The 4.5 year old buck

[PrairieShadow]

I have this exact problem and obviously many guys interested in growing older age class bucks do. One thing that bothers me is how over the years the state has become so much more lenient on season lengths and weapons. In MN, we used to choose between a 2 day gun, a 4 day gun, or a MZ season. You could pick 1 not all. As time went on, they made it a 9 day gun season or 16, AND you can also hunt the 16 day MZ season. If youre willing to pay, you can about hunt whenever you want with whatever you want. Many bucks were smart enough to lay low for a 4 day gun season... but 16... not gonna happen.

Most hunters dont care, and they arent interested in making the effort to learn. For example... A deer with a "grey" face must me 8 years old etc etc. I watch the deer very closely in about a 12 square mile area around my home. On most years I will know of 2 bucks that make 4 yrs old in that area. In the last 14 years I can only think of about 5 deer that have made it to 5 years old, and I believe all of them were killed at age 5. I dont know of a buck thats lived to 6. Also, at least 3 of the 5, 5 yr olds, were killed by cars and not hunters!

In the 1000 acres section I hunt, a buck makes it to 4 1/2 about every 4 years. So for me, it makes it where now I rarely hunt 3 out of 4 years. I work harder to keep the deer alive than killing them on those years.

Its hard and its frustrating. You have to have hope that some can make it and your efforts are worth it or it is all for nothing. I cant feel good about shooting a 3 yr old anymore, I just cant. I dont like it but its the way it is. Getting pictures, finding sheds, creating habitat and food, those things now fill the void of NOT killing a deer so I find new satisfaction in them. I find it pure hypocrisy to preach the importance of passing 2 and 3 yr old deer only to kill one myself, that would show a serious lack of integrity. I have no problem with hunters shooting whatever they legally want. BUT dont complain about everyone killing little bucks and then killing one your self! At that moment you become part of the problem.

Have faith in what you are creating there and feel good about it. If you can't do that, then get the F#$% OUT and find a new spot! Life is too short!

Well said Swiff.

 

[hillrunner]

I have this exact problem and obviously many guys interested in growing older age class bucks do. One thing that bothers me is how over the years the state has become so much more lenient on season lengths and weapons. In MN, we used to choose between a 2 day gun, a 4 day gun, or a MZ season. You could pick 1 not all. As time went on, they made it a 9 day gun season or 16, AND you can also hunt the 16 day MZ season. If youre willing to pay, you can about hunt whenever you want with whatever you want. Many bucks were smart enough to lay low for a 4 day gun season... but 16... not gonna happen.

Most hunters dont care, and they arent interested in making the effort to learn. For example... A deer with a "grey" face must me 8 years old etc etc. I watch the deer very closely in about a 12 square mile area around my home. On most years I will know of 2 bucks that make 4 yrs old in that area. In the last 14 years I can only think of about 5 deer that have made it to 5 years old, and I believe all of them were killed at age 5. I dont know of a buck thats lived to 6. Also, at least 3 of the 5, 5 yr olds, were killed by cars and not hunters!

In the 1000 acres section I hunt, a buck makes it to 4 1/2 about every 4 years. So for me, it makes it where now I rarely hunt 3 out of 4 years. I work harder to keep the deer alive than killing them on those years.

Its hard and its frustrating. You have to have hope that some can make it and your efforts are worth it or it is all for nothing. I cant feel good about shooting a 3 yr old anymore, I just cant. I dont like it but its the way it is. Getting pictures, finding sheds, creating habitat and food, those things now fill the void of NOT killing a deer so I find new satisfaction in them. I find it pure hypocrisy to preach the importance of passing 2 and 3 yr old deer only to kill one myself, that would show a serious lack of integrity. I have no problem with hunters shooting whatever they legally want. BUT dont complain about everyone killing little bucks and then killing one your self! At that moment you become part of the problem.

Have faith in what you are creating there and feel good about it. If you can't do that, then get the F#$% OUT and find a new spot! Life is too short!

How many people are you sharing that 1000 acre section with? Are other hunters killing young bucks on that ground?

 

[bwoods11]

I have this exact problem and obviously many guys interested in growing older age class bucks do. One thing that bothers me is how over the years the state has become so much more lenient on season lengths and weapons. In MN, we used to choose between a 2 day gun, a 4 day gun, or a MZ season. You could pick 1 not all. As time went on, they made it a 9 day gun season or 16, AND you can also hunt the 16 day MZ season. If youre willing to pay, you can about hunt whenever you want with whatever you want. Many bucks were smart enough to lay low for a 4 day gun season... but 16... not gonna happen.

Most hunters dont care, and they arent interested in making the effort to learn. For example... A deer with a "grey" face must me 8 years old etc etc. I watch the deer very closely in about a 12 square mile area around my home. On most years I will know of 2 bucks that make 4 yrs old in that area. In the last 14 years I can only think of about 5 deer that have made it to 5 years old, and I believe all of them were killed at age 5. I dont know of a buck thats lived to 6. Also, at least 3 of the 5, 5 yr olds, were killed by cars and not hunters!

In the 1000 acres section I hunt, a buck makes it to 4 1/2 about every 4 years. So for me, it makes it where now I rarely hunt 3 out of 4 years. I work harder to keep the deer alive than killing them on those years.

Its hard and its frustrating. You have to have hope that some can make it and your efforts are worth it or it is all for nothing. I cant feel good about shooting a 3 yr old anymore, I just cant. I dont like it but its the way it is. Getting pictures, finding sheds, creating habitat and food, those things now fill the void of NOT killing a deer so I find new satisfaction in them. I find it pure hypocrisy to preach the importance of passing 2 and 3 yr old deer only to kill one myself, that would show a serious lack of integrity. I have no problem with hunters shooting whatever they legally want. BUT dont complain about everyone killing little bucks and then killing one your self! At that moment you become part of the problem.

Have faith in what you are creating there and feel good about it. If you can't do that, then get the F#$% OUT and find a new spot! Life is too short!

I remember those days, I wish we could go back to something similar… way more mature bucks, and better access for hunters.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

I remember those days, I wish we could go back to something similar… way more mature bucks, and better access for hunters.

Laws/rules always get less restrictive. Sometimes you have to be restrictive to protect the experience.

 

[Mortenson]

Laws/rules always get less restrictive. Sometimes you have to be restrictive to protect the experience.

Yup. There's less of us and more of them. Getting truer by the day.

 

[SWIFFY]

How many people are you sharing that 1000 acre section with? Are other hunters killing young bucks on that ground?

160 of it is public. About 600 I have mostly to myself, but keep in mind its mostly ag in this area so of the 600 maybe 120 is grass, swamp, and trees. And then a neighbor with an 80 has about 35 nice brushy, acres. They shoot about 3-6 bucks a year off that 35 acres and they will kill anything and everything that people have tags for.

For me, the exciting thing is close to 300 of the best located acres will be going into trees, food plots, and Warm season grasses starting in March of 2023. So in another 3-5 years.... I hope im singin' a different tune when it comes to the quality of bucks here! 1000 acres doesnt have much value when its all 2" bean stubble.

 

[hillrunner]

160 of it is public. About 600 I have mostly to myself, but keep in mind its mostly ag in this area so of the 600 maybe 120 is grass, swamp, and trees. And then a neighbor with an 80 has about 35 nice brushy, acres. They shoot about 3-6 bucks a year off that 35 acres and they will kill anything and everything that people have tags for.

For me, the exciting thing is close to 300 of the best located acres will be going into trees, food plots, and Warm season grasses starting in March of 2023. So in another 3-5 years.... I hope im singin' a different tune when it comes to the quality of bucks here! 1000 acres doesnt have much value when its all 2" bean stubble.

That makes sense

 

[Greta&Gus]

Are you guys more impressed with someone who kills a 3 year old, the oldest buck in the neighborhood, in a high pressure area, or a 4 year old buck in a prime spot that also has 5 year olds running around?

Some of the 2 and 3 year olds I have killed mean more to me than the 4 year olds because of the experience.

I was encouraging my cousin this year to shoot a 2 year old to keep it ‘fun’ when he wasn’t seeing the deer he wanted.

It is a shift in the mindset.

 

[PrairieShadow]

Are you guys more impressed with someone who kills a 3 year old, the oldest buck in the neighborhood, in a high pressure area, or a 4 year old buck in a prime spot that also has 5 year olds running around?

Some of the 2 and 3 year olds I have killed mean more to me than the 4 year olds because of the experience.

I was encouraging my cousin this year to shoot a 2 year old to keep it ‘fun’ when he wasn’t seeing the deer he wanted.

It is a shift in the mindset.

I’m most impressed by the guy who goes out and actually hunts. Someone who gets out of the truck and will walk a mile or so into so public land. Who doesn’t use a truck as a portable deer blind. Who doesn’t drive around a section of ground at 5mph day in and day out. Who doesn’t use the mirror as a rifle rest.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Are you guys more impressed with someone who kills a 3 year old, the oldest buck in the neighborhood, in a high pressure area, or a 4 year old buck in a prime spot that also has 5 year olds running around?

Some of the 2 and 3 year olds I have killed mean more to me than the 4 year olds because of the experience.

I was encouraging my cousin this year to shoot a 2 year old to keep it ‘fun’ when he wasn’t seeing the deer he wanted.

It is a shift in the mindset.

Honestly I’m more impressed with the guy who has a chance at a three year old and passes even if he’s the oldest buck in the neighborhood. Much respect to that guy. If he lets it go it MAY get shot…but if he shoot’s it, then it’s definitely not making it.

 

[PrairieShadow]

I’m most impressed by the guy who goes out and actually hunts. Someone who gets out of the truck and will walk a mile or so into so public land. Who doesn’t use a truck as a portable deer blind. Who doesn’t drive around a section of ground at 5mph day in and day out. Who doesn’t use the mirror as a rifle rest.

To elaborate, I spent 172hrs archery hunting a particular buck this year. I could have shot many other respectable bucks but they were not the one I was after. I had numerous close encounters (4’7” at the closest) before I finally got an arrow in him. It’s so bittersweet when you watch a deer for 2-3 years, finally hunt that particular deer in every spare moment of your time and then it just all ends in the blink of an eye. Not something most can even begin to comprehend and something I could not comprehend until 3 years ago. It was such a strange feeling. Even harder when a neighbor who has never even seen that particular deer shoots it from across the hood of his pickup opening morning of rifle.

 

[SWIFFY]

Are you guys more impressed with someone who kills a 3 year old, the oldest buck in the neighborhood, in a high pressure area, or a 4 year old buck in a prime spot that also has 5 year olds running around?

Some of the 2 and 3 year olds I have killed mean more to me than the 4 year olds because of the experience.

I was encouraging my cousin this year to shoot a 2 year old to keep it ‘fun’ when he wasn’t seeing the deer he wanted.

It is a shift in the mindset.

Im impressed by the 3 yr old that makes it to 4 yrs old in my back yard! That animal beat all the odds!

I'm impressed by people who have some self discipline. Everyone can talk a big line, but when the rubber hits the road, most of them seem to forget what they said.

Sadly, what "I'm impressed with" should be the LAST thing on your mind when you're in the deer stand. Have fun and be proud of what you got and encourage your cousin to shoot what HE wants. He shouldn't be doing it for anyone else.

 

[Bill]

Are you guys more impressed with someone who kills a 3 year old, the oldest buck in the neighborhood, in a high pressure area, or a 4 year old buck in a prime spot that also has 5 year olds running around?

Some of the 2 and 3 year olds I have killed mean more to me than the 4 year olds because of the experience.

I was encouraging my cousin this year to shoot a 2 year old to keep it ‘fun’ when he wasn’t seeing the deer he wanted.

It is a shift in the mindset.

I don't think there is anything wrong with shooting the oldest deer a neighborhood would grow if thats 1, 2 or 3. Otherwise you may as well stay home. I'm darn lucky to do what I do. I just sold my land in NJ. Chances of killing a 3 year old are slim to none. It happens but not all that often. Chances of killing a 2.5 year old are a bit better but not a lot. I owned that land for 15 years and hunted it once. I can go to the farm and see 2 year olds like does in NJ. Just can't bring myself to shoot one. Again, I'm darn lucky and have never looked down my nose at anyone for shooting any deer (well maybe a neighbor shooting a 2 year old in a great area that grows them easily to 4)

 

[Greta&Gus]

Im impressed by the 3 yr old that makes it to 4 yrs old in my back yard! That animal beat all the odds!

I'm impressed by people who have some self discipline. Everyone can talk a big line, but when the rubber hits the road, most of them seem to forget what they said.

Sadly, what "I'm impressed with" should be the LAST thing on your mind when you're in the deer stand. Have fun and be proud of what you got and encourage your cousin to shoot what HE wants. He shouldn't be doing it for anyone else.

Your last statement proves my point. No one should ruin their hunt by chasing ghosts. Killing 3 year olds in a heavily pressured are > complaining about the DNR/neighbor/predators and shooting nothing.

Removing any standard from myself has made hunting for me what it was like when I was a kid. A fun passion instead of a mission in futility.

 

[SWIFFY]

However you hunt, you have to do it because you BELIEVE IN IT. It doesnt work to shame others into doing it "my way". Whether you pass 3 yr olds or kill every deer you see, it has to be what the hunter wants or it doesn't work. Chasing ghosts is fine, if you're fine with it.

 

[Greta&Gus]

However you hunt, you have to do it because you BELIEVE IN IT. It doesnt work to shame others into doing it "my way". Whether you pass 3 yr olds or kill every deer you see, it has to be what the hunter wants or it doesn't work. Chasing ghosts is fine, if you're fine with it.

Valid point. I agree.

 

[Brian662]

Where I'm from, 3 year olds are very vulnerable during the rut. I don't even know how many of them I was able to rattle in this fall, probably 7 or 8 to within 15 yards of the stand most of the time. I didn't rattle in a single 4 year old even though there are several around.

Maybe it is different in areas where 3 year olds are king, but in the places I hunt, they are not very smart.

 

[sandbur]

All good replies. A little more details if I may. The farm is 150 acres with half of it being cover. To complicate matters, it is an island of cover in a sea of agriculture. What happens is every year during gun season I get surrounded on all four sides. The first buck to pop out gets shot with a rifle. The one neighbor went as far as leaving rows of standing beans along the whole north border and pulled in a trailer blind in to hunt it. Long way of saying, the neighbors aren't interested in cooperating. Deep down inside I know the answer to my question. Misery loves company I guess.

Your description sounds like where I live.

Do you have waterholes, food and does on your property for during the rut? Can you make your land any thicker? Do you need to have a bigger sanctuary?

How many of you hunt your land during the rifle hunt?


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[BOC]

Your description sounds like where I live.

Do you have waterholes, food and does on your property for during the rut? Can you make your land any thicker? Do you need to have a bigger sanctuary?

How many of you hunt your land during the rifle hunt?


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I only archery hunt. I sit out the whole gun season and watch from afar leaving the farm one big sanctuary. I have 3 ponds and a ditch on this property so water is plentiful. Food and does, got that covered. And the land is a great mix of thickets, mature oaks, wetlands, etc. Though none of it makes a deer want to stay within an imaginary border.

 

[sandbur]

I only archery hunt. I sit out the whole gun season and watch from afar leaving the farm one big sanctuary. I have 3 ponds and a ditch on this property so water is plentiful. Food and does, got that covered. And the land is a great mix of thickets, mature oaks, wetlands, etc. Though none of it makes a deer want to stay within an imaginary border.

I do the opposite and do not archery hunt this area where I live. I don’t use trail cams. I just stay out and try to keep everyone else out except adjacent land owners who might need to trail a deer.

Archery hunters, pheasant hunters and other small game hunters pressure land all around me. When the crops come off, deer move to areas where they have not been disturbed.

We enjoy the rifle season and hunt from the outside in, if that makes sense. Leave as much undisturbed as possible.

Keeping your scent and hunting pressure out of there until the rifle rut hunt works best for me.


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