun deer season. Neither of them are avid deer hunters and have only killed a couple deer each in a lifetime before hunting my land so I always set them in my best stands on opening weekend.

They certainly know how much time, money and effort I put in and they are very appreciative. They even come to my place a day a year and I put them to work on ball buster projects. Never a complaint….only appreciation.

But the last 2 years in a row my friends son has shot “my” best up and coming 2 year old on opening morning. I passed them during bow season and showed pics but I never said “don’t” shoot them either…..so it’s technically my fault.

The problem we have is that when he sees a rack outside the ears, he can’t stay off the trigger. I tell him that there are bigger, more mature bucks and plenty of does (he LOVES venison) but that 14” wide 8 pointer is too much to resist for a guy who has seen only a handful of bucks in his life from a stand.

I talked to him this year about how those 2.5’s really blow into nice bucks in a year, if they make it, and I know he understands. But then I think about how excited he and his dad are when he shoots a buck…..and I feel guilty for potentially taking that away from them.

I have about 300 acres and I know we can’t truly protect those bucks. Between my neighbors shooting everything with a rack and the wolves straight up eating everything else, I’m about 90% sure passing 2.5’s won’t make a difference anyway.

But how can I teach an inexperienced hunter that “outside the ears” means almost nothing??

 

[bueller]

...

The problem we have is that when he sees a rack outside the ears, he can’t stay off the trigger. I tell him that there are bigger, more mature bucks and plenty of does (he LOVES venison) but that 14” wide 8 pointer is too much to resist for a guy who has seen only a handful of bucks in his life from a stand.

I talked to him this year about how those 2.5’s really blow into nice bucks in a year, if they make it, and I know he understands. But then I think about how excited he and his dad are when he shoots a buck…..and I feel guilty for potentially taking that away from them.

...
But how can I teach an inexperienced hunter that “outside the ears” means almost nothing??

Natural progression. To a new hunter ANY buck is a trophy. After harvesting some yearlings and eventually some 2.5's the light bulb will likely go on and they will start aiming higher, that's IF there is a population of huntable bigger bucks in the area. Sadly, I feel like many of today's accomplished hunters started this way but don't want new players to the game to do the same.

 

[matinc]

Why can't you just say it's 8 point and 16 inch or better. $100 PER point and inch short. Unfortunately it's your land and it's your rules period. It's great they help you with projects, but you need to stand up. Watching an up and coming go down is a 3 year loss. Explain how long it takes to replace them.

 

[Brian662]

Is 14" outside the ears? Always thought it was more like 16-17"?

 

[Maddog66]

I’m sure you’re right Bueller. I too have a box in the basement full of 1.5’s and 2.5’s….and I don’t want to be a hypocrite on it either.

My long departed Grandpa said ‘you have to kill bucks if you want to be a buck hunter’. .

I’ll also admit that it’s different when it’s your own land. Not the public land I grew up hunting.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

It’s your land therefore your rules and wishes. I think after 2 he should have scratched the itch of the 14” 8 pt. But…every landowner has different hot buttons so only you can decide how much it’s impacting you. For me the answer is you get zero 2.5 year olds. Plenty of does.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

The landowner gets to make the rules, so I think you just need to be clear what you want your buddy and his kid to shoot or not shoot.

 

[Maddog66]

Thx men. Solid advice! I appreciate all of it.

 

[swat1018]

Thx men. Solid advice! I appreciate all of it.

Sometimes the easiest way is to sit with them and say "No, that's not what we're after."