Spring planted oats and clover ?

[bigboreblr]

Gotta see how my arm heals, but wated to plants oats is sandy spots at camp where last years plots didn't work so well.

If i had the tractor time from a club member, scoop up some rotted tree debris and stir it in with the box blade. Little patches of where we got open up there.

My club is up by lake effect snows. Anything to help fatten up the young a bit quicker to get them through the winter.

Also, deer herd up about 6 miles away. I focus on spring time attraction, more families of does at our camp than the ohers means more cruising bucks. Willow and red dogwwod has been a focus as well as stuff that greens up early.

 

[Foggy47]

Might as well throw in some radish and chicory to add to the buffet.

If the rest of your plot is annuals......why waste the money on perennials like Chicory? My 2 cents.

 

[Garrett S]

If the rest of your plot is annuals......why waste the money on perennials like Chicory? My 2 cents.

I’ve done it for infill if there is drought, add soil soil fracture increasing permeation


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[Wind Gypsy]

If the rest of your plot is annuals......why waste the money on perennials like Chicory? My 2 cents.

Because it's still good while you got it. Same as planting perennial/biennial clovers in a blend that's going to be terminated within a year for the next planting.

 

[Foggy47]

Because it's still good while you got it. Same as planting perennial/biennial clovers in a blend that's going to be terminated within a year for the next planting.

There is always a "yeah but". Grin. Yeah but, when you terminate the clover you do get a big benefit of the nitrogen that is released for the next crop. One of the primary reasons we grow legumes. ....and chicory is fairly expensive as an annual and really does not develop well until the second year (for me). .....your turn.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

There is always a "yeah but". Grin. Yeah but, when you terminate the clover you do get a big benefit of the nitrogen that is released for the next crop. One of the primary reasons we grow legumes. ....and chicory is fairly expensive as an annual and really does not develop well until the second year (for me). .....your turn.

Yeah but, the internet experts told me diversity is king and i like chicory.

Only ever bought it in clover blends so just looked at holy cow you're right, it's expensive.

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

Yeah but, the internet experts told me diversity is king and i like chicory.

Only ever bought it in clover blends so just looked at holy cow you're right, it's expensive.

It's like less than a dollar more a pound than white clovers. What am i missing?

 

[Wind Gypsy]

It's like less than a dollar more a pound than white clovers. What am i missing?

Only checked the Greencover website where they are over double the price of white clover. Maybe it's just high there.

 

[omicron1792]

Only checked the Greencover website where they are over double the price of white clover. Maybe it's just high there.

That place is high Gypsy. More and more I see what they are doing in their blends then just buy my own bulk seed at much cheaper

 

[bigboreblr]

That place is high Gypsy. More and more I see what they are doing in their blends then just buy my own bulk seed at much cheaper

I bought some of their milpa blend to sweeten up grain plantings.

They have some common stuff which you can get elsewhere for alot less. However, they got other offerings and varieties that are hard to find elsewhere.

 

[jsasker007]

I’ve done it for infill if there is drought, add soil soil fracture increasing permeation


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Both have deeper roots and bring up nutrients from farther down also.

 

[jsasker007]

If the rest of your plot is annuals......why waste the money on perennials like Chicory? My 2 cents.

After the annuals are gone you still have something there and both will reach deeper to bring up nutrients from farther down. jmo

 

[omicron1792]

After the annuals are gone you still have something there and both will reach deeper to bring up nutrients from farther down. jmo

I guess what Foggy is saying though is if on a summer and winter annual rotation you’ll be adding something back so having a perennial there doesn’t make a lot of sense. Probably would be killing the previous crop with crimper or gly so it wouldn’t be there.

That said chicory only takes a pound or two so treating as an annual no big deal.

 

[Foggy47]

I guess what Foggy is saying though is if on a summer and winter annual rotation you’ll be adding something back so having a perennial there doesn’t make a lot of sense. Probably would be killing the previous crop with crimper or gly so it wouldn’t be there.

That said chicory only takes a pound or two so treating as an annual no big deal.

Well, that depends on how much seed you use. Chicory costs $6. / lb at Welters on todays price list. If you throw down the 4 to 6 lbs / acre recommended for a "mix".....you'r adding $24 to $36 dollars / acre for something of short term use.

If I were to add chicory to ten acres of this stuff.....then I am adding $240 to $360 / 10 acres. I'm a tight wad. I rest my case.

 

[Bowman]

Oats are a great nurse crop. If you are planting early, I would also consider barley. Buckwheat needs 60 degree soil temperature for best germination. As an aside, oats as nurse crop for buckwheat did well planted late May. I am in Northern lower peninsula in Michigan. I do not use herbicides and overseed all of my plots. Can you mow? Seeding clovers and brassicas (small seed) can be done before mowing the seeded out oats for free Fall seed and another round as a nurse crop. Medium Red is great. Depending on your plans, perennial clovers do well Fall established, then ready to go in the Spring. Fall planted Chicory helps in my sand ground dry Summers.

 

[Foggy47]

Well, that depends on how much seed you use. Chicory costs $6. / lb at Welters on todays price list. If you throw down the 4 to 6 lbs / acre recommended for a "mix".....you'r adding $24 to $36 dollars / acre for something of short term use.

If I were to add chicory to ten acres of this stuff.....then I am adding $240 to $360 / 10 acres. I'm a tight wad. I rest my case.

Re-reading and replaying to my own post here:...... I did buy a few lbs of Chicory from Welter. Gonna add 2 lbs chicory to my mix and drill it in July with my brassica and clovers. I need to see if this practice continues.......but I have seen chicory a mega favorite for deer in late fall.....and late fall is vital to my success.

 

[bigboreblr]

How'd you make out Garret?

Mixing in some seeds that can over winter is not a bad idea when your 6 hours away. We all have tons of plans for our spots. Sometimes life gets in the way of those. Adding some perennial seeds for a few dollars could make a huge difference if you don't get a chnce to fall seed. Especially if you rely of herbicide. Wht if the weekend you can make it it's raining, almost all spraying options are toast there.

I feel like adding a bit more clover than needed as a plan B sometimes. I feel like medium red clover in a northeast annual crop. IT lives a 2nd year, but I use it for faster growth than the white clovers. Although dutch white can sure surprise you well some years.

If you got a mower and the clover is doing well. Spread some more oats in the late summer. This site has turned my interest into using rye much more. But, there absolutely nothing wrong with mixing oats or even wheat in there too. Rye is cheap far as time and energy working the soil and little to no lime / fertilizer needed.

 

[Garrett S]

Hey guys. Sorry for the delay on updates and participating on the forum. Stupid busy and riding the roller coaster of land ownership.

So, like most, we had a drought. Bad. Chit soil with some lime(likely not enough), some fert on portions of previous clearings and nothing on some last minute areas opened up. Yup- rolling the dice and doing it wrong.

So- lots of oats and the clover mix in areas, clover, oats and rye in areas, and a little bit of chicory added in locations.

Another miss was no exclusion cage. I know- I’m making rookie moves left and right. Didn’t see much for signs of hard browsing- checked sd cards after I left and there are a lot of deer there daily.

How’d it do? Decent- if not surprisingly we’ll all things considered. I would absolutely do this again. Have a couple buddies that swear BF Oats beat my bin oats.. may give that a go with some annual clovers as BigBore suggested.

The only pics I had of the main area and they’re not representative. Again - this was chit soil (sandy clay), could w been prepped better, broadcast seeded the day before a rain and amongst a drought.

 

[Shearwood Forest]

I had a dozer open up some areas in April and I did something similar, came behind the dozer and scratched up the new dirt without spraying and seeded oats, clover, and peas. Turkeys worked the peas hard but the plots came in good and for zero chemicals they held weeds at bay fairly well and the oats certainly helped shade the clover during the drought. Now they are getting rain the clover is doing very well.

Now as we approach fall I need to figure out my next step, throw and mow and roll some fall blended seeds to fill in around the young clover and terminate the spring planted oats. I have some weeds I'd like to spray out but not at the expense of the clover so not sure I want to do a full termination and disc.

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[Garrett S]

I had a dozer open up some areas in April and I did something similar, came behind the dozer and scratched up the new dirt without spraying and seeded oats, clover, and peas. Turkeys worked the peas hard but the plots came in good and for zero chemicals they held weeds at bay fairly well and the oats certainly helped shade the clover during the drought. Now they are getting rain the clover is doing very well.

Now as we approach fall I need to figure out my next step, throw and mow and roll some fall blended seeds to fill in around the young clover and terminate the spring planted oats. I have some weeds I'd like to spray out but not at the expense of the clover so not sure I want to do a full termination and disc.

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Sounds like we are in similar places - well different in both NY geography and you have a disc at your place, lol

Any idea when and what you’ll make the call on next steps? Any ideas on the fall plant ?

My take is variations in percentage of rye, wheat, clovers and more brassicas. I might spot treat the bad weeds.


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