SDSU Fertilizer Application Guide

SD51555

5 year old buck +
Hey team,

I had a discussion with my soil scientist today. I wanted to follow up with him to try to better understand the difference or correlation between PH, and buffer PH. While I still don't understand what it means, I did get the other answer I was looking for. That answer is that I do not need to lime. I can, but I should do it slowly and continue to test once a year.

He shared with me the guide he uses to make recommendations for nutrient application from South Dakota State University. I thumbed through it, and it is an excellent guide. The notes on buffer PH and liming recommendations is found on page 24.

http://pubstorage.sdstate.edu/AgBio_Publications/articles/EC750.pdf
 
We have lower ph like MBC. Lime has been added otherwise we get ash from paper mills when available. Very cheap and has a liming affect.

It is interesting that parts of NE Cass county wouldn't need as much lime. Are you near Brink farms? That is an impressive farm setup in the middle of the woods.
 
He's only a few miles away. I was on the phone with him this spring trying to arrange a deal to come yank my stumps. Due to the wet late spring, we never had a chance to get it done. We get water for camp down the road from his place at the goose lake well.
 
We have lower ph like MBC. Lime has been added otherwise we get ash from paper mills when available. Very cheap and has a liming affect.

It is interesting that parts of NE Cass county wouldn't need as much lime. Are you near Brink farms? That is an impressive farm setup in the middle of the woods.


SD and West Branch-I would be very interested in the information that area of Cass county did not need much lime. SD- did you pH test your soil?

Part of the answer is in which crop you are trying to grow.

I know that alfalfa in the central areas of Cass county (where the two squares fit together if you look at the map ) needs to have lime added to the soil for best growth.

There is a diagonal line across the state of Minnesota dividing areas that need lime and that do not. I have farm clients on both sides of the line.

Perhaps it is not accurate, but it appears to me that if conifers do well, lime is probably needed. Drainage is another factor in conifers or specifically pines doing well. Just an unedcuated observation on my part.
 
It's certainly an evolving situation that's for sure. I was a little surprised myself. I asked my soil guy if I could add a little lime anyway and he said go for it. So this spring before green up I'm gonna try 600lbs/acre of pell on the surface, and then test again when we roll and plant the fall plot to check N and PH. I did get a soil sample. Here's what I got back:
soil.PNG

My property is up in Salem township right by Goose lake and just a few miles west of Brink's farm. There isn't much for conifers in that area. It's all poplar, aspen, red oak, little bit of maple. I'm not far from the conifers. If you go 4 miles either east or west, you can get back into pure stands of pine and spruce.
 
I found this link about buffer ph.

http://www.spectrumanalytic.com/support/library/ff/soil_buffer_ph.htm

It looks like this is the basics of the buffer ph:

Too determine a lime recommendation, the laboratory looks at the difference between the original soil pH and the ending pH after the buffering solution has reacted with the soil. If the difference between the two pH measurements is large, it means that the soil pH is easily changed, and a low rate of lime will be sufficient. If the soil pH changes only a little after the buffering solution has reacted, it means that the soil pH is difficult to change and a larger lime addition is needed to reach the desired pH for the crop.

It seems odd that the SD State link says that you wouldn't want to add lime if the buffer test is 6.5 or greater, because you still can't get the ph up to the buffer ph without adding lime. Based on my reading you would want to add some lime each year and continue testing, like you said you plan on doing.

I don't think we have had any soil tests for quite a while. I may have to check things out.
 
My property is up in Salem township right by Goose lake and just a few miles west of Brink's farm. There isn't much for conifers in that area. It's all poplar, aspen, red oak, little bit of maple. I'm not far from the conifers. If you go 4 miles either east or west, you can get back into pure stands of pine and spruce.


When we picked up trees at Itasca Greenhouse back on May 9th we took some back roads and drove by Brink farms so we were right in your area. My brother works as a custom harvester and he knows some of the guys that harvest with Brink's crew.
 
I found this link about buffer ph.

http://www.spectrumanalytic.com/support/library/ff/soil_buffer_ph.htm

It looks like this is the basics of the buffer ph:



It seems odd that the SD State link says that you wouldn't want to add lime if the buffer test is 6.5 or greater, because you still can't get the ph up to the buffer ph without adding lime. Based on my reading you would want to add some lime each year and continue testing, like you said you plan on doing.

I don't think we have had any soil tests for quite a while. I may have to check things out.

That's ringing some bells from my conversation yesterday. The soil guy was using a lot of big words, so I was struggling to keep up. What's interesting is when I did my soil sample, I didn't have a probe, so I did a 6" sample. When I brought it in, they even commented that it looked like good sandy loam soil. But when you get below that 8" soil line it all changes. It's the kind of clay you need to scrape off the shovel with the heel of your boot. What I should do is get my hands on a soil probe and get a 2' sample next time I do it. I wonder if there is a place I can borrow or buy one cheap?
 
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