The Sweet Clover Thread

[Jlane35]

I’m trying to figure out what to plant for a cover crop after my Milpa blend. I plan on keeping the same plot as my Milpa blend every year.

Would hairy vetch be the ticket? A great nitrogen builder, and no chemicals needed to terminate the crop after planting? At what stage does mowing terminate it? Can you mow it to early in its growth stage and it continues to grow? SD, I don’t think you have mowed your HV until after it has produced seeds, correct?

 

[Foggy47]

I’m trying to figure out what to plant for a cover crop after my Milpa blend. I plan on keeping the same plot as my Milpa blend every year.

Would hairy vetch be the ticket? A great nitrogen builder, and no chemicals needed to terminate the crop after planting? At what stage does mowing terminate it? Can you mow it to early in its growth stage and it continues to grow? SD, I don’t think you have mowed your HV until after it has produced seeds, correct?

^ That's the problem.....I don't think you can terminate it. It could be classified as an invasive.

Edit: I have read several others say they wish they would have never used the hairy vetch.

 

[Jlane35]

^ That's the problem.....I don't think you can terminate it. It could be classified as an invasive.

I thought mowing terminates it? And herbicide, which I’m trying to do on a limited basis.

The issue, when letting plots mature for throw and mow plots, is its prolific seed production. It is in annual, so mowing it should terminate it.

 

[SD51555]

So tell me great guru SD. Is hairy vetch an annual or perrenial. It must be like having a hairy vetch pain in the ass. Lol wish I knew how to put your quotes in here llolllll

It's a biennial that produces seed the entire growing season once it begins blooming, and it never stops. It's depressing to see the outrageous amount of pods one vine can produce.

 

[SD51555]

I’m trying to figure out what to plant for a cover crop after my Milpa blend. I plan on keeping the same plot as my Milpa blend every year.

Would hairy vetch be the ticket? A great nitrogen builder, and no chemicals needed to terminate the crop after planting? At what stage does mowing terminate it? Can you mow it to early in its growth stage and it continues to grow? SD, I don’t think you have mowed your HV until after it has produced seeds, correct?

Correct. I didn't mow mine until late July/early August. By then there were dozens and dozens of dry pods on the vine, and more on the way. If a person were to successfully mow kill it early enough, I don't think you'd realize the positives of it. That amount of biomass created and thus minerals converted from rock to residue is huge. It has to be to make that much duff.

 

[SD51555]

SARE has a decent writeup on HV:

Hairy Vetch - SARE

Hairy Vetch (Vicia villosa) Type: winter annual or summer annual legume Roles: N source, weed suppressor, topsoil conditioner, reduce erosion Mix with: small grains, field peas, bell beans, crimson clover, buckwheat See charts, p. 66 to 72, for ranking and management summary. Few legumes match...

www.sare.org

 

[RGrizzzz]

I thought mowing terminates it? And herbicide, which I’m trying to do on a limited basis.

The issue, when letting plots mature for throw and mow plots, is its prolific seed production. It is in annual, so mowing it should terminate it.

When do you plant the milpa blend? That probably matters if you can terminate it

 

[Jlane35]

When do you plant the milpa blend? That probably matters if you can terminate it

I planted to early this year, just when I could get the drill rental.

Ideally, I should plant it around May 15th. So I’m not sure what stage hairy vetch would be in at that time.

 

[RGrizzzz]

I planted to early this year, just when I could get the drill rental.

Ideally, I should plant it around May 15th. So I’m not sure what stage hairy vetch would be in at that time.

It won't be huge. I'd expect to have to spray it anytime before June in PA. Probably later.

 

[Jlane35]

It won't be huge. I'd expect to have to spray it anytime before June in PA. Probably later.

Yeah, I really don’t want to spray. SD and I are along the same lines when it comes to no spray food plotting.

Luckily he’s done a lot of the hard work and I’m just piggybacking off his success and failures.

 

[TreeDaddy]

I’ve spread it in open spots in the woods to try to get it going, and it didn’t take. Only in the plots.


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I plan to seed a few brush piles this fall as an " SD inspired" C:N experiment

bill

 

[matinc]

Foggy I am planting a six seed combination with sorghum sudan grass over 4th of July and will crimp it over labor day weekend. How high on my .9 OM sandy soil would you expect it to get. I am hoping to have 3 feet rye to crimp on top. I don't have no till drill but will broadcast.

 

[Foggy47]

Foggy I am planting a six seed combination with sorghum sudan grass over 4th of July and will crimp it over labor day weekend. How high on my .9 OM sandy soil would you expect it to get. I am hoping to have 3 feet rye to crimp on top. I don't have no till drill but will broadcast.

What are you all plan to plant? So much depends on weather and soil fertility that I would not guess on the height of your Sorghum.....nor Sorghum Sudan grass. Also very dependent on the types of SSG you plant. Lots of different varieties there with some at 3 feet and others at 10 feet. Height is just one factor.....standability into fall is another.

At one point I was going to plant a wide variety of compatible crops with my Sorghum......but now I think I will go with just a few......as I am uncertain how well the Sorghum will compete with the others.....and I am primarily interested in a tall dense Sorghum stand over some of the diversity the others would provide.....and I am hoping it will stand into December. I want my food plots to feel smaller and "cozy" for the deer during daylight hours....into the late rifle season.

 

[SD51555]

Let’s get our face in it.

It’s balansa. It’s 5” above my knee already, and just barely starting to bloom. I did find this one.

They’re eating a little. That’s impressive this time of year given they’ve got a hundred times more food than they need.

The hairy pain in my ass is marching along. No pods yet, but I expect them any day.

It’s isn’t even June 10th, and I’ve got chicory coming with a vengeance. This was about a quarter inch thick stem already, and there is chicory everywhere

I still can’t tell the difference between alfalfa and sweet clover right now, but I’m guessing this is sweet clover. It’s almost non-existent. Didn’t see more than 10 of these.

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[SD51555]

I’ve got some rye, but it’s not enough to keep out wild grasses. I already know I’m gonna slide way off the N end of the C:N ratio. It’s thin and short. The balansa is just roaring with tonnage and canopy.

I filled in a mystery hole with topsoil. That’s looking better and taller at the moment.

Fleabane is wild and common by me. Glad to see it here. Bonus broadleaf Indidnt have to buy, and the beneficial bugs like it.

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[SD51555]

Might need to choke down an insane price on mini clover and give it a try. It’s stupid expensive, but it may be the only option I haven’t tried.


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[SD51555]

I need to dig out my yard stick and post. Back before it quit raining in 2021, I used to walk with a yardstick to show height. That balansa is massively thick and picking up speed and height.


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[matinc]

SD it's does look like you said your clover is overtaken the rye. I'm curious how many pounds of rye you planted per acre. How many ticks are you seeing now

 

[SD51555]

SD it's does look like you said your clover is overtaken the rye. I'm curious how many pounds of rye you planted per acre. How many ticks are you seeing now

Put down 2 bushels/ac + volunteer. Ticks are thick. I can see them as I walk near the tall grass. Decided to take the mower on my walk about today.


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[matinc]

Sd sorry. If I pulled the seeder over the standing rye and then crimped would the extra tracks really hurt the germination of the summer blend from atv n seeder wheels. I am getting freaked out by the ticks that I saw last time I was up north.