Seguins - Dwarf Chinese Chestnuts question - Transfered from QDMA forum

[yoderjac]

Oh yeah I am hosed..... I fully anticipate that...... hahaha

I recall IndianSam talking about storing chestnuts for over a year in the fridge. You might want to consider that. The idea is to store them without added moisture. You can't let them completely dry out, but you don't add damp sphagnum or other media.
One thing I've learned is that as the moisture content diminishes, cold stratification slows. If moisture content gets low enough cold stratification stops completely and they kind of go into suspended animation. That is what you are looking for. IndianSam said he got good germination rates a year later with this technique. Just keep in mind that they will still need to be cold stratified. So, 60 to 90 days before you want them to produce root radicals, you need to remove them, fully hydrate them, and then add the damp sphagnum. From that point on, it is just like handling fresh nuts.
You may want to search home of his old threads to see if you can find more details on this.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Good that you are getting them.....bad it has taken so long!!
I am down to 1 left of the 6 I had to try. Still hoping it starts some top growth. I didnt have alot of confidence in them because they were lost in the mail for over 2 weeks and alot of them were crushed to pieces. I was only able to salvage the 6 and only 1 has progressed!
Id be interested in extra too......but more than anything I am happy you are gonna be the guinea pig on growing them! Hahah!!!

 

[yoderjac]

ts,
You may not be hosed. I found this online:
"Henry chinkapin (Castanea henryi)
Native in middle China from the coast to the far west, the Henry chinkapin grows 75 to 90 feet tall with a straight, symmetrical trunk. In the United States, the Henry chinkapin seems to be more susceptible than the other Asiatic species to freezing temperatures and the blight fungus. "
Here they call them chinkapin, so maybe they act more like ACs as well.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

That is interesting! I might try some and see what they do..... Heck I only ordered a few to begin with.

 

[yoderjac]

I just heard from Schumacher today. They received the seguins and wanted to know if I still wanted them. I told them yes and to send them ASAP.

 

[yoderjac]

Guys, I put mine in the fridge with all of my others. They sent out a radical about the same time the AC's did.

Very interesting. I expected them to act more like ACs than chestnut but I wasn't sure. If I don't get ACs in the fridge within a week or so from picking them from the tree, if they are kept damp, they will produce root radicles. I was hoping this would be the same for Seguins. Cold slows down my ACs but they don't need it to germinate like chestnuts.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

No. I ordered in September and they said they would be in in December. I called the last week of December and they told me they expect them in the first two weeks of January.
They have a reputation for delay after delay. Worst case, I'll direct seed them in the spring.
Thanks,
Jack

Well, they missed the mid January date. I called today and they are now saying mid-February.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Are you serious! I am waiting on an order of Henri. They told me jan/feb. I hate to , but I am going to email them for an update.

It is not that surprising. I knew their history when I ordered. They get these directly from China. There are always collection and shipping issues. Who knows what quality the seed will be. I bought an entire pound of seed hoping to get enough good trees to work with.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Jack,
Don't expect much then you'll be pleasantly surprised when and if you do get them. They probably won't be clean and there will probably be trash, dirt, leaves in the bag. No telling how they were stored. They won't be float tested either and when you put them in the refrigerator you may or may not find worms in the bag when you go back to check on them. That's been my experience with them. But hey.. they were cheap...
Matt

It wasn't price that took me there, it was the only place I could find them offered.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Yeah I know. I was referring more to the oaks acorns I received. They do offer a few things that is hard to find anywhere else.
Matt

 

[yoderjac]

Jack,
If you have a surplus, I would ask first dibbs on buying some from you.
Just let me know. I sure hope they do well for you.
Wayne

Will let you know when they arrive.

 

[yoderjac]

Well Hot dang! I am going to call them tomorrow. I am not sure about cold strat my seeds as well... I ordered the Henri. Might be a June - July sprout! hahah

Yep, you might be in worse shape. I believe Henri are actually a chestnut variety that does require cold stratification. Given your experience with Seguins acting like ACs, I don't plan to cold stratify them.

 

[yoderjac]

I would be interested in a couple of surplus seeds also, but no more 5 or so...

 

[yoderjac]

Oh yeah I am hosed..... I fully anticipate that...... hahaha

I recall IndianSam talking about storing chestnuts for over a year in the fridge. You might want to consider that. The idea is to store them without added moisture. You can't let them completely dry out, but you don't add damp sphagnum or other media.
One thing I've learned is that as the moisture content diminishes, cold stratification slows. If moisture content gets low enough cold stratification stops completely and they kind of go into suspended animation. That is what you are looking for. IndianSam said he got good germination rates a year later with this technique. Just keep in mind that they will still need to be cold stratified. So, 60 to 90 days before you want them to produce root radicals, you need to remove them, fully hydrate them, and then add the damp sphagnum. From that point on, it is just like handling fresh nuts.
You may want to search home of his old threads to see if you can find more details on this.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

Good that you are getting them.....bad it has taken so long!!
I am down to 1 left of the 6 I had to try. Still hoping it starts some top growth. I didnt have alot of confidence in them because they were lost in the mail for over 2 weeks and alot of them were crushed to pieces. I was only able to salvage the 6 and only 1 has progressed!
Id be interested in extra too......but more than anything I am happy you are gonna be the guinea pig on growing them! Hahah!!!

 

[yoderjac]

ts,
You may not be hosed. I found this online:
"Henry chinkapin (Castanea henryi)
Native in middle China from the coast to the far west, the Henry chinkapin grows 75 to 90 feet tall with a straight, symmetrical trunk. In the United States, the Henry chinkapin seems to be more susceptible than the other Asiatic species to freezing temperatures and the blight fungus. "
Here they call them chinkapin, so maybe they act more like ACs as well.
Thanks,
Jack

 

[yoderjac]

That is interesting! I might try some and see what they do..... Heck I only ordered a few to begin with.

 

[yoderjac]

I just heard from Schumacher today. They received the seguins and wanted to know if I still wanted them. I told them yes and to send them ASAP.

 

[yoderjac]

Jack,
I hope your patience is rewarded. I hope they arrive in great condition.
They should sent you some extra for the long delay.
Looking forward to the photos. :)

I had a notice the other day that mine had shipped... I called yesterday and they informed me that they had not received them yet! Hopefully this week. I am going to keep mine in the fridge until next spring. They said they needed 60 days of cold. I guess we'll see!

I know these are different but I've successfully gotten Dunstans to germinate after being in the fridge more than a year. Keep them as close to 32F as you dare without them freezing and don't let them dry out and you'll be okay I think.
Matt

10-4 thats what I am planning....I hope it works!

 

[yoderjac]

Jack,
what did you decide to do with the Seguins?
I placed an order last week and was told that they needed to be stratified for 60days
What is your plan?
thanks,
bill

Bill, I have not received mine yet, but I'm not sure I believe what Schumacher says. 60 days is what chestnut require. One common name for these is Dwarf Asian (or Chinese) Chestnuts. However, these seem to be more like the Chinese version of Allegheny Chinquapins. Allegheny Chinquapins don't require stratification. One of the guys on this form has some seed he got from his seguins and put them in the fridge and they germinate in a few weeks.
So, I'm hoping they will germinate without cold stratification, but I'm hedging my bets. Here is my plan:
1) First I'll look for any signs of germination in the seed I receive.
2) I'll store some without added moisture, assume they need cold stratification, and try to put them in suspension until next year.
3) I'll try to germinate some of the seed immediately and see what happens.
4) I'll send some to folks on here who ask me for some.
5) If 3 succeeds, I'll grow some in rootmakers and direct seed some.
Thanks,
jack