chummer
5 year old buck +
That’s different. I thought you meant general public.
Coronavirus
- Thread starter BuckSutherland
- Start date
- Status
chummer
5 year old buck +
Fun watching the Frankenstein mob assemble here. Grab your torches & pitchforks lets get the monster (China)!
You can use isolation and trade as weapon against countries like Iran, Syria, etc. because they have no consumer economy and their people are shut off from exposure to the real world (no internet, outside travel, etc.). If you use isolation strategies with China, it will backfire on the US.
China is a socialist country run by the communist party and party leaders are in a real dilemma. They are in the process of transforming from an agriculture based & agrarian culture and economy, to that of an industrialized nation. They have a huge and rapidly growing consumer based economy and what they need are jobs to support this move to an industrialized economy.
China also has the largest deposits in the world of rare earth minerals which are critical for Hi-tech production ... think computer memory & processing chips, LEDs, rechargeable batteries, flat screen TVs, cell phones, etc. They mine 10 times the volume of rare earth minerals that the US & Australia do and we are both a distant #2 & 3 in production.
If you shut off and isolate China, you can not help & manipulate the internal push by their people to democratize the country. By doing business with and in China, we gain valuable intelligence as to what is going on there and have leverage in their economy by the jobs & factories we have there. China needs the US just as much as we need them.
There is an old saying ... keep your friends close but keep your enemies closer. We have leverage with China and Trump understands this.
That’s all well and good but we have tried to push everything to China. Bring back the essentials we need. Let them make the shit in the dollar store.
Tree Spud
5 year old buck +
Simple solution to complex problem. Just like oil ... we won't stop being dependent on the Middle East, Russia, Venezuela, etc. until allow refineries to be built and support industries like fracking ... we are just a buyer not a supplier.
If you want the US to become more self reliant, support Trump and eliminate Libs who want to attack industry and have created unrealistic liability to do business in the US.
Remember ... climate change is a political agenda, deal with those who have forced industry offshore and created this mess.
Bill
Administrator
my wife “retired BSRN and critical care nurse” has been chewing my ear speculating this very thing about Italy for days..
FarmerDan
5 year old buck +
I have to but I can't. I can't but I have to. Some part of me wants to believe what I write here makes a difference. It's called magical thinking. No harm, no foul, I guess.
Look, we got some problems. Understatement, huh? What are you going to do about it? This country has faced many serious life changing events. All have been solved - after the sacrifice of many for people they knew and loved and for people like you and me to be able to express opinions, sometimes dumb opinions, but here we are.
1. We have a political problem. I don't care what party it is, government rarely ever has a plan and/or acts quickly enough to do anything but take everyone to the edge of disaster. I guess it's the adrenaline rush. Let's put politics behind us and stop listening to the talking heads in your party of choice.
THIS IS BAD.
2. We have a medical problem. None of us are immune to this one. Remember the Indians and small pox? We will do better. I have a job where, everyday, I report the number of confirmed cases to 'management.' In my state we now have 156 confirmed COVID infections. Believe what you want, but you have to pick a number. The number of undetected cases is 10 x to 50x the 156. Don't make me provide a source. I can if you want. It's been estimated the number of confirmed cases doubles every 3 days. In my state, so far it's 75%. Only 156 now, but if the progressions continues, there will be over 1-million by the end of April. I'm left to conclude we are all going to get it -sooner or later - and later is better. Maybe the hospital will have a bed for me then. You will survive - and be immune, but we have....
3. An economic problem. It was coming even without the coronavirus, and at this point, it doesn't matter where it came from, we just need to beat it. Yes. there is going to be pain and some economic hell, but this is NOT new. Some people will win and some will lose. What's the point of a capitalistic economy without bankruptcies? Or, the point of Christianity without Hell? Unemployment will jump to 9% to 12%. We been here before. See Oct, 1949. See Apr. 1975. See Nov, 1982. See Sep, 2009. Does it hurt? You bet! So, what are you going to do?
4. We have a unity problem. Never before have the few had the voice they have today and the noise of chest thumping is drowning out the need to grasp the facts - the fact is, we have a problem. So, roll up your sleeves and lets go.
I don't care. I'm going to die. If I become infected - and I fully expect I will - I'm going to die. I nearly did in November past. I'm ready to run into the fire, but before I do - what have you learned from this? what legacy do you leave for the next generation? No finger pointing. No whining. Stop denying. there's no conspiracy here. What's the lesson? What do you teach he next generation about getting thru something like this? It'll be the first time for them - and you'll still be here. What do you tell them?
Look, we got some problems. Understatement, huh? What are you going to do about it? This country has faced many serious life changing events. All have been solved - after the sacrifice of many for people they knew and loved and for people like you and me to be able to express opinions, sometimes dumb opinions, but here we are.
1. We have a political problem. I don't care what party it is, government rarely ever has a plan and/or acts quickly enough to do anything but take everyone to the edge of disaster. I guess it's the adrenaline rush. Let's put politics behind us and stop listening to the talking heads in your party of choice.
THIS IS BAD.
2. We have a medical problem. None of us are immune to this one. Remember the Indians and small pox? We will do better. I have a job where, everyday, I report the number of confirmed cases to 'management.' In my state we now have 156 confirmed COVID infections. Believe what you want, but you have to pick a number. The number of undetected cases is 10 x to 50x the 156. Don't make me provide a source. I can if you want. It's been estimated the number of confirmed cases doubles every 3 days. In my state, so far it's 75%. Only 156 now, but if the progressions continues, there will be over 1-million by the end of April. I'm left to conclude we are all going to get it -sooner or later - and later is better. Maybe the hospital will have a bed for me then. You will survive - and be immune, but we have....
3. An economic problem. It was coming even without the coronavirus, and at this point, it doesn't matter where it came from, we just need to beat it. Yes. there is going to be pain and some economic hell, but this is NOT new. Some people will win and some will lose. What's the point of a capitalistic economy without bankruptcies? Or, the point of Christianity without Hell? Unemployment will jump to 9% to 12%. We been here before. See Oct, 1949. See Apr. 1975. See Nov, 1982. See Sep, 2009. Does it hurt? You bet! So, what are you going to do?
4. We have a unity problem. Never before have the few had the voice they have today and the noise of chest thumping is drowning out the need to grasp the facts - the fact is, we have a problem. So, roll up your sleeves and lets go.
I don't care. I'm going to die. If I become infected - and I fully expect I will - I'm going to die. I nearly did in November past. I'm ready to run into the fire, but before I do - what have you learned from this? what legacy do you leave for the next generation? No finger pointing. No whining. Stop denying. there's no conspiracy here. What's the lesson? What do you teach he next generation about getting thru something like this? It'll be the first time for them - and you'll still be here. What do you tell them?
FarmerDan
5 year old buck +
Only 12%?
FarmerDan
5 year old buck +
Define dependent. You can stop world trade if you want. Say good by to 2/3 of our farmers. Last I checked we produced more oil than we consumed.
bueller
Moderator
Death certificates don't tell the whole story. If you die from pneumonia it will show that, but it likely won't show how you contracted pneumonia.
Tree Spud
5 year old buck +
Then why did the Saudis who flooded the market with oil 2 weeks ago cause the price of crude to drop from ~ $60-$80 a barrel to ~$20-25?
You are referring to a narrow ~2 year period where fracking took off, the fracking industries can't exist at the current crude price. North American oil (fracking & oil sands) has a break even point of around $60/bbl.
We can only sustain market economy if we can influence/control key commodities.
bowhunternw
5 year old buck +
What about these sleezebag senators that went and sold off their stock after a briefing about the virus. Disgusting slobs
Buckly
5 year old buck +
i don’t know if it’s possible but, I think I heard it somewhere. We need another test that can tell if someone had the virus at one time Earlier on. Right now the majority of people that get this will be negative then positive then negative again in a matter of a few weeks. Without that how will they ever know the population that had contracted it. I know these States are screaming for these tests but at this point you just really have to assume everybody’s got it and on every surface. There’s really no reason to get tested even if you fall ill at this point. I suppose they will test if your in the hospital just for safety sake Chummer is on track here. The experts are discouraging tests.
Buckly
5 year old buck +
I know that looks suspicious, who knows but me and about half of America sold a lot of equities in the weeks before the crash. Financial advisors were scrambling for their clients. Could be considered suspect by these Senators or could be just good financial advice that most everybody got at that time.
SD51555
5 year old buck +
The hysteria has got to stop, or more people will die from the panic than the actual disease. If you buy the "1 in 12 are dying" from this, then you better get out and clear out the stores before the single mothers, poor, handicapped, and elderly get there first.
If the hysteria escalates, I could see this turning into the worst version of cheap TVs on black friday. Will the elderly lady guarding the TP pallet get buffalo'd by a nut case? Motorcycle gangs hijacking Walmart trucks? Riots at the loading dock of the grocery store?
If the hysteria escalates, I could see this turning into the worst version of cheap TVs on black friday. Will the elderly lady guarding the TP pallet get buffalo'd by a nut case? Motorcycle gangs hijacking Walmart trucks? Riots at the loading dock of the grocery store?
Bill
Administrator
12% of the 4032 that died is 807 people out of 47000 with the illness with no other complications.
that’s 2%
SD51555
5 year old buck +
You can't model this unless you know the rest of the story. Nobody knows when the lockdowns will be lifted or how much more will be locked down. Nobody knows what will actually pass outta the stimulus and how many non-federal dollars they can leverage into action. Nobody knows how quickly and effectively it will be deployed.
Tree Spud
5 year old buck +
Sorry but so what at this point. Thats why folks get into Politics ... Why do you think Paul Ryan, the most noble is moving his family back to Washington ... knowledge of who knows what and insider trading is why these folks get rich ... they can also steer legislation = $$
Last edited:
4wanderingeyes
5 year old buck +
Anything more then a couple weeks in confinement and there will be rioting and looting in masses. Once everyone gets a government check, and some get left out, let the violence start. Seems like the beginning of a Stephen King book.
Mortenson
5 year old buck +
I've bought into the lock-in out of respect for the health system and the elderly. My own personal peak hysteria has past and now I'm just waiting for things to settle down, hopefully over the next couple weeks. My wife's hysteria is on a different curve than mine. She spent the day sewing triple fabric layered masks out of material scraps to donate to whoever needs them. She didn't even notice I sneaked out to cut cages and shovel rock. Fruit trees and shrubs are scheduled to come next week. I'm calling it essential business. If anyone here needs a mask let me know. Pictured is one ready to mail; I think Bill or Baker would sport it well. The optimist in me thinks this thing is still way overblown. To my feeble mind, the numbers just aren't adding up. We really need that to be the case, and for those in charge to witness it for real and get things opened up again. We are buying them a little bit of time, so that hopefully the hospitals where Buck's wife and so many others work, can get a little more prepared.
After 49 pages, it's my opinion the conspiracy theorists and others have driven most of the better informed - and rational thinkers - off this thread.
Read the first article below for a reality check; then read the second article for how to very seriously mismanage a public health crisis, and help spread the virus when spring breakers return all across the U.S. TX is essentially doing the same thing!
And all you folks over 60 who seem to be worried about your freedoms, run down to Fl in about 10 days and visit groups of folks in diners and hotels ... might be your best shot at dying earlier than you ex[pect
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/21/world/coronavirus-updates-usa-world.html
https://www.tampabay.com/news/healt...dozens-of-states-on-coronavirus-restrictions/
Light me up boys, go ahead, light me up!
Read the first article below for a reality check; then read the second article for how to very seriously mismanage a public health crisis, and help spread the virus when spring breakers return all across the U.S. TX is essentially doing the same thing!
And all you folks over 60 who seem to be worried about your freedoms, run down to Fl in about 10 days and visit groups of folks in diners and hotels ... might be your best shot at dying earlier than you ex[pect
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/21/world/coronavirus-updates-usa-world.html
https://www.tampabay.com/news/healt...dozens-of-states-on-coronavirus-restrictions/
Light me up boys, go ahead, light me up!
Mortenson
5 year old buck +
I feel like it's been a good balance, with good discussion. Some smart guys here. I'm not seeing many nuts on any side of the aisle. You can't claim people are poorly informed just because they think the world economy getting shut down for months to years is a bad thing. I couldn't read the NYtimes article, but they've never been known as an unbiased source of news.
- Status