MN bills introduced to allow crossbows during archery season.

[4wanderingeyes]

For my county, Washburn, the population is about 16,000, the dnr offers 10,000-13,000 doe permits the last ~5 years. They dont sell out, but they really think the wolves leave a lot of deer to shoot.

 

[bueller]

10 year period from 1999-2008, Juneau County averaged approximately 8,800 deer per year with a peak of nearly 14,000 in 2000. Since 2008 we haven't stopped 5,000. Must be the crossbows...

 

[sandbur]

I long for the good old days when people celebrated a successful hunt together. If someone shot a legal deer and was happy with it, everybody congratulated him/ her.

I blame one National deer organization for it’s promotion of mature deer. This has led to a competition and a blaming of neighboring hunters for their choices in harvest. Besides, in the present world of cwd, mature deer are often not a good thing.

I don’t like the idea of crossbows for all in archery season, but will still do my best to enjoy a hunt. Don’t fret over what you can’t change and move on. Make the best of it.

Increased hunting pressure drives deer into pockets. Find those pockets.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

I agree with sandbur, who cares what other people shoot, as long as it was legal. I was spoiled growing up, with having a great spot to hunt, lots of big racked deer, not booners, but large deer for the area I was in.

After the city annexed the area, and decided it was then city limits, it became no hunting. Shortly after that I bought my own land, it had very few bucks over 2yo, so it was an adjustment from what I was use too. I had to adjust so I could put some meat in the freezer. Then hunting became fun again. My kids at the time were just getting old enough to hunt, so I never put restrictions on what they can hunt, it made them happy, and to this day they love to hunt.

If what others shoot makes them happy, I am not standing in their way. It is none of my business.

My present goals have changed some, since I live on my land now, and I have more time to be in the woods, but if I happen to shoot a basket six, I will still be happy, and I would be happy if my kids do as well.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

As for the crossbow situation, I don’t think it will change much. With MN only allowing 1 buck tag, regardless of licenses, it won’t make a big difference. There is only a certain percentage of hunters that will be in the woods, some people that use bow will switch to a crossbow, some gun hunters will switch to crossbow, some new hunters will hunt because they can use a more accurate device, and some physically impaired people will use crossbow, in the end it will average out. If you factor in that crossbow will wound less deer, so each hunter will kill and wound less deer before they fill their tags, it will be close to a wash in the long term.

In the next 10-15 years a large amount of the hunting population will retire from hunting, leaving just the new comers, and they will be vastly outnumbered by liberals wanting to ban hunting, so they know they need to do as much as possible to recruit new hunters.

If the dnr successfully does their job, the deer won’t be over hunted.

And large racks don’t make a deer herd healthy, deer ratios, and food makes the herd healthy. Anyone pushing restrictions for the sake of large racks, always come out to me as being selfish. Don’t shoot my deer, shoot only the size deer I prefer, then get mad when your neighbor legally shoots the big deer in the neighborhood.

 

[bwoods11]

Do not count on the DNR to successfully do their job. Not in Minnesota. I could type for an hour about the mismanagement of this state !!

 

[Tree Spud]

Do not count on the DNR to successfully do their job. Not in Minnesota. I could type for an hour about the mismanagement of this state !!

That's why when someone stated they wished they had Wis deer rule structure I laughed. When the closet your head of the DNR has been to the outdoors is looking at an Orvis catalogue, you are in trouble.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

Do not count on the DNR to successfully do their job. Not in Minnesota. I could type for an hour about the mismanagement of this state !!

I had lived in MN most of my life, until just the last couple years when I moved to WISCONSIN.

I lived in southern MN, and one example of their fine work, there zones, on one side of the highway, you could shoot 1 buck and 5 does. The other side of the highway, it was 1 buck, no does. Trust me, I could go on and on as well. But I did say “IF”

 

[Spike_Horn_Shooter]

I like Ohios game law structure the best. 1 Buck. 1 doe on public land. Any bow season from late sept - Jan/February. Rifle in December. Muzzleloader in Jan.

If you want to meat hunt - shoot something and get out of the woods.

In VT we can shoot 4 does on public/private and 1 buck. I wish they would change that to 1 buck and 1 doe on private. Want to shoot 4 does on your private land - go ahead- deal with the consequences next year.

What I see is the state doing pop studies on a county average and the heavily posted ag lands are overrun with deer. The public lands in those areas are all but devoid of life.

On public, everyone shoots the 1st doe they see (65lb) during archery, then goes back for more during archery. Then everyone goes back out during antlerless muzzleloader season and smashes the 1st doe they see, because they still have tags for a doe during late archery.

I wish we as hunters could say 1 doe on public land is enough. Myself, I limit myself to 1 doe, then work on putting my kids on deer, usually 1 more for them.

It’s pretty obvious that the individuals making the game laws don’t hunt public land.

If we truly wanted to recruit more hunters - just say 1 deer per person regardless of public / private. If you are overrun with does on your managed private land with food plots etc - you would need to invite a buddy or two and their kids to shoot off some does. Thus giving someone else the drive and love for hunting.

 

[Mtyhunter]

i deer hunt in several different spots in oklahoma, 2 of them are camera'd up with good intel. my main spot literally has a buck/doe ratio of 3-1. Another spot i frequent has a ratio of 1-1. These 2 areas are about 50 miles apart, no agriculture on either, same type of hardwood, except the actual dirt is different. I also put in for oklahoma lottery hunts, and been fortunate to draw in to quite a few hunts that's allowed me to hunt across the entire state. Point is, the buck/doe ratio, from what i have seen, is all over the board. Usually when I've hunted public land, seems like the ratio is around 1-5. I'm all good with harvesting a doe to fill the freezer, especially with a bow, but it completely depends on where I'm hunting.
Oklahoma has a pretty liberal limit of 6 per year, no more than 2 antlered. There are special antlerless zones, special dates for antlerless, and they can change from year to year. Over the years, I have noticed that most of these antlerless zones/dates/special youth hunts does coincide with what I see in the woods. It makes me feel like our wildlife dept is in tune with what's needed, so i support them. That being said, they still have to "paint with a broad brush" when it comes to making these zoning decisions, so I'm not going to freak out when a very concise area may not exactly fit with what they're putting in place.
Lastly, I've commented before about basically being ok with xbow hunting, even though my old school ways make me feel a little off on it. I know there's a ton of harvest data out there to assimilate, but honestly, I don't need a fancy report to tell me what my eyeballs can already see. I just haven't noticed any negative impact on deer herds since xbows have been legal in Oklahoma.
I hate it that some of you have issues with your state wildlife dept'sn decisions. I would be just as passionate as you if I felt that way, I'd go to our wildlife headquarters, meet with the biologists involved, and get the real story as to what's going on. When I talk with our guys here, I've found they're way more savvy than me, so it's mostly shut up, listen, and learn.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

In my area, the DNR regulate doe permits by county, the problem is my county is rather large, mostly private ag land to the south, and large forest area to the north filled with wolves, and a lot of public land. The farm land owners to the south complain of deer crop damage, so the DNR hands out more tags, the problem is most of the ag farmers don’t let other people hunt, and there is very little public land in the south portion of the county. So when they hand out all of the tags, people flock to the northern forest area with all of their doe tags, and shoot anything brown that moves. Then the wolves take a decent portion of the remaining deer. Our county needs to be divided north and south, a broad brush doesn’t work here.


I say this, right after I saw ~25 deer in my food plot this morning right off my back deck.

I also walked out to loosen up some straps on deer stands, and found a lot of tree damage from a porcupine, and located the trouble maker.

 

[sandbur]

Who is old enough to remember the debates about compounds versus stick bows?

There even was a debate about flashers(green box) being too much for the fishing resource.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

Who is old enough to remember the debates about compounds versus stick bows?

There even was a debate about flashers(green box) being too much for the fishing resource.

My grandparents bought me a recurve when I was about 7, but when I started bow hunting in 1983, I bought a new Bear compound bow. I was almost 13. I never hunted with a recurve, even though I shot one thousands of times.

 

[Angus 1895]

You edited 10 minutes after I posted, so no, I didn't see it.

The overwhelming point that myself and other MN residents are trying to make is that crossbows DEFINITELY increase archery success (which is totally fine) in a state where it is already extremely easy to fill tag(s) with an early Nov rifle/shotgun season, 16 day muzzle loader season, etc.

So, clearly increasing the amount of hunters and success during archery season isn't necessary and will further impact the quality of hunting. Give the crossbow boys a week of their own time between gun and muzzle loader and call it good.

The elephant in the room is party hunting antelered deer.

there are plenty of hunters who refuse to shoot females……..

but if its ok to use yer buddy’s tag…….archery?……..they better hire mo fish cops if u gonna make sure it was a proper party hunt.

 

[Angus 1895]

Here in my home state of Idaho I cannot harvest an antlered elk unless I draw In a lottery.

I can buy an OTC archery tag…….but the highway between my properties divide the units.

So I can’t hunt both of the areas I spent 10 years developing. I gotta pick one side of the highway.

and I get September to do it. Most September days are probably too hot to hunt elk on top of the mountain with a bow …if u don’t want to cook the bugger the day you got it!

So lately been thumping cows near hayfields( by the house )with the bull blowing snot at me while I do it.

 

[356]

In talking with family members (who are hunters), it has been a few years since anyone harvested a deer during bow or firearms season. The younger guys (late 30s, early 40s) said they would love to hunt with a crossbow, as sometimes they get busted during the draw.

With the prospect of hunting on her family's land in northern Minnesota, I looked up the state regulations. While there are some management based practices, there are aspects of Minnesota's regulations that do not make much sense--including buck only zones. I was surprised how low the harvest rate (16%) was in Northern Minnesota. I see lots of deer and deer sign, however, I saw little evidence of private land owner management. Here in Missouri, you see evidence food plots, stands and habitats work when taking a Sunday drive.

I did scope out a couple of great trees for a bow (or crossbow) stand and some a great opening for a late season plot--plus there is already a tractor and some old implements on site.

 

[SD51555]

In talking with family members (who are hunters), it has been a few years since anyone harvested a deer during bow or firearms season. The younger guys (late 30s, early 40s) said they would love to hunt with a crossbow, as sometimes they get busted during the draw.

With the prospect of my wife inheriting some of farm land in northern Minnesota, I looked up the state regulations. While there are some management based practices, there are aspects of Minnesota's regulations that do not make much sense--including buck only zones. I was surprised how low the harvest rate (16%) was in Northern Minnesota. I see lots of deer and deer sign, however, I saw little evidence of private land owner management. Here in Missouri, you see evidence food plots, stands and habitats work when taking a Sunday drive.

I did scope out a couple of great trees for a bow (or crossbow) stand and some a great opening for a late season plot--plus there is already a tractor and some old implements on site.

The harvest totals in zone 1 have been going down for years. You have to have improved private land to have a chance at seeing 'a deer' on a regular basis. It's sad to talk to person after person at the social club and hear how entire camps (hunting public) hadn't seen anything at all in a week. That's a product of low populations, and intense and sloppy human pressure on every inch of public ground during the 3 weeks leading up to rifle season, and the week of rifle season.

 

[bwoods11]

The harvest totals in zone 1 have been going down for years. You have to have improved private land to have a chance at seeing 'a deer' on a regular basis. It's sad to talk to person after person at the social club and hear how entire camps (hunting public) hadn't seen anything at all in a week. That's a product of low populations, and intense and sloppy human pressure on every inch of public ground during the 3 weeks leading up to rifle season, and the week of rifle season.

Zone 1 in Minnesota is in serious trouble. Public land is a total mess .

In my area, West Central MN they cut the trees down on public, and in some cases graze it with cattle ??

Pheasant hunters bump a lot of the deer out of public ground, and then there’s a youth hunt in mid-October. By the time the gun season rolls around, very few deer are on public land (in my area) which is grassland/sloughs/cattails/creeks etc..

We do have a few wooded areas of public land and they hold some deer. It’s just terrible management. No cover, no habitat improvements, zero food plots !

 

[SwampCat]

Who is old enough to remember the debates about compounds versus stick bows?

There even was a debate about flashers(green box) being too much for the fishing resource.

And now forward facing sonar

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

As for the crossbow situation, I don’t think it will change much. With MN only allowing 1 buck tag, regardless of licenses, it won’t make a big difference. There is only a certain percentage of hunters that will be in the woods, some people that use bow will switch to a crossbow, some gun hunters will switch to crossbow, some new hunters will hunt because they can use a more accurate device, and some physically impaired people will use crossbow, in the end it will average out. If you factor in that crossbow will wound less deer, so each hunter will kill and wound less deer before they fill their tags, it will be close to a wash in the long term.

In the next 10-15 years a large amount of the hunting population will retire from hunting, leaving just the new comers, and they will be vastly outnumbered by liberals wanting to ban hunting, so they know they need to do as much as possible to recruit new hunters.

If the dnr successfully does their job, the deer won’t be over hunted.

And large racks don’t make a deer herd healthy, deer ratios, and food makes the herd healthy. Anyone pushing restrictions for the sake of large racks, always come out to me as being selfish. Don’t shoot my deer, shoot only the size deer I prefer, then get mad when your neighbor legally shoots the big deer in the neighborhood.

Many MN zones now allow a buck to be shot with each weapon type, plus unlimited bucks (and does) during the late CWD hunts. Adding crossbows will increase the buck kill.