New here. I purchased 20 acres in Ohio that is mostly alfalfa field with the goal to turn it into great deer habitat. I’ve been struggling coming up with a plan to layout the property. I’ve ordered 500 Norway spruce, 100 concolor for, few white pine, viburnum and hazelnuts. A few Apple and crabapple. 25 swamp bur oak, 25 chinquapin oak and 10 Chinese chestnuts. I want to create great bedding with the spruce because I feel that is what is missing in this area. Should I mix everything together or plant spruce, oaks, chestnuts separate? I plan to start on the north east corner and only work in the back 10 acres for now. Any advice is much appreciated.
Advice needed for open 20 acres
- Thread starter Spruce85
- Start date
S.T.Fanatic
5 year old buck +
I'd go with a native grass and wild flower planting with a fruit tree orchard planted somewhere in the mix. Along with that have strategic trails mowed for fire breaks and travel routs. If your in the Northern part of the country plant a 3 acre soybean plot, put up a tower blind, and stay off the property until late muzzleloader season.
The hunting pressure is heavy on surrounding properties except for the 60 or so acre property bordering mine to the west and north. I would like to create a sanctuary for the deer. Also plan to put in couple acre soy bean plot this year for late season. Is mixing the hardwoods and spruce a good idea or plant more in blocks separating everything?
Mortenson
5 year old buck +
With 20 acres, one obviously needs to have realistic expectations, and understand that most of the improvements you make will also help the neighbors. I'm sure you know that though. You didn't come right out and say it, but can we assume you want terrific deer hunting? If so, are you looking to implement sure-fire stand set-ups immediately, or just start turning it into to deer habitat and see what becomes of it all? I think that definitely has to be thought about, and make a list of goals. Bedding areas can be different than sanctuaries, or they can be one in the same. Personally, I'm trying to create a few areas that probably won't be a first choice of ideal bedding, but a place the biggest bucks run to when the first shots bang on opening morning. Is that what you're looking for? Does and some bucks like bedding in nice, open grassy areas with shrubs and weeds. But a spot like that probably won't serve as a sanctuary when the pressure is on. The farm I came from had ~25 acres of a phragmites swamp. The deer knew how to use it. It was a sanctuary for sure. No one is going to grow that stuff on purpose, so on this farm I've tried introducing switchgrass, and more recently, Miscanthus giganteus. I'm still trying to learn what a plot of that may look like, how it will do in the winter, etc. I'd love to have a timber of Norway Spruce, but getting from A to B seems like more of a challenge for me.
Is Miscanthus or Switchgrass something that you're open to or something you can rule out? Bill, one of the administrators here, has some of both. I always think about the line he said here once, that if he could go back 10 years, he'd go all in with Miscanthus. Here are three pics that popped up on quick search of MG in the winter. I'd love to have a few blocks of this stuff, and plan to.
Is Miscanthus or Switchgrass something that you're open to or something you can rule out? Bill, one of the administrators here, has some of both. I always think about the line he said here once, that if he could go back 10 years, he'd go all in with Miscanthus. Here are three pics that popped up on quick search of MG in the winter. I'd love to have a few blocks of this stuff, and plan to.
Last edited:
My neighbors will surely benefit from my work but most of the hunting pressure comes from gun season. For the most part, this is for hunting purposes but I’m thinking long term habitat rather than immediate stand set ups. Something I can enjoy for the next 40+ years. A friend has a tree farm a couple miles away that has spruce and other conifers with grasses grown up between everything. It seems to pull in every deer in the area all year long. The bucks that are seen/killed on the property is simply amazing. It kind of sparked my interest in creating something similar on a smaller scale.
Bill
Administrator
^^^yes Miscanthus would be in my plan. But in an open field that I lived on so would a block of N.S. (In a block no oaks mixed into it.)
First question you need to answer is...
Are you looking to build deer habitat or a killer spot or two for stands and deer habitat? If the latter, plan for that now and start with the stands.
Here’s a 5 minute idea that holds no water but gives you what I’m talking about.
Since you have a buddy that grows spruce the green is spruce block bedding. The yellow is a kill plot before they get to an already great destination plot of alfalfa. Blue is thick miscanthus to give them security and steer them past one of two killer spots and give you hidden access to stands. Black lines are mowed paths through the MG red are killer spots for N something winds.
Like I said just a quick idea, you could add oaks between the spruce and food plot. Or anywhere.
But If I was building a small 20 acre spot I’d focus on how to kill them first.
Again the pic is just to make you think. Not saying this is the right answer.
First question you need to answer is...
Are you looking to build deer habitat or a killer spot or two for stands and deer habitat? If the latter, plan for that now and start with the stands.
Here’s a 5 minute idea that holds no water but gives you what I’m talking about.
Since you have a buddy that grows spruce the green is spruce block bedding. The yellow is a kill plot before they get to an already great destination plot of alfalfa. Blue is thick miscanthus to give them security and steer them past one of two killer spots and give you hidden access to stands. Black lines are mowed paths through the MG red are killer spots for N something winds.
Like I said just a quick idea, you could add oaks between the spruce and food plot. Or anywhere.
But If I was building a small 20 acre spot I’d focus on how to kill them first.
Again the pic is just to make you think. Not saying this is the right answer.
Bowsnbucks
5 year old buck +
FWIW - I have a couple Christmas tree farms near my home. They have trees of all ages / sizes in their fields. Norway, white, & blue spruces, Doug. fir, Fraser fir, etc. with crappy grass and weeds, goldenrod growing between them. Deer are in there just about anytime. It's about like you describe at your friend's tree farm ^^^^^.
At our hunting camp, we planted spruce in clusters of 5 to 10 and spaced them so there is room between them for grass & weeds to grow. Deer seem to like that set-up for bedding and hiding when shooting starts.
Crab apple trees and good disease resistant apple trees are always good to add for deer attraction. Maybe plant them so that deer have to walk from cover to fruit trees & soybean plots, and on to other clusters of cover. The more they have to expose themselves, the more shot opportunities you'll have.
At our hunting camp, we planted spruce in clusters of 5 to 10 and spaced them so there is room between them for grass & weeds to grow. Deer seem to like that set-up for bedding and hiding when shooting starts.
Crab apple trees and good disease resistant apple trees are always good to add for deer attraction. Maybe plant them so that deer have to walk from cover to fruit trees & soybean plots, and on to other clusters of cover. The more they have to expose themselves, the more shot opportunities you'll have.
pinetag14
5 year old buck +
I'm certainly not an expert but here is my opinion.
I would design it based on how you plan to hunt it in the future. A couple things... Is the top of your photo North? Can you access both the left and right sides of the field and if so can you use the few trees along side it to hang stands? Assuming the answer is yes to these questions you could do something similar to what Bill suggested. However, I would try to break it up a little more. Create a natural regen area by spraying and disking the field along the tree line to the North (orange) which should allow good visibility for a few years. You could put stands on both the East and West sides for different winds (red). Then try to create a thick area of security cover using shrubs and tall native grasses (blue). Next do another section of natural regen (orange) followed by your food plot (green) furthest to the South and closest to the house. Put screening all the way around it (purple). This should create a flow of travel from the woods through the transition area as well as from the thick security cover to your food. You could even add strips of clover between each of these zones to slow them down as they pass between each. Bucks should cruise along the downwind side of the edges hopefully giving you an opportunity. Also, you need to be able to access stands without alerting game so the field edges all need some sort of screening (purple). I would think you could successfully hunt any wind except something coming directly from the South.
I would design it based on how you plan to hunt it in the future. A couple things... Is the top of your photo North? Can you access both the left and right sides of the field and if so can you use the few trees along side it to hang stands? Assuming the answer is yes to these questions you could do something similar to what Bill suggested. However, I would try to break it up a little more. Create a natural regen area by spraying and disking the field along the tree line to the North (orange) which should allow good visibility for a few years. You could put stands on both the East and West sides for different winds (red). Then try to create a thick area of security cover using shrubs and tall native grasses (blue). Next do another section of natural regen (orange) followed by your food plot (green) furthest to the South and closest to the house. Put screening all the way around it (purple). This should create a flow of travel from the woods through the transition area as well as from the thick security cover to your food. You could even add strips of clover between each of these zones to slow them down as they pass between each. Bucks should cruise along the downwind side of the edges hopefully giving you an opportunity. Also, you need to be able to access stands without alerting game so the field edges all need some sort of screening (purple). I would think you could successfully hunt any wind except something coming directly from the South.
H20fwler
5 year old buck +
If top of pic is north...I would use the conifers in a staggered row to block the view to the east and across south along with a row of MG to help box in the bulk of the property and keep others from looking in as a screen while creating sanctuary inside. Start a nice shrub strip inside privacy screen east side with the fruit trees/hazelnuts you can always ad more things to it later. Plant your other trees out from north end of tree line so they get good sun, leave a couple acres of alfalfa along the west side against woods and plant middle to native grasses with a good variety of clovers mixed in. After a few years you will see how the deer want to use and cross property when choosing spots to place stands, I would think the NW corner just inside woods and NE corner would be best spots from the pic.
Your knowledge of the surrounding properties is good to have. You kind of have a blank slate and what you do will influence changes in the movement of deer into and out of your property.
My 2 cents but you asked:)
Light blue-screens of miscanthus, and/or coniferous, and/or willow/poplar
Yellow-double row of conifers and double row of shrubs, on our farms the screens/tree rows we have put in have made the open areas between them, especially plots used much more in the daylight. It seems to make them feel more secure.
White enclosed areas-food plots
Red enclosed areas-bedding your tree and shrub selection plus switch grass
Orange enclosed-destination plot including fruit trees and soybeans yearly or soybean/corn rotation. Can watch deer from the house in winter months
Black circled areas-stand areas and possible pinch points
Black dot-eventual stand site.
Hybrid poplar, in 4 or 5 years can be usable for ladder stand according to the growth I've had on poplar without sun competition. The black dot spot could get one there in a few years or blind on elevated platform.
Shrubs that deer like and grow relatively quickly, elderberry, choke berry, and dogwoods
Oaks are going to take a long time to produce but everything your going to do is for the long term basically
Are you a archery or gun or both?
I would only hunt the exterior and only hunt stands that when you access and sit the wind is blowing your stench to the neighbors
If you do seed switch I would stick a bunch of willow/poplar cutting in the ground to get some vertical growth to break up the horizon and get it thicker quicker. The switch will take 2 or three years to get goods and yours shrubs would be in good shape in 3 years. Then one could go in and hinge the willows/poplars for more thickening/bedding mess but also for browse. Browse where they bed is a good thing. Or they could be treated when cut to get more sun to your other species.
My 2 cents but you asked:)
Light blue-screens of miscanthus, and/or coniferous, and/or willow/poplar
Yellow-double row of conifers and double row of shrubs, on our farms the screens/tree rows we have put in have made the open areas between them, especially plots used much more in the daylight. It seems to make them feel more secure.
White enclosed areas-food plots
Red enclosed areas-bedding your tree and shrub selection plus switch grass
Orange enclosed-destination plot including fruit trees and soybeans yearly or soybean/corn rotation. Can watch deer from the house in winter months
Black circled areas-stand areas and possible pinch points
Black dot-eventual stand site.
Hybrid poplar, in 4 or 5 years can be usable for ladder stand according to the growth I've had on poplar without sun competition. The black dot spot could get one there in a few years or blind on elevated platform.
Shrubs that deer like and grow relatively quickly, elderberry, choke berry, and dogwoods
Oaks are going to take a long time to produce but everything your going to do is for the long term basically
Are you a archery or gun or both?
I would only hunt the exterior and only hunt stands that when you access and sit the wind is blowing your stench to the neighbors
If you do seed switch I would stick a bunch of willow/poplar cutting in the ground to get some vertical growth to break up the horizon and get it thicker quicker. The switch will take 2 or three years to get goods and yours shrubs would be in good shape in 3 years. Then one could go in and hinge the willows/poplars for more thickening/bedding mess but also for browse. Browse where they bed is a good thing. Or they could be treated when cut to get more sun to your other species.
I appreciate all the feedback. I should have noted the top of pic is north. I have access to both side of the property and there is a lane from road down west side of property back to the fields. I have already planted rows of spruce on the east and south side of property to screen it all in. I will say from running cameras that the NE corner seems to be the hot spot. The NW corner gets little activity I’m assuming bc the neighbor walks there dogs in the woods past my camera all the time. To the N the neighbor is also building a cabin in the middle of the pines. He doesn’t allow hunting but is out walking around daily. I figured I can add shrubs later on but as a base here was my original thinking. Inside green in conifers with lots of spacing, red is oaks, hazelnut, chestnut, apple trees ect. Inside black is soy bean plot. Hunting the NE corner for now. There is just so many ways, it’s kind of overwhelming trying to get it right the first time.
Attachments
The northeast corner was the spot I liked the best. I think it could be a heck of a funnel area with habitat manipulations flowing to and from it. NW winds would be great. How you describe the neighbors to the north and west use of the land will be a big benefit to you I believe.
You are wise trying to plan a big picture plan as opposed to one part developed then another and so on( I started out that way but then finally, through these forums and some specific individuals, figured out I needed to look at it as a whole).
You won't be able to get it all done in one year but it will flow together well as you go along. It can be overwhelming but make a well thought out plan and then stick to it. For me, that helps take stress away.
You are wise trying to plan a big picture plan as opposed to one part developed then another and so on( I started out that way but then finally, through these forums and some specific individuals, figured out I needed to look at it as a whole).
You won't be able to get it all done in one year but it will flow together well as you go along. It can be overwhelming but make a well thought out plan and then stick to it. For me, that helps take stress away.
jsasker007
5 year old buck +
I agree that the nw corner should be a great spot---even better if you have some elevation in that nw corner?
The NW corner does look good on the map but it gets daily human activity from the neighbors. Those neighbors don’t allow hunting but are out walking the property everyday. From what I can tell, deer avoid the corner in daylight hours. There is a slight hill on the center northern part of field that slopes to the west. The NW is the lowest part of property.
H20fwler
5 year old buck +
It looks like you are in a high ag area from the first pic, I don't know if I would put in the effort into a soybean plot when you can put a feeder out with shelled corn/pellets/soybeans year round... it is Ohio. To me good cover along with late season hard and soft mast along with anything they can't get off the neighbors properties would be the draw.
The area is high ag and seriously lacks good cover and bedding areas. I’ve grown up in the area, aside from my neighbor not allowing hunting, there is a tree stand in every imaginable spot in the surrounding area. That said, there are still very nice bucks taken ever year. With good cover I feel it can be a little honey hole. I have a feeder in the back and have decent younger bucks coming all winter.. I guess I just want to make it the best possible.
Attachments
H20fwler
5 year old buck +
You do have a lot of bucks coming through! I agree cover is a huge draw, somewhere they can bed, hang out and feel safe. Even though the neighbor has a pond you might also look into some type of water source like a sunken stock tank or little kio pond tucked into one of your north corners of the field, there are some good threads on it in the Everything Pond section. What part of the state are you in?
