Soil fundamentals library

[SD51555]

Don't forget the chicory.

 

[Brian662]

If you're going to stick with balanced mixes all year like LC, your OM should start rising quickly. All your samples look really good. The biggest thing is your pH is in the strike zone all over. You could throw a little calcitic lime on #5 and #10, but I wouldn't get too excited about that.

How many acres are you managing for plots?

If you look across all your samples, your S numbers are below 2. Your calcium numbers are also low. I know this is always my answer, but gypsum can knock out both of those issues. Your plots would respond really well to a maintenance gypsum application for a few years. Once you get north of 5% OM, you can quit with it because you'll mineralize all the S you need out of your OM. 200 lbs/ac gypsum would be plenty of S for a year, and it'll stick very well in your heavy ground. Menards has 40 lb bags of pell gypsum for $9/bag.

Don't be afraid to skip some years spraying if the plot looks clean when it's replant time. You won't lose control of it, it'll just slowly move back towards nature. Every other year could/should be plenty for spraying, and you may even find every third is perfect. That will also help boost your OM quickly.

Thanks for the thoughtful response, I do plan to apply gypsum to see how it helps the soil. I have about 4.5 acres of plots I own by myself included in those samples and another ~6 acres I own jointly with a friend, in the grand scheme of things $400 isn't a big deal for a gypsum application annually.
This is in "big buck country" which is also hill country; the focus on the property is to harvest the biggest buck(s) the neighborhood has to offer. So there will be a balance of soil quality, erosion control, as well as having the most attractive food during hunting season. Some years that may mean corn or beans, but I've often had great luck into December attracting deer with LC mixes and brassicas. I am definitely committed to eliminating tilling going forward.
As far as the spraying goes, I always try to limit it when possible but the property is about 3 hours away and I have a family to keep up with around home, so timing for rolling (not crimping) can be variable. Some of the destination food that just came out of CRP is heavy with brome bouncing back from last year so we may just do a RR soybean this summer to clean the weeds out of those areas then drill the brassicas and LC mix into them in August/Sept.

 

[Brian662]

You have solid dirt.

Your pH looks good. P and K look low, I believe the Ed Spinazolla food plot book I use for a reference has a goal of 20-40 ppm for P and 150-200 ppm for K.

I've had pretty good results with food plots by keeping the pH, P and K in the target ranges, so I'd say that would be a good place to start if you are interested in amending the soil with fertilizers. P and K levels seem to stay in the goal range for several years once they are amended and if you rotate between crops. Some crops seem to be better than others at mining nutrients and making them available for the next crop. SD can probably explain the why portion, but that is beyond my pay grade.

This is our second year of plotting the 6 acres on my joint property since we closed last June. Soil amendments are definitely in our plans this year. Without tillage incorporation, I do worry about getting the P down to the root level. I know eventually the worms will take care of that once the soil gets dialed in better, but for now we may have heavy P levels in the upper 1/2" of soil.

 

[SD51555]

Thanks for the thoughtful response, I do plan to apply gypsum to see how it helps the soil. I have about 4.5 acres of plots I own by myself included in those samples and another ~6 acres I own jointly with a friend, in the grand scheme of things $400 isn't a big deal for a gypsum application annually.
This is in "big buck country" which is also hill country; the focus on the property is to harvest the biggest buck(s) the neighborhood has to offer. So there will be a balance of soil quality, erosion control, as well as having the most attractive food during hunting season. Some years that may mean corn or beans, but I've often had great luck into December attracting deer with LC mixes and brassicas. I am definitely committed to eliminating tilling going forward.
As far as the spraying goes, I always try to limit it when possible but the property is about 3 hours away and I have a family to keep up with around home, so timing for rolling (not crimping) can be variable. Some of the destination food that just came out of CRP is heavy with brome bouncing back from last year so we may just do a RR soybean this summer to clean the weeds out of those areas then drill the brassicas and LC mix into them in August/Sept.

Gypsum could give you the edge if you're up against stiff food competition from neighbors. It's been a long time since I've talked about flavor, but sulfur is the flavor nutrient in everything. I learned that first hand where we spread ammonium sulfate for brassicas in the fall and followed with beans the next year. We expanded a plot that didn't receive any ammonium sulfate. The deer browsed all the beans right up to where we quit with the ammonium sulfate the previous year.

It'll also help reach maximum protein content in legumes. Up against guys that just put on P and K for beans, those with good S will perform better and be more attractive to deer.

 

[Foggy47]

Gypsum could give you the edge if you're up against stiff food competition from neighbors. It's been a long time since I've talked about flavor, but sulfur is the flavor nutrient in everything. I learned that first hand where we spread ammonium sulfate for brassicas in the fall and followed with beans the next year. We expanded a plot that didn't receive any ammonium sulfate. The deer browsed all the beans right up to where we quit with the ammonium sulfate the previous year.

It'll also help reach maximum protein content in legumes. Up against guys that just put on P and K for beans, those with good S will perform better and be more attractive to deer.

View attachment 78159

I bought a few bags of sulfur one year to add to a food plot. Applied it with a cone spreader. Smelled like I was spitting out match heads over the land. Really smells like matches right after they are lit. Gotta wonder it it's flammable?

Bob Hunt (R.J. Hunt seeds in Wadena) once told me to make sure I had sulfur in my fertilizers when I put them down. It's commonly a 4th element in fertilizers in my area. I cannot say I noticed anything special from the sulfur....but the plot where I applied it has always been a draw.

The manager at the feed store told me he has only sold it to some folks that spread it for blueberries. Dunno.

 

[SD51555]

Came across a great tidbit tonight. A lot of you fellow nerds know that plants are exuding goodies out their roots every day they are alive. I came across this video where a guy quantifies in the best detail I've heard so far, what is happening down there, and why big, mixed, and continuous biomass is such a big deal for building OM, forage nutrition, desirability, biological fertility, and resilience to drought, flood, hot, and cold.

Start at the 44:20 mark in this video and watch for just a few minutes.

 

[SD51555]

Here's a good short watch on what happens when you can stay green and balanced. All sorts of parallels between deer food and human food.

 

[SD51555]

The way out of left field idea I'm trying this year with my really grassy plots is trying to grow through them without killing or cutting the grass.

If they were mowed, they'd begin to regenerate right away. Joel Salatin talks a lot about the sigmoid curve of grass growth. They grow slowly, and then all of a sudden take off, and then they taper off. This is a problem for grazers because they basically stall out unless they get grazed down or cut for hay.

I hoping this very thing happens, and I'm hoping the grasses stay subdued and flat. I'll throw all my large seeded seeds in ahead of time and give it the press. I'm pretty sure this is similar to what Collin Seis is doing in New South Wales. While not a perfect replication, the idea is he seeds another crop into his live pasture when the pasture grass goes dormant.

How Does Your Pasture Grow? Let’s Explore Grass Growth and the Sigmoid Growth Pattern

Explore the world of grass growth and sigmoid growth patterns and discover the factors affecting your pasture growth to ensure sustainable pasture management.

pasture.io

Pasture Cropping—The Innovative No-kill, No-till System Developed by Australian Farmers - Regeneration International

Colin Seis and Neils Olsen are two Australian farmers that are pioneers of a cover cropping system called pasture cropping where the cash crop is planted into a perennial pasture instead of into bare soil. It not only is more cost efficient but it increases soil organic matter and soil fertility.

regenerationinternational.org

 

[SD51555]

If this works, my OM is gonna go through the roof.

 

[farmlegend]

The way out of left field idea I'm trying this year with my really grassy plots is trying to grow through them without killing or cutting the grass.

If they were mowed, they'd begin to regenerate right away. Joel Salatin talks a lot about the sigmoid curve of grass growth. They grow slowly, and then all of a sudden take off, and then they taper off. This is a problem for grazers because they basically stall out unless they get grazed down or cut for hay.

I hoping this very thing happens, and I'm hoping the grasses stay subdued and flat. I'll throw all my large seeded seeds in ahead of time and give it the press. I'm pretty sure this is similar to what Collin Seis is doing in New South Wales. While not a perfect replication, the idea is he seeds another crop into his live pasture when the pasture grass goes dormant.

How Does Your Pasture Grow? Let’s Explore Grass Growth and the Sigmoid Growth Pattern

Explore the world of grass growth and sigmoid growth patterns and discover the factors affecting your pasture growth to ensure sustainable pasture management.

pasture.io

Pasture Cropping—The Innovative No-kill, No-till System Developed by Australian Farmers - Regeneration International

Colin Seis and Neils Olsen are two Australian farmers that are pioneers of a cover cropping system called pasture cropping where the cash crop is planted into a perennial pasture instead of into bare soil. It not only is more cost efficient but it increases soil organic matter and soil fertility.

regenerationinternational.org

View attachment 80846

If I'm understanding this right - when the grasses sort of "peak out"(I'm imagining coolseason grasses), broadcast large seeds into it (I'm thinking peas/oats or whatever), and then, at some point, "rolling over it" with a roller or cultipacker?

I can think of some good applications of something like this at my place where grasses habitually take over.

 

[SD51555]

If I'm understanding this right - when the grasses sort of "peak out"(I'm imagining coolseason grasses), broadcast large seeds into it (I'm thinking peas/oats or whatever), and then, at some point, "rolling over it" with a roller or cultipacker?

I can think of some good applications of something like this at my place where grasses habitually take over.

Yeah. I’m not guessing this would work in a pure stand of grass, but where it’s still patchy and possibly the right stuff.


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[Buckhunter10]

Let us know how this turns out! I did several plots this spring where I drilled our summer mix into the fall mix and drove off. No mow. No crimp. No spray.

I was very happy with biomass, diversity and attractiveness to deer - looking forward to more of that in future.

 

[SD51555]

Here’s the little lesson on my lawn that got me thinking about this. I pitched oats out there to get them out of my shed. They’ve been mowed once already.

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[bigboreblr]

Thats my lawn strategy...... I puts oats and rye out and let the weeds pick who's sticking around.

How does this apply to summer stands of native broadleaves like goldenrod? I seed my plots mid august in zone 3/4, rye clovers and smaller amounts of oats wheat and brassicas. This year I am blending in some milpa blend, mostly because the seed is about 3-4 years old.

Im on year 3 of doing this in poor and good sandy soil spots. PAst 2 years couldn't spray due to rain in forecast. However, I did crimp them with a 3 tire drag wth about 200lbs of logs ontop of it. Works way better with weight.

I know your working with the forever plot. Every found a good fall addition or two to the rye field? Besides clover and brassica. Or maybe specific companions to rye.

Got some crimson clover I got to use up. Was thinking of trying a spring plot of crimson clover and barley. Or, might do a myo blend from green cover. Trying to get that bacteria going and see sedge activity go down.

Going to look into your forever plot blends. Might be something than can trellis off the goldenrod that can help soil health. perhaps I can get hairy vetch to go to seed before mid august each year. Canola grew amazing up there, deer didnt touch it though.

 

[SD51555]

Thats my lawn strategy...... I puts oats and rye out and let the weeds pick who's sticking around.

How does this apply to summer stands of native broadleaves like goldenrod? I seed my plots mid august in zone 3/4, rye clovers and smaller amounts of oats wheat and brassicas. This year I am blending in some milpa blend, mostly because the seed is about 3-4 years old.

Im on year 3 of doing this in poor and good sandy soil spots. PAst 2 years couldn't spray due to rain in forecast. However, I did crimp them with a 3 tire drag wth about 200lbs of logs ontop of it. Works way better with weight.

I know your working with the forever plot. Every found a good fall addition or two to the rye field? Besides clover and brassica. Or maybe specific companions to rye.

Got some crimson clover I got to use up. Was thinking of trying a spring plot of crimson clover and barley. Or, might do a myo blend from green cover. Trying to get that bacteria going and see sedge activity go down.

Going to look into your forever plot blends. Might be something than can trellis off the goldenrod that can help soil health. perhaps I can get hairy vetch to go to seed before mid august each year. Canola grew amazing up there, deer didnt touch it though.

Early to mid summer is hard. You’re still dealing with stuff peaking in growth thru mid July up here. It’s amazing how quickly the landscape goes from surging on July first to nearly everything being peaked out and finished growing by about July 15th. By August first it’s just standing there drying off and finishing seed maturation.

Once that biomass stops growing and starts turning colors, that’s when I look to start rolling. I don’t know the perfect time yet. I worry about going too early with winter trit. I don’t know if that would hurt anything or not. I also worry about going too soon with spring barley. I’d like to have it green when it get cold, but barley goes fast to get to heading. Heads aren’t bad either, but I want leaves too.

Far as fall companions for throw and roll, I’m still working on that. My current theory is the small seeds don’t have enough stored energy to get thru 4-6” of heavy biomass to hook up with the sun. I just realized I don’t have as much zucchini seed as I thought. Gonna still throw out squash and see if I can get them thru before it gets cold.

Last thing, and all credit to @Catscratch , I picked up some dry beans at the store. I’m gonna throw those in before I roll too. I’m gonna segregate these into 3 different plots to see which does better. Ten pounds for $28, no shipping, always in stock on the way home.

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[SD51555]

If there are any enterprising farmers out there, I’d think bagging bin run soybeans for fall sale could be a huge side business for a youngster. I understand the laws about planting back patented seeds, but once you sell them for “feed”…

I’d pay $30/bag for dirty bin run beans any day for fall forage.


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[Westwind]

I screened some larger seeds out of a milpa mix using hardware cloth (two square sizes). If you were only doing a couple bags of beans you very well might be able to clean beans the same way.

If I was going to do that I would also consider reaching out to Buckhunter for inoculation/seed starter type stuff.

 

[SD51555]

I screened some larger seeds out of a milpa mix using hardware cloth (two square sizes). If you were only doing a couple bags of beans you very well might be able to clean beans the same way.

If I was going to do that I would also consider reaching out to Buckhunter for inoculation/seed starter type stuff.

If you are just throwing and rolling, you wouldn’t get any benefit out of an inoculant.


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[Wind Gypsy]

If you are just throwing and rolling, you wouldn’t get any benefit out of an inoculant.

Why?

 

[SD51555]

Why?

You’re not causing any die off in your mycorhizal fungi because there’s no spraying or tillage. That’s the only reason you’d have to add it back. Even then, odds aren’t good it was stored properly to make it to the soil and still be alive.


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