Poor growing advise again :)

[WTNUT]

Folks I have some growing questions:

1. I have two frostbite apple trees planted two years ago that have remained alive, but have put on the central leader and really no new growth. They were bare root from good nursery and were 111 or 118 but small caliber. I don't know whether I should give up on them and plant another variety or cut leader back in the spring. I know frost bite have low vigor but dang. You may assume soil in that orchard is ideal, good sunlight all other factors are good.

2. Like above, I have a Savignac pear and a Magness pear that fall into the same category as the apples above. Planted the same year and no growth. It is a different orchard you can make the same assumptions. Should I call it quits and replace or hang in there and cut the central leader back. I had some EMLA 7s a few years ago that I cut back after a few years and they are great now. These trees are a little worse though in their overall lack of growth,

 

[greyphase]

If you plant enough trees I think you will run into some that just don't grow for some reason. I've pulled a Pound apple from SLN that just sat there for 3 years and didn't grow. Replace it with an Enterprise on B118 this spring in the same hole and it has put on good growth o_O. Have my eye on 1 or 2 others who just may get pulled this fall and replaced.

 

[WTNUT]

Valid points. Another interesting fact is that Enterprise or Enterprize are loved by several. Yours did well. I have planted close to seven over the years from three different orchards and never had a single one grow.

 

[greyphase]

This apple tree growing sure isn't an exact science o_O.

 

[CrazyEd]

I have a frostbite, 4th year b118 from cummins. It has been a pretty good producer, it's first fruit last year and it had 12-15 fruits. This year it probably has 20-30. The apples are smallish in size and the tree gets CAR pretty seriously every year. Doesnt impact the fruit, just the leaves. If I was in your situation, it would be on the list to be replaced. Jury is still out on my farm, it might get re-grafted or replaced.

 

[Lot2Learn]

I have a couple of trees (both crabapples on b.118 roots) that lag the other trees and seem to want to grow 'bushy' rather then up.

I'm planning to prune a more-than-normal number of the side branches and give them a 50% extra dose of fertilizer in the Spring to see if that helps.

Edit: I may even head back the central leader to try to convince one of the other buds to 'take the lead'.

 

[Turkey Creek]

Definitely some truth in that not all trees are created equal. I can see it easily in my nursery. Some trees just dont seem get their poop together! It is hard to rogue out a tree that you have time invested in, but sometimes its for the better good.

WTNUT I would cut them back next winter and give them a shot of fertilizer if they dont respond then yank them. Sometimes there is an root issue as well not always the scions fault.

 

[WTNUT]

Definitely some truth in that not all trees are created equal. I can see it easily in my nursery. Some trees just dont seem get their poop together! It is hard to rogue out a tree that you have time invested in, but sometimes its for the better good.

WTNUT I would cut them back next winter and give them a shot of fertilizer if they dont respond then yank them. Sometimes there is an root issue as well not always the scions fault.

Yes it is hard to yank them out when you have time invested! As Wayne Newton says in his Vegas shows, Don't steal a man's time, it can't be replaced.

 

[chickenlittle]

I guess I'd have to know more about your motivation to remove them. Do you need to plant something else in those spots now? Are your original reasons for selecting those trees still valid? Or is this just the desire to do something and maybe teach the other trees a lesson?

I'd try a hard pruning and some fertilizer to shock them into life and re-evaluate next fall. If you still like the varieties and there is suitable scionwood, I'd consider grafting onto new rootstock or a mature tree.

I had a couple Dolgo bench grafts that did nothing but leaf out and stop. Each has 3 leaves today. Different rootstocks, different locations, same scionwood. Not sure why they did nothing more but they will grow up to be something else. I bud grafted them a couple weeks ago.

 

[Dan Wombles]

Most of my young trees have not grown well this year; too much rain. Apple trees need rain, but they don't like "wet feet" all the time.

 

[WTNUT]

I guess I'd have to know more about your motivation to remove them. Do you need to plant something else in those spots now? Are your original reasons for selecting those trees still valid? Or is this just the desire to do something and maybe teach the other trees a lesson?

I'd try a hard pruning and some fertilizer to shock them into life and re-evaluate next fall. If you still like the varieties and there is suitable scionwood, I'd consider grafting onto new rootstock or a mature tree.

I had a couple Dolgo bench grafts that did nothing but leaf out and stop. Each has 3 leaves today. Different rootstocks, different locations, same scionwood. Not sure why they did nothing more but they will grow up to be something else. I bud grafted them a couple weeks ago.

Motivation: I would prefer to not waste another year on them. Hard pruning would be hard - none are 36 inches tall. Now, if you follow my threads you may know I had an epic battle with Fireblight this year and lost 10-12 mature trees. Well not completely lost. They were cut back to 48 inch stumps and are still alive to be grafted in the spring. I may do some grafting, pull the roots and replace with a new tree.

 

[WTNUT]

Speaking of which what are some vigorous disease resistant varieties that can be grafted on to my mature trunks?

 

[dipper]

Yes it is hard to yank them out when you have time invested! As Wayne Newton says in his Vegas shows, Don't steal a man's time, it can't be replaced.

If u yank them I'll put them to good use!
Oh-just read u have fire blight, I'll pass now.

 

[sandbur]

Speaking of which what are some vigorous disease resistant varieties that can be grafted on to my mature trunks?

Chestnut crab.

 

[sandbur]

I have a couple of trees (both crabapples on b.118 roots) that lag the other trees and seem to want to grow 'bushy' rather then up.

I'm planning to prune a more-than-normal number of the side branches and give them a 50% extra dose of fertilizer in the Spring to see if that helps.

Edit: I may even head back the central leader to try to convince one of the other buds to 'take the lead'.

What is the natural growth form of those crabs?

 

[chummer]

I have two frostbite, 2nd leaf that are growing great. To the point, I also have three wolf river growing at very different rates. One has taken off, one is doing okay, and one is not doing much. The part I don't understand is the one not doing much is in the best soil and best location.

 

[WTNUT]

I have two frostbite, 2nd leaf that are growing great. To the point, I also have three wolf river growing at very different rates. One has taken off, one is doing okay, and one is not doing much. The part I don't understand is the one not doing much is in the best soil and best location.

Yes, I don't understand either. I have Wolf Rivers and they are by far the fasted growing trees I have and they are in three different orchards. I could get them to grow on a rock!

 

[WTNUT]

Here is what I ordered today. Get any bad ones. If I yank some, some of these will be the replacements.

 

[CrazyEd]

Here's a few pics of my 4th Leaf Frostbite B.118 - July 19th 2015.

Here's a few from 3rd Leaf (August 30th, 2014)

 

[Bowsnbucks]

WTNUT - I am certainly no expert, but I know from research and asking some university profs. that some crabs are more of an upright " tree " and some are more of a bushy shrub. You may have some of the bushy type.

Of the varieties you posted for your replacements ACN recommended Winecrisp and Enterprise to me as good DR types. Several university profs. basically all said Liberty, Enterprise, Goldrush, Freedom, Galarina, Priscilla, Florina Querina, and Winecrisp for DR varieties. They are currently the MOST disease-resistant varieties out there. Others have some DR, but the above varieties have the strongest resistance to most of the major diseases. This info is from the profs. and 4 major nurseries - not my own expertise. I'm too new - and still gathering as much info as I can from multiple sources.

I should add that the above varieties are regular apples. There are crabs that are as good or better than the above for DR. Some of the other guys on here have more experience with the crabs - wild and grafted. From my OWN experience, crabs in general have less disease probs. than regular apples. Less headache to grow.