Bowsnbucks
5 year old buck +
YES!!! I've seen and HEARD bears crunching hickory nuts. Don't know how their teeth survive. We had a bear lay right down under a cluster of hickories and fill his gut for about 2 hours.
Mature mast trees and vines.
- Thread starter bigboreblr
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Learned a lesson on Tordon(Pathway) use... I won't use it on anything within the root system of a desirable tree.
Have a nice grafted mulberry (Lawson Dawson) growing in my barnlot. There was a hackberry seedling that had come up close to the trunk of the mulberry... maybe 1" diameter at the base. Snipped it off with loppers and sprayed the stub with Pathway. Made that 10 ft mulberry sick for 2 full years - curled, deformed leaves, no fruiting. It grew out of it, but taught me a lesson. If it's growing near a desirable tree, I'll use straight 41% gly on it; even if there are root-grafts, its unlikely to kill a larger, well-established tree.
I'm a hickory enthusiast... have over 50 named hickory clones grafted and growing here, most on northern pecan rootstock. I'll remove oaks & walnuts to favor a GOOD shagbark or shellbark. There are some shagbark selections that have a shell thinner than some pecans. I could probably crack them with my teeth, but I'm not gonna risk it!.
Have a nice grafted mulberry (Lawson Dawson) growing in my barnlot. There was a hackberry seedling that had come up close to the trunk of the mulberry... maybe 1" diameter at the base. Snipped it off with loppers and sprayed the stub with Pathway. Made that 10 ft mulberry sick for 2 full years - curled, deformed leaves, no fruiting. It grew out of it, but taught me a lesson. If it's growing near a desirable tree, I'll use straight 41% gly on it; even if there are root-grafts, its unlikely to kill a larger, well-established tree.
I'm a hickory enthusiast... have over 50 named hickory clones grafted and growing here, most on northern pecan rootstock. I'll remove oaks & walnuts to favor a GOOD shagbark or shellbark. There are some shagbark selections that have a shell thinner than some pecans. I could probably crack them with my teeth, but I'm not gonna risk it!.
Apple Junkie
5 year old buck +
That is really useful information regarding Tordon.
Regarding hickories, I am also a bit surprised by the number of different varieties of hickories there are. I am ignorant about that, but you’ve piqued my interest for sure. I have always favored oaks over hickories, but on my ground, it seems to be either a hickory stand – or - an oak stand, but not equally mixed. They seem to prefer different soils, but that is just an observation on my part, nothing more.
Oaks predominate my woods, but there's a good component of hickories...mostly shagbark, but some pignut, mockernut, and red hickory. The last 3 really only good for squirrels or firewood.
Shellbark & bitternut hickories are common along the creek.
I'm more likely to cut an oak than a hickory if I'm dropping live trees to cut up to burn.
No really good hickories where I grew up, in Alabama...just mockernut & pignut.
Shellbark & bitternut hickories are common along the creek.
I'm more likely to cut an oak than a hickory if I'm dropping live trees to cut up to burn.
No really good hickories where I grew up, in Alabama...just mockernut & pignut.
Photo of a couple of local hickories... shagbark on the left took 1st place at KY State Fair, in 2001; shellbark on the right is the most productive nut tree, of any species, I've ever encountered, and fortunately, cracks out pretty easily for a shellbark.
Also, photo of a shellbark seedling I grew from seednuts of 'Fayette', planted in 1998. Thin shell, for a shellbark, open central cavity, cracks out mostly intact halves.
Also, photo of a shellbark seedling I grew from seednuts of 'Fayette', planted in 1998. Thin shell, for a shellbark, open central cavity, cracks out mostly intact halves.
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bigboreblr
5 year old buck +
Absolutely love hickories. In terms of the act of hunting, i prefer to hunt squirrels. You go to a stand of oaks in spetember, dead quiet. Find a lone hickory trees, they're 20 on it. I tagged out on one hickory tree. I forgot the reason, theyre not doing so hot in NY. I do what I can for any mast tree on my property.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Interesting. Things are a bit different here. In good mast crop years, squirrels seem to be well distributed through out the oaks. There are some in hickories, but certainly no more density than in the oaks. However, when we have a poor acorn crop, it seems like all the squirrels in the woods move to the hickory groves. It is much as you describe in those poor acorn crop years here.
H20fwler
5 year old buck +
I have a lot of hickories in my little woods most are shag bark, squirrels do love them. Some of the older trees go hollow then the tops blow off making stove pipes that are a pain when coon hunting.
My favorites are what I call pig hickory or maybe red hickory...the wood ducks love them, it always amazes me that they can eat the dime sized nuts. I've seen them under them gorging on them in fall, I have shot woodies with their craw stuffed with them.
I also like hickory for firewood it splits really good.
I started four thin shelled pecan trees from nuts gathered at a buddies house two years ago...will be moving those to farm to plant along the edge of woods.
My favorites are what I call pig hickory or maybe red hickory...the wood ducks love them, it always amazes me that they can eat the dime sized nuts. I've seen them under them gorging on them in fall, I have shot woodies with their craw stuffed with them.
I also like hickory for firewood it splits really good.
I started four thin shelled pecan trees from nuts gathered at a buddies house two years ago...will be moving those to farm to plant along the edge of woods.
Knehrke
5 year old buck +
I will add to the cautionary note regarding Tordon. I loved the stuff when I first purchased the property - but it appears to be able to transfer between root systems that are bound together underground. I lost several mature trees doing exactly what's proposed here. I also killed lots of vines without damage to trees. But those few were enough to get me to move to concentrated GlyPhos as an alternative. I consider Tordon to be one of my "mistakes" - as per another thread - along with tree tubes of course lol.
I've never lived in an area in a major waterfowl flyway - seeing a few ducks here and there is a rarity... so I know almost nothing about their feeding habits. I would suspect that oaks making tiny acorns - like water oak(Q.nigra) and willow oak (Q.phellos) would be great mast trees for them - and being in the red oak group, they're 'high-oil'-content species.
IIRC, MO Dept of Conservation selected - and I think Forrest Keeling Nursery was offering grafted specimens of - a native pecan, 'Tiny Tim'(or something like that) that had tiny little nuts... like in the range of 300+/lb, intended for planting out as a mast/nut source for ducks.
Here it is: https://cgru.usda.gov/CARYA/PECANS/tiny tim.htm
I've never found hickory nuts in a deer's rumen contents, but I know for a fact that they'll hoover up pecans when they're dropping.
IIRC, MO Dept of Conservation selected - and I think Forrest Keeling Nursery was offering grafted specimens of - a native pecan, 'Tiny Tim'(or something like that) that had tiny little nuts... like in the range of 300+/lb, intended for planting out as a mast/nut source for ducks.
Here it is: https://cgru.usda.gov/CARYA/PECANS/tiny tim.htm
I've never found hickory nuts in a deer's rumen contents, but I know for a fact that they'll hoover up pecans when they're dropping.
b116757
5 year old buck +
I have several native pecan trees on my home place deer do indeed eat them. In fact I cut down a 18” DBH oak that was growing under an even larger pecan tree just because of that. Now had the oak tree been in the dominant position it could of just as easily gone the other way and the pecan could of been cut down. I do have several pecan that are very very poor mast producing trees as I do with some oaks it’s a roll of the dice as to what tree is going to be a heavy mast producer it seems like.
I know of two native pecan seedling trees in town here that produce tiny little nuts; one long & skinny, one round.
If I were running a nursery catering to waterfowlers, I'd probably be grafting both of those for sale... but I'm out to produce larger, better pecans for my own consumption!
I have one shagbark hickory, up in my woods, that produces a nut with shell thinner than some pecans... but I can almost never beat the squirrels & weevils to a nut to see how well it cracks out... think I got to 5 filled nuts one year... but I planted them (and forgot which ones they are). First limb is probably 35-40 ft up. Shot a 1" diameter branch out a few weeks ago , with a .22 rifle, to get scions to graft. Hope I live long enough to see if it was worth propagating or not.
If I were running a nursery catering to waterfowlers, I'd probably be grafting both of those for sale... but I'm out to produce larger, better pecans for my own consumption!
I have one shagbark hickory, up in my woods, that produces a nut with shell thinner than some pecans... but I can almost never beat the squirrels & weevils to a nut to see how well it cracks out... think I got to 5 filled nuts one year... but I planted them (and forgot which ones they are). First limb is probably 35-40 ft up. Shot a 1" diameter branch out a few weeks ago , with a .22 rifle, to get scions to graft. Hope I live long enough to see if it was worth propagating or not.
bigbendmarine
5 year old buck +
On the hickory note, got an absolute monster growing in my front yard -- it's the tallest tree with the lighter green leaves to the left in this photo I took yesterday. It's surrounded by live oaks in the photo, and the live oaks are NOT babies - best guess it the live oaks are over 100 years old as they show up well in aerial photos taken back in the 1950s.
Used a drone a few years back to estimate the height of the hickory and it came in just a tad under 100 feet tall. Definitely not a shagbark, but not sure exactly what type it is -- nuts have tasty meat, but are NOT thin shelled and even when I've cracked some open it's been darn near impossible to get much meat out.
Feral hogs crunch the ever-living crap out of them. Have had a dog or two that liked doing so as well. Makes my teeth hurt listening to either the hogs or dogs cracking them.
Used a drone a few years back to estimate the height of the hickory and it came in just a tad under 100 feet tall. Definitely not a shagbark, but not sure exactly what type it is -- nuts have tasty meat, but are NOT thin shelled and even when I've cracked some open it's been darn near impossible to get much meat out.
Feral hogs crunch the ever-living crap out of them. Have had a dog or two that liked doing so as well. Makes my teeth hurt listening to either the hogs or dogs cracking them.
I would bet on your hickory being a mockernut (C.tomentosa). They have, perhaps, the tastiest nutmeats of any of the hickories... approaching black walnut, but not off-putting. But... the shell thickness and internal convolutions preclude our ability to get more than just little fragments of nutmeat out. There is at least one mockernut 'cultivar' (Lakeview or Lakeside) that was selected for better cracking characteristics, but I've not seen the nut; I got one scion of it, 20 yrs ago, but had no success grafting it, and don't know anyone who still has it
Other possibility includes pignut (C.glabra) ... some of them are quite tasty - but also thick-shelled... but some have an 'off-taste' about them.
But none are such a cruel joke of nature as bitternut hickory... really thin shells, packed with oily kernel... but so astringent that they'll turn your mouth inside-out like a green persimmon. But... the tannins are water-soluble, so there are folks who are pursuing them as an oilseed crop, cold-pressing them for their oil. I've got a bottle of bitternut hickory oil in the fridge, as we speak... https://www.foragersharvest.com/store/p240/HickoryNutOil.html
They're also processing acorn oil, mainly using water oak and Southern red oak acorns... https://www.foragersharvest.com/store/p331/AcornOil.html
Other possibility includes pignut (C.glabra) ... some of them are quite tasty - but also thick-shelled... but some have an 'off-taste' about them.
But none are such a cruel joke of nature as bitternut hickory... really thin shells, packed with oily kernel... but so astringent that they'll turn your mouth inside-out like a green persimmon. But... the tannins are water-soluble, so there are folks who are pursuing them as an oilseed crop, cold-pressing them for their oil. I've got a bottle of bitternut hickory oil in the fridge, as we speak... https://www.foragersharvest.com/store/p240/HickoryNutOil.html
They're also processing acorn oil, mainly using water oak and Southern red oak acorns... https://www.foragersharvest.com/store/p331/AcornOil.html
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bigbendmarine
5 year old buck +
Lucky_P, sharing a few pics to see if it might help in pinning down the specific hickory type.
First is just to give an idea on just how big the tree truly is. Diameter is every bit of 5 feet and where roots flare towards bottom is almost 7 feet wide.
Picture showing the bark a bit closer...
Couldn't find any nuts still full, but here are two halves picked up off the ground...
Picked a few sets of leafs off.... some towards end had 5 leafs, but also others I could reach with 7.
Tree has really pretty color in the fall, though not sure if that helps differentiate the species much...
Switching gears just a bit, do believe I've got some bitternuts down near my pond, as the bark has a really distinct pattern I think is found on the bitternuts?
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