Grafting rootstock vs. bareroot

[westonwhitetail]

What is the difference in timeframe to get a tree to production when grafting on rootstock vs. buying a bareroot tree? I have a local nursery that has beautiful bareroot trees that I started my orchard with in 2021. These bareroots are 5-8 feet tall at the time of planting. Currently I have planted 18 bareroot trees from them, 16 trees have made it thus far (I had a couple get girdled). Last spring, instead of buying bareroot, I grafted 10 trees using scions from my original trees to bareroot I purchased (Emla 111). To my surprise 10/10 made it. I have those in pots still and will overwinter them at home and plant in the orchard in the spring. How long will it take these young trees to produce that I grafted? I will graft another batch this spring but I'm wondering if I should buy more bareroots as well to help speed production of the orchard along? I just don't know how many years ahead you are planting big bareroot trees vs. starting from rootstock.

 

[Telemark]

Depends on the rootstock and the age of the bare root trees. Difference is probably a couple years, all else being equal.

 

[bigboreblr]

I personally think your about 2 years ahead buying grafted fruit trees.

Treating trees right with good caging, amending, fertilizing, and time spent on watering and planting. Its better just to buy if your goal is 25 or so trees.

It is fun to dabble with grafting. If you want a specific tree to live a 2nd life, then grafting is the only choice.

Planting a huge orchard, itll save money grafting your own. High mortality issues, then buy rootstock and graft on year 2 plamt where they will end up living.

The problem you get is you want a bunch of varieties, then your now 3 years behind the 8 ball if your one off variety dies.

You can fall plant grafted trees. You cant graft roosrock and plant in the fall. The graft will die. Close to impossible to buy rootstock in september for enough alive time for the graft to heal by fall.

Im new, but a fall planted tree is close to a years growth ahead of a spring plamted one a few months later. That bit of extra acclimation makes a noticeable difference for the 1st summer of growth.

Buy a 1/2 to sonetimes up to 3/4 inch tree for another 20 bucks. Also, some rootstocks you get are too thin to graft year 1. I have alot of rootstock thst was too thin in my nusery sucking up a year....

What guys like turkey creek charge extremely worth it.

500 bucks for a dozen trees. shipped trees, cages, ammendments, mulched. So much better than buying another gun to park in a safe.......

Buy about 10-12 trees a year, you save on shipping.

 

[CrazyEd]

Definitely a few years ahead buying vs grafting. However, grafting is a fraction of the price. I bought my first 30 trees and grafted 150 more after that. the timing worked out because we could only handle planting about 25 trees per year. So we always new there was another class of trees waiting in the nursery for their turn. I’ve got 25ish 3-4 year old trees in my nursery, and grafting another 25 this spring. That means in 2025 I likely won’t have to bust my ass planting the 2024 trees :)

Many of the trees I grafted over the years started producing in year 3-4. However, do yourself a solid and pick the fruit off the first few years if you have the discipline to do so. Let the young tree grow roots and wood. The first 5-8 years should focus on getting the tree as large as possible as fast as possible. IMO.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Many of the trees I grafted over the years started producing in year 3-4. However, do yourself a solid and pick the fruit off the first few years if you have the discipline to do so. Let the young tree grow roots and wood. The first 5-8 years should focus on getting the tree as large as possible as fast as possible. IMO.

Great advice, IMO!

 

[Skye King]

Should I buy now or wait until spring?

 

[bigboreblr]

Should I buy now or wait until spring?

Order now. Places are sold out of some things.

Buy turkey creeks last freedom on m111 so i stop staring at it.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I'd recommend buying a few of the more expensive, larger trees to start so you have something producing fruit as quickly as possible. I did that the first couple years at my house by planting maybe 20 trees from SLN. After that, I got into grafting and was able to graft my own trees at a fraction of the cost. The tree you graft is about 2 years behind the potted tree you buy at a store, but going that route can save you a lot of money over time. I currently graft about 25 apple trees every spring and my cost is about the price of buying 2 larger apple trees from a nursery.

 

[westonwhitetail]

Thanks for the replies guys. After thinking about it, I'm gonna plan to graft around 10 trees each year from my existing trees. Then I will add bareroots when I want new apple varieties i want to add to the mix.

 

[H20fwler]

Best thing about bare root trees, instant gratification.
Best thing about grafting, easier to get the variety of tree with rootstock you want and hard to find varieties.

 

[bigboreblr]

Puting your rootstock right ehere you want a tree will probably save a year., jnstead of a nursery spot then moving to a permanent home. Avoid having transplant shock a 2nd time. I use root making pots for some trees, likely will buy some more for 100% grow pot. This way you can late summer transplant without shock.

 

[Dantana]

Puting your rootstock right ehere you want a tree will probably save a year., jnstead of a nursery spot then moving to a permanent home. Avoid having transplant shock a 2nd time. I use root making pots for some trees, likely will buy some more for 100% grow pot. This way you can late summer transplant without shock.

New to grafting. What root maker pots do you use?

 

[bigboreblr]

I use the cheap knockoffs on amazon. 3 gallon, 10 are $40. Thinking og buying the 5 gsllon 10 for $50. Friend of mine is getting new house and hes putting an addition on and redoing yard. So planting wont be till july or so. Got him a bareroot or two and will graft 2 more. A bareroot might be a bit snug even for the 5 gallon. The place I buy my trees from is good, but the trees arent as big as other places. However, smaller transplants ususaly do better as a general gardening rule.

 

[Teeder]

I'm hardly an expert at grafting. I just did my first this past spring, but I had real good results grafting onto rootstock that I planted the spring before. Some of my grafts are over 6' tall this year, starting from about 6-8" off the ground. I think I only lost 2 out of about 20.

 

[bigboreblr]

Very hard to buy back time. However, 25 bucks for a tree you wanted to plant 2 ywars ago but didnt is an easy one.

Between the price of an acre, taxes, gas driving there, etc these trees are a deal.

In january or febuary most places have clearance sales. Between the economy and last summers drought, might have a few teees to pick from. Some go for $12 each.

 

[Dantana]

I use the cheap knockoffs on amazon. 3 gallon, 10 are $40. Thinking og buying the 5 gsllon 10 for $50. Friend of mine is getting new house and hes putting an addition on and redoing yard. So planting wont be till july or so. Got him a bareroot or two and will graft 2 more. A bareroot might be a bit snug even for the 5 gallon. The place I buy my trees from is good, but the trees arent as big as other places. However, smaller transplants ususaly do better as a general gardening rule.

I have 15 rootstocks from Blue Hill coming in the spring. I also have a dozen or so root suckers from wild trees at deer camp that I plan to dig up and graft onto.

Since I am new to grafting, I had initially planned to graft then plant in my garden the first year so I can baby them. Then transplant the following spring at the hunting property. But your advice is to put them in their final destination right off the bat?

 

[Dantana]

Very hard to buy back time. However, 25 bucks for a tree you wanted to plant 2 ywars ago but didnt is an easy one.

Between the price of an acre, taxes, gas driving there, etc these trees are a deal.

In january or febuary most places have clearance sales. Between the economy and last summers drought, might have a few teees to pick from. Some go for $12 each.

I’ve spent well over $1000 on fruit trees the last few years. I’m not getting any younger and I want these producing as quickly as possible. Buying the biggest sizes I can. Probably close to 50 at camp alone and another dozen at home. I’m excited to see how they do. My heavy clay soils seem to push back the wait time til first crops by a couple years but a few are starting to produce.

Now it’s time to back off on the bigger trees and try my hand at grafting. Late holding trees will be the first to get grafted.

 

[bigboreblr]

You can graft and put in your backyard nursery. Prune well when you transplant next year. If they will live ok at their permanemt home, it is better. Fall transplant I believe is better than spring. In fact, planted blue permain amd a big dog on M111 mid day between am and pm sits. I am hunring like 10 yards from them now.

I chamged my mind on this AWHO. This one will be in my yard.




Each tree planted got dug down to about 2ft deep. Mixed in 1/2 bag garden soil, handul of 15-15-15, four 21gram agiform fertilizer tablets, a 4ft 8in diameter cage, a full bag of mulch, and use sticks to keep deer away. Seems to work ok at camp

 

[Angus 1895]

You can graft and put in your backyard nursery. Prune well when you transplant next year. If they will live ok at their permanemt home, it is better. Fall transplant I believe is better than spring. In fact, planted blue permain amd a big dog on M111 mid day between am and pm sits. I am hunring like 10 yards from them now.

I chamged my mind on this AWHO. This one will be in my yard.

View attachment 60616


Each tree planted got dug down to about 2ft deep. Mixed in 1/2 bag garden soil, handul of 15-15-15, four 21gram agiform fertilizer tablets, a 4ft 8in diameter cage, a full bag of mulch, and use sticks to keep deer away. Seems to work ok at camp

It will be interesting if the fertilizer helps .

My reading and experience leans me towards not fertilizing other than what might be in my potting soil I mix with native dirt.

What kind of pot is that?

Thanks
Happy Holidays and good luck

 

[bigboreblr]

That one you see is the 3 gallon version of this.

Amazon.com

Fertilizer shouldn't touch the roots. I keep them a few inches away from the roots. I fertilize a fraction of what I do at home when I plant up at camp. Clay soil absorbs nurtients much more than sandy soil. In fact I bring clay soil up to camp to mix with the sandy soil. The clay holds nutrients as well as moisture.

I did use 15-15-15. Nitrogen is the worst ingredient to roots. I usually use 6-24-24. Again, I take some mixed soil out, then fertilize what I have dug up and loosened. Since I will not be visiting these spots often, I put some more fetilizer in a circle larger than the dug up spot.