Are the glory days of deer hunting coming to a close?

[Angus 1895]

It’s the wolves causing the trouble now In northern Minnesota.

And insects borne diseases. IMO

 

[Foggy47]

I shouldn’t answer for foggy, but I grew up about 15 miles north of his hunting property and my Dad and Uncle hunted from the late 20’s until they passed on. Both of them shot their nicest bucks in about 46 or 47 after WW II. I think the war gave the deer a break. I have Dad’s head mount and my uncle’s rack from back then.

I had many enjoyable bow hunts north of Grand Rapids in the 80’s. Now it is hard to see a deer track up there.

It’s the wolves causing the trouble now In northern Minnesota.

And insects borne diseases. IMO

Not to mention the severe winters, and the automobile harvest. (anyone have some stat's on car-killed deer? over the years??) <-----this has to be a big factor too.

 

[neonomad]

I grew up on a farm in northeast Ohio, dad didn’t hunt but my cousin took me once and I was hooked. I started pursuing it on my own, bought a bow, and I used to go sit on a large tree that had split and one side toppled over. The split created a flat section of splintered trunk that I could shimmy up and sit about 10’ up. It wasn’t comfortable but I hunted it year after year. Funny thing is 25 years later I realize that’s one of the best spots on the property but the evening thermals are usually all wrong. Bet I was getting wind busted. From there, I just kept chasing deer around Ohio.

I’ve seen one Booner here in 30 years and he’s on my wall, but he broke a brow tine off and doesn’t make the books!

I’m glad I grew up when I did, I learned the hard way but still get to play with cell cams here in middle age. If someone had just plopped me down in a box blind for a few years I highly doubt I’d have the same passion. And unless someone decides to avoid trail cameras and social media, undoubtedly much of the mystique and allure of the woods is gone, probably forever. There’s still a few surprises out there, but the era of awe disappeared 10-15 years ago, now like everything else it’s a little more commoditized, and our overexposure raises the bar and dulls the thrill to some extent.

 

[Brian662]

Since you've seen a thing or 2 i'm interested in your input on this - A graphic posted earlier in this thread showed MN was the #1 state for B&C entries from 1940-1960 and again 1960-1980. Based on the following knowledge and assumptions, it seems like there was some bit of "glory days" in the north before I was born and even a little early in my life.
-St Louis county is #2 all time for entries in the country and how logging/fire likely had more early secession habitat in the north in those days
-I'm assuming the ag country had even less habitat then than now and lower deer pops?
-I recall seeing deer everywhere north of grand rapids in the late 90s and early 2000's. Was always on guard while driving at night due to the frequency of them on the roads.

Where did you hunt in these pre-1980 years?
Were you hunting around your current place in the late 90s and first decade of 2000's when there were tons of tags available? Was hunting quite a bit better then?

I just seems like we're not that far removed from a pretty solid deer population (by today's standards) up in northern MN. That said, I've little hope of a great rebound with our current policies and predator populations.

MN changed their gun season structure in the 70's and IMO it was the beginning of the end for being a truly great big buck state. MN has the same/more/better habitat as WI/IA/IL but has their gun season start at least a week too soon, probably two.

I researched this earlier and the summer and found this article interesting. Also, WG, keep in mind that St Louis County is frigging gigantic in size. Likely 5 times the size of Buffalo County (I can do the math.) ETA: It's actually over 9 times the size, in a quantity game, it's not apples to apples. If you added Buffalo, Pepin, Pierce, Trempeleau, La Crosse, Eau Claire, Dunn county together, the number of B&C would be mind blowing. Nevermind Vernon and Crawford (next two south of La Crosse). Crawford is a pretty small county and ranks in top 10 B&C entries also.

150 Years of Minnesota Deer Hunting

Back in 2006, I wrote an article for the Outdoor News about the history of deer hunting in Minnesota. It was a ton of fun to research and write and I've long wanted to dig deeper into the subject but just haven't had time. As we sit here, a week into the 2010 deer season, I thought it might be...

www.startribune.com

 

[Foggy47]

^ great article on the timelines of deer season history.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

MN changed their gun season structure in the 70's and IMO it was the beginning of the end for being a truly great big buck state. MN has the same/more/better habitat as WI/IA/IL but has their gun season start at least a week too soon, probably two.

I researched this earlier and the summer and found this article interesting. Also, WG, keep in mind that St Louis County is frigging gigantic in size. Likely 5 times the size of Buffalo County (I can do the math.) ETA: It's actually over 9 times the size, in a quantity game, it's not apples to apples. If you added Buffalo, Pepin, Pierce, Trempeleau, La Crosse, Eau Claire, Dunn county together, the number of B&C would be mind blowing. Nevermind Vernon and Crawford (next two south of La Crosse). Crawford is a pretty small county and ranks in top 10 B&C entries also.

150 Years of Minnesota Deer Hunting

Back in 2006, I wrote an article for the Outdoor News about the history of deer hunting in Minnesota. It was a ton of fun to research and write and I've long wanted to dig deeper into the subject but just haven't had time. As we sit here, a week into the 2010 deer season, I thought it might be...

www.startribune.com

People are the lowest hole in the bucket when it comes to age and therefore antler size almost everywhere. Just because the government says you can do something doesn’t mean we have to. Seeing as how mn has every ingredient to be better than its neighbors from a habitat perspective, the people are holding it back from reaching its potential. Decisions have consequences, and ultimately maybe the people of mn are totally content with the quality of hunting because there is a couple decades long example of them not changing their decisions.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

MN changed their gun season structure in the 70's and IMO it was the beginning of the end for being a truly great big buck state. MN has the same/more/better habitat as WI/IA/IL but has their gun season start at least a week too soon, probably two.

I researched this earlier and the summer and found this article interesting. Also, WG, keep in mind that St Louis County is frigging gigantic in size. Likely 5 times the size of Buffalo County (I can do the math.) ETA: It's actually over 9 times the size, in a quantity game, it's not apples to apples. If you added Buffalo, Pepin, Pierce, Trempeleau, La Crosse, Eau Claire, Dunn county together, the number of B&C would be mind blowing. Nevermind Vernon and Crawford (next two south of La Crosse). Crawford is a pretty small county and ranks in top 10 B&C entries also.

150 Years of Minnesota Deer Hunting

Back in 2006, I wrote an article for the Outdoor News about the history of deer hunting in Minnesota. It was a ton of fun to research and write and I've long wanted to dig deeper into the subject but just haven't had time. As we sit here, a week into the 2010 deer season, I thought it might be...

www.startribune.com

3 deer, a moose, a caribou, and probably a bounty on wolves! Hard to imagine.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

People are the lowest hole in the bucket when it comes to age and therefore antler size almost everywhere. Just because the government says you can do something doesn’t mean we have to. Seeing as how mn has every ingredient to be better than its neighbors from a habitat perspective, the people are holding it back from reaching its potential. Decisions have consequences, and ultimately maybe the people of mn are totally content with the quality of hunting because there is a couple decades long example of them not changing their decisions.

Generally agree except WI has us beat from a habitat perspective. Lots of similar ground in both states but the good stuff is more consistent through WI. That's primary reason why they are able to shoot more deer than MN every year from less acres and still maintain higher deer population density in most of the state.

Found a recent tidbit illustrating the extent of human/regulation impact on my particular zone. When i looked at the spring survey pre-fawn population densities, my land was in the area that was basically tops in state for deer per sq mile. Yet in the 3 years i've owned the property, only one of the seasons could you buy a single spare doe tag. This year and in '21 you only get 1 either sex tag because the pressure is so high and the landscape/parcel composition make it so hard for deer to avoid getting shot. Much of the state allows 3 or more deer to be shot per person but because the regulations make it so tough for anything to survive in this particular area they feel they cant issue doe tags there.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Generally agree except WI has us beat from a habitat perspective. Lots of similar ground in both states but the good stuff is more consistent through WI. That's primary reason why they are able to shoot more deer than MN every year from less acres and still maintain higher deer population density in most of the state.

But the gap between two in terms of quality isn’t equal to the gap in habitat. Minnesota is absolutely gorgeous from a wildlife perspective but I would rather hunt every state and province that borders it.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

But the gap between two in terms of quality isn’t equal to the gap in habitat. Minnesota is absolutely gorgeous from a wildlife perspective but I would rather hunt every state and province that borders it.

I would too. I always point out that exact thing when we make more regulations to make it easier to kill deer. ND, SD, IA, WI all have notably better deer hunting and its because of how they are managed. That said, MN hunters ask for this shit sandwich so I cant really blame the DNR. They largely do what hunters ask them to when it comes to season structure. There would be an uproar if they moved gun season to the same dates as WI much less IA. There would probably be a fit if they took xbows back out of archery season even though it's only been one season. I'm on the wrong side of the boundary where they divide 9 day vs 16 day gun season, people would have a fit if my zone went to 9 day season even though participation in the last 7 days is low.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

I would too. I always point out that exact thing when we make more regulations to make it easier to kill deer. ND, SD, IA, WI all have notably better deer hunting and its because of how they are managed. That said, MN hunters ask for this shit sandwich so I cant really blame the DNR. They largely do what hunters ask them to when it comes to season structure. There would be an uproar if they moved gun season to the same dates as WI much less IA. There would probably be a fit if they took xbows back out of archery season even though it's only been one season. I'm on the wrong side of the boundary where they divide 9 day vs 16 day gun season, people would have a fit if my zone went to 9 day season even though participation in the last 7 days is low.

Exactly. That’s my point, the people of mn act essentially demanded this season structure and with the addition of crossguns in archery season have made efficiencies even higher. The people of iowa said we want older age class deer so make nonresident tags hard to get and super late and short gun season. And look at the difference.

 

[Brian662]

Exactly. That’s my point, the people of mn act essentially demanded this season structure and with the addition of crossguns in archery season have made efficiencies even higher. The people of iowa said we want older age class deer so make nonresident tags hard to get and super late and short gun season. And look at the difference.

And Iowa just shut down the crossbow lobbyists from enacting xbow legislation this year.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

And Iowa just shut down the crossbow lobbyists from enacting xbow legislation this year.

Geez. I have such a man crush on iowa. Somehow I’m gonna convince my wife it’s the Maui of the Midwest and retire there.

 

[Brian662]

Geez. I have such a man crush on iowa. Somehow I’m gonna convince my wife it’s the Maui of the Midwest and retire there.

Probably the craziest thing about Iowa is that the rec land prices aren't even extreme compared to other states, often times more reasonable. Ag land, that's another story.
I remember hearing Winke say that if he knew in the early 90s about logging and timber values, he could have owned all of Southern Iowa because the farmers didn't want the woods and would sell it for what one or two mature walnut logs would fetch.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Probably the craziest thing about Iowa is that the rec land prices aren't even extreme compared to other states, often times more reasonable. Ag land, that's another story.
I remember hearing Winke say that if he knew in the early 90s about logging and timber values, he could have owned all of Southern Iowa because the farmers didn't want the woods and would sell it for what one or two mature walnut logs would fetch.

I heard that too! Made my head explode

 

[Tree Spud]

Probably the craziest thing about Iowa is that the rec land prices aren't even extreme compared to other states, often times more reasonable. Ag land, that's another story.
I remember hearing Winke say that if he knew in the early 90s about logging and timber values, he could have owned all of Southern Iowa because the farmers didn't want the woods and would sell it for what one or two mature walnut logs would fetch.

Back in the early 90's when I started looking for land, I looked at multiple properties in the western side of Wis. Great hunting big buck properties with forest, hilly terrain, streams, and 50-70% ag land. Looked at several 300 acre parcels that were going for $600-$700/acre. Chose not to go that direction because the drive was 4-5 hours. Kinda kick myself now as those parcels are selling for $7,000/ac plus. Grrrr!

 

[Wind Gypsy]

And Iowa just shut down the crossbow lobbyists from enacting xbow legislation this year.

Skip Sligh for president. I sure wish we had one or ten of him in MN. Has to help them fight this stuff when they've got a bunch of residents with public platforms who moved there specifically for deer hunting.

The limit on NR tag thing has to be a huge mover for keeping rec land prices in line for residents. Very smart. They really need to keep fighting the push from commercial interests to open things up for NR.

 

[T-Max]

Skip Sligh for president. I sure wish we had one or ten of him in MN. Has to help them fight this stuff when they've got a bunch of residents with public platforms who moved there specifically for deer hunting.

The limit on NR tag thing has to be a huge mover for keeping rec land prices in line for residents. Very smart. They really need to keep fighting the push from commercial interests to open things up for NR.

Skip has a soft spot for Kansas too. I selfishly really really like that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Skip has a soft spot for Kansas too. I selfishly really really like that.

Because you guys seemingly have big bucks more readily accessible to the average guy than most the other states and haven't completely ruined that yet. Seems like you've got to keep on it or they'll chip away at that to give everyone participation trophies though!

 

[T-Max]

Because you guys seemingly have big bucks more readily accessible to the average guy than most the other states and haven't completely ruined that yet. Seems like you've got to keep on it or they'll chip away at that to give everyone participation trophies though!

Seems that's where we are slowly headed.....