The 4.5 year old buck

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Additionally through high grading of younger “pretty” bucks the older age class can be toting some unimpressive or disfigured antlers. I have a couple older age class bucks running around that won’t amount to much that could get mislabeled as younger deer if just looking at antlers.

Sounds like your property could be worth a mint. I’d sell that bad boy and move to a desirable neighborhood if hunting mature deer moves the meter.

 

[Angus 1895]

I would think taking a trip out west for white tails might bring you more buck for your buck.

 

[BOC]

I think you might be right. We go west elk hunting every year. Might just have to try it
On a side note, we have all our bucks teeth sent out and aged too. I sometimes have a hard time believing the results, especially when you compare tooth wear.

 

[Angus 1895]

The whitetails out west don’t have near the pressure.

I think a boat that is shallow river navigation ready would make for a true trophy adventure.

 

[Hoytvectrix]

I’ve sent all my teeth in over the past several years. If it’s me you can put me on the spot
But I may not have all of them on trail cam any longer or remember the ages correctly. The plaques are with the deer and I’m not at the moment.

Haha, well you indeed are that person. You have had some incredible deer on your farm.
Do you think there is any truth that some folks are under-estimating buck ages? Were there any that you all have found out to be significantly older than you thought?

 

[hillrunner]

You guys are right. No silver bullet and no easy answers. Options are clear. I just can't throw away 20 years of effort and start over. I have to accept my situation and be happy I have what I have.

I don't see why moving would be throwing away 20 years of effort. Wouldn't you be able to cash in on that effort and roll that forward into a property that better fits your goals?

 

[Mortenson]

I mostly only attempt to age them when I have multiple years of trail cam history. Agree that some 110" racks are being carried on mature bucks. Hard to get those bucks killed.

 

[BOC]

The biggest reason would be my trees. If I have planted one, I have planted 10,000. The time and money spent caging my beautiful conifers would all be lost. Windbreaks are finally becoming windbreaks. Oak savannas are finally becoming oak savannas. Apple orchards are finally dropping reliable fruit. I'm a little old to start over. I built it and they came. They just dont live long

 

[bueller]

4.5 year old. I'm no expert but he may not even be 100". Never had him on a single cam and I've got them all over the place. I feel a fair amount make it to this age but they become damn near unkillable.

 

[PrairieShadow]

I’ve sent all my teeth in over the past several years. If it’s me you can put me on the spot
But I may not have all of them on trail cam any longer or remember the ages correctly. The plaques are with the deer and I’m not at the moment.

I just read an article a week or so back on lab aging teeth. The jist of the article was that after 2.5yrs old the accuracy of the lab was right around 40%. I don’t recall the exact number but it was not good. As the deer got older the accuracy continued to decrease.

 

[Hoytvectrix]

I just read an article a week or so back on lab aging teeth. The jist of the article was that after 2.5yrs old the accuracy of the lab was right around 40%. I don’t recall the exact number but it was not good. As the deer got older the accuracy continued to decrease.

Accuracy of tooth wear for aging deer – Texas Hunting & Fishing | Lone Star Outdoor News

www.lsonews.com

I think this is referring to the same study. This is surprising to me. One thing that is interesting is that almost 90% accuracy within a year.

 

[buckdeer1]

I agree with Hoyt about bucks probably being aged wrong.I think most people judge solely by antlers when i am betting that even most 5 year olds may not grow alot of inches.So without photo history it may be tough to be certain.Hunt the bucks you want to hunt and do what you can to keep them home.Sounds like your place is alot like Don Higgins on chasing giants podcast,you might find some of his things interesting

 

[Greta&Gus]

4.5 year old. I'm no expert but he may not even be 100". Never had him on a single cam and I've got them all over the place. I feel a fair amount make it to this age but they become damn near unkillable.

View attachment 47754

Did you have his teeth sent in?

 

[Greta&Gus]

I agree with Hoyt about bucks probably being aged wrong.I think most people judge solely by antlers when i am betting that even most 5 year olds may not grow alot of inches.So without photo history it may be tough to be certain.Hunt the bucks you want to hunt and do what you can to keep them home.Sounds like your place is alot like Don Higgins on chasing giants podcast,you might find some of his things interesting

Even with all of the information out there to ‘not judge by antlers’, it is what everyone falls back to. With that, I believe most guys screw up or down to fit their narrative.

 

[Bill]

Haha, well you indeed are that person. You have had some incredible deer on your farm.
Do you think there is any truth that some folks are under-estimating buck ages? Were there any that you all have found out to be significantly older than you thought?

Not significantly, most of the deer we have some history with and have a pretty good idea. We’ve had several that came back a year older then we thought and one a year younger. (That might answer your question, more have been older then we thought, just one younger). I also believe the tooth age guys can often be plus or minus one. I still send them all in because it’s at least some kind of base line to go on. I agree with others we often look at antlers to judge because it’s what we do. I’ve found the only part of the antler that can help with age is the pedicle (mass at the base). I’ve found in our neck of the woods there is a difference in mass between most 3 and 4 year olds. Also lots of 4 year old bodies look 3 until mid to late October and then they look 3 again after the rut. After 4 Years old I bow out of the aging game unless I know the deer. I’m interested to see what the tooth guys have to say about the deer I killed in September. I saw him last year and this summer. I had him at 4 until I grabbed his antlers. If he comes back anything younger than 4 I’m going to be a tooth aging skeptic.

If the deer my son killed comes back anything less then 6, I’m going to be a skeptic “history”

To add to the confusion in our neck of the woods is local deer genetics. When I got here 17 years ago a local told me there were short deer and long deer. I thought he was nuts . He wasn’t. We have two types of deer, short stocky ones and long lanky ones. I know that sounds crazy but we’ve killed several of each.

I should sometime gather up tooth age with the trail cam pics and antler bases and do a comparison.

 

[Bill]

4.5 year old. I'm no expert but he may not even be 100". Never had him on a single cam and I've got them all over the place. I feel a fair amount make it to this age but they become damn near unkillable.

View attachment 47754

And no offense to taxidermist, but they just can’t reproduce the exact neck measurements of an individual deer. It’s an eye to nose, eye to antler, neck width at the head and a few other measurements. Then order the closest form.

That’s a logger head…

 

[PrairieShadow]

And no offense to taxidermist, but they just can’t reproduce the exact neck measurements of an individual deer. It’s an eye to nose, eye to antler, neck width at the head and a few other measurements. Then order the closest form.

That’s a logger head…

From my understanding neck size is determined by how the hide tans. Some hides shrink more than others at the tannery.

 

[bueller]

Did you have his teeth sent in?

Yes teeth were sent in. Prior to those results taxidermist also had him at 4.5 and I really wasn't sure what to think. A few years earlier I got one that weighed considerably more and only measured out to around 110". I don't see how he couldn't be at least 4.5. We have larger on camera each year and I'd love to know the age on them, maybe they are good 3.5's or maybe they are way up there in age. One thing for sure they are damn good at surviving us amateur hunters.

 

[buckdeer1]

A good taxi builds the forms to fit what they were in real life.We always measured them so it would be as close as we could before caping. If the guys that mounted had to order a slightly bigger form and then shave down thats what they did.

 

[SWIFFY]

I have this exact problem and obviously many guys interested in growing older age class bucks do. One thing that bothers me is how over the years the state has become so much more lenient on season lengths and weapons. In MN, we used to choose between a 2 day gun, a 4 day gun, or a MZ season. You could pick 1 not all. As time went on, they made it a 9 day gun season or 16, AND you can also hunt the 16 day MZ season. If youre willing to pay, you can about hunt whenever you want with whatever you want. Many bucks were smart enough to lay low for a 4 day gun season... but 16... not gonna happen.

Most hunters dont care, and they arent interested in making the effort to learn. For example... A deer with a "grey" face must me 8 years old etc etc. I watch the deer very closely in about a 12 square mile area around my home. On most years I will know of 2 bucks that make 4 yrs old in that area. In the last 14 years I can only think of about 5 deer that have made it to 5 years old, and I believe all of them were killed at age 5. I dont know of a buck thats lived to 6. Also, at least 3 of the 5, 5 yr olds, were killed by cars and not hunters!

In the 1000 acres section I hunt, a buck makes it to 4 1/2 about every 4 years. So for me, it makes it where now I rarely hunt 3 out of 4 years. I work harder to keep the deer alive than killing them on those years.

Its hard and its frustrating. You have to have hope that some can make it and your efforts are worth it or it is all for nothing. I cant feel good about shooting a 3 yr old anymore, I just cant. I dont like it but its the way it is. Getting pictures, finding sheds, creating habitat and food, those things now fill the void of NOT killing a deer so I find new satisfaction in them. I find it pure hypocrisy to preach the importance of passing 2 and 3 yr old deer only to kill one myself, that would show a serious lack of integrity. I have no problem with hunters shooting whatever they legally want. BUT dont complain about everyone killing little bucks and then killing one your self! At that moment you become part of the problem.

Have faith in what you are creating there and feel good about it. If you can't do that, then get the F#$% OUT and find a new spot! Life is too short!