Is there a sure way to determine if soils are well drained enough for a plot?

[BJE80]

I have a location that would be just dynamite for a 1-1.5 acre plot but I have not done it because I don't know if the soils are well drained enough there. Is there a way to figure this out one way or another? It would probably only be a fall plot and I would be OK with that.
I would probably have the dozer guy try and ditch around the entire plot and try and fill the center in and crown it just to get as much water to run to the edges as possible.

 

[Terrific_tom]

I have a location that would be just dynamite for a 1-1.5 acre plot but I have not done it because I don't know if the soils are well drained enough there. Is there a way to figure this out one way or another? It would probably only be a fall plot and I would be OK with that.
I would probably have the dozer guy try and ditch around the entire plot and try and fill the center in and crown it just to get as much water to run to the edges as possible.

Your county should have a map of the different soils and if it is designated wetlands. Langlade county has a map that I can access online.

 

[dipper]

If you have standing water a few weeks after snow melt. I've got plots that push the limit of this guage and still do fine.

 

[SD51555]

I'd just give it a try. Dig up a soil sample when you can and adjust accordingly. If it's dry on the surface, I'd do a spray and pray and see what happens. In Texas, the Nuge did a segment where he seeded the edges of his water holes with grain. Low cost is low risk. I've dug holes in my low spots to see where the water level was at. I thought I was standing on dry ground. After digging a hole for a cranberry seedling, I quickly realized I was only 6 inches above the water at that time.

 

[TMIL]

Your county soil survey is something I'd highly recommend you check out. The soil conservation office here gives out hard copies for free (well, they did 15 years ago). There is a lot of very helpful information to get someone pointed in the right direction, on a macro level. I'm afraid it won't help much on a micro level for a specific situation. I'm with those guys who said, 'Just try it.' Heck, with access to a dozer you can do whatever you want!

 

[BJE80]

I am going to look at the soil maps again on the county GIS site. I did that a long time ago. Maybe that will help a little bit. However, it is all pretty slow draining for miles around in my area.


I can't just give it a try since I would need the area cleared when I get logged and then a dozer to clear the stumps. It is heavily wooded right now.

 

[BJE80]

Here is an aerial of my land.

The pink are the existing plots and you can see how it is lighter color which is my best drained soils. The blue shape is where I would love to put a plot right next to the thick cover and hemlock stand. My blue line showing where the plot would go follows the natural edge all the way around almost in a circle.

 

[bat man]

Putting plots in the 'best soil' often puts food where it can not be hunted without alerting the deer.

 

[BJE80]

The soil map doesn't show me anything as I remembered. I know there are places that are too wet to plant a plot that are all lumped together with areas that are dry enough.

 

[dipper]

Many times you can use those maps as a tissue. I've got perennial plots that will have standing water for a couple days after some heavy rain. Your gonna have to use common sense. Ill say it again, if the ground has standing water a month during spring thaw, it won't sustain a perennial plot. I have a bowl plot that has standing water till may. Other plots that are alluvial soil, and a high water table. You got to be able to read waters ability to drain. I use real low ground for annuals, brassica and cereals, because the standing water will kill everything into spring. They are still a great spots and I only have to dig down a couple feet to hit water. Makes for some quick watering holes with only a shovel.
It's a case by case basis, common sense.

 

[BJE80]

Many times you can use those maps as a tissue. I've got perennial plots that will have standing water for a couple days after some heavy rain. Your gonna have to use common sense. Ill say it again, if the ground has standing water a month during spring thaw, it won't sustain a perennial plot. I have a bowl plot that has standing water till may. Other plots that are alluvial soil, and a high water table. You got to be able to read waters ability to drain. I use real low ground for annuals, brassica and cereals, because the standing water will kill everything into spring. They are still a great spots and I only have to dig down a couple feet to hit water. Makes for some quick watering holes with only a shovel.
It's a case by case basis, common sense.

Thanks Dipper. It is a tough call because the ground is so un even right now. The water will sit in the low spots for quite awhile and the "humps" will be dry right away. I was saying the same thing before I would plan on it being only a annual fall plot. I really doubt I would have any luck in spring here. I think the key is that when the dozer would level it off that it was crowned with some grade to get the water to drain off.


I'll have to watch it close this spring.

 

[kabic]

From the sounds of it, if you ditch the perimeter like you said and apply that to plot area it may be just high enough to dry like the current humps do. I'm not sure how big of ditch you are planning...I'm assuming just enough to get the results you need.

The issue you may face is if your dozer guy is going to be popping out stumps your creating a lot of new low points. Maybe you can bury the stumps to make the area higher. Once you have the plot made and path to it, you can slowly bring in organic material (wood chips etc) and manure to raise the plot level.

 

[j-bird]

Do a perk test.

It sounds like the area doesn't drain well as it is.

Do perk tests on areas you know do well for you currently and use the information there to gauge what you have in the purposed new area.

Essentially you dig a hole - put a gallon of water in it and see how quickly it drains from the hole. Try to keep holes the same size and use the same amount of water - this should at least give you an idea of what you are up against.

 

[BJE80]

Do a perk test.

It sounds like the area doesn't drain well as it is.

Do perk tests on areas you know do well for you currently and use the information there to gauge what you have in the purposed new area.

Essentially you dig a hole - put a gallon of water in it and see how quickly it drains from the hole. Try to keep holes the same size and use the same amount of water - this should at least give you an idea of what you are up against.

That is a good idea. To give you an idea. No one and I mean no one has a mound or conventional septic within miles of my land. It is all holding tanks. No matter what.

 

[dipper]

I know the exact type of stuff your dealing with. I have to make a plot in a similiar area next summer. We're going in with an excavator and ripping all the trees out. Bulldozer to level the big tips and holes you talk about. The holes won't be an issue no problem, once leveled. If you don't have standing water your good. It should be noted a lot of heavy ground bean and corn fields have visible frozen water pockets. So take that for what it's worth. A food plot can handle a decent amount of standing water for our purposes. If heavy ag fields can do it, you'll be fine.

 

[dipper]

Do a perk test.

It sounds like the area doesn't drain well as it is.

Do perk tests on areas you know do well for you currently and use the information there to gauge what you have in the purposed new area.

Essentially you dig a hole - put a gallon of water in it and see how quickly it drains from the hole. Try to keep holes the same size and use the same amount of water - this should at least give you an idea of what you are up against.

Like I said, I have great plots I dig a hole and it fills with water. Cant till plots till June, but I don't generally till, and don't always need to plant something that early.

 

[BJE80]

Just look and see what is growing there now. If it is upland grass and trees, you are good to go. If it is willows and canary or sedge, I would not. No need for a bunch of testing! Good Luck!

Sapplings for undergrouth. Just your typical northwoods mixture of hardwoods and softwoods. Some trees on knobs to stay out of the water. Some are not. I wish I had a good picture.

 

[BJE80]

Like I said, I have great plots I dig a hole and it fills with water. Cant till plots till June, but I don't generally till, and don't always need to plant something that early.

Oh I can understand that. When I planted my apple trees I had to abandon a few spots because the holes filled up with water 6-8" below the ground. I planted my apple trees on the knobs to keep them high and dry as possible.

 

[dipper]

S

snapped the photo for you today. As you can see this food plot is still holding water. It is very rich soil. It holds water but I can still have a real nice plot.

 

[bat man]

S

snapped the photo for you today. As you can see this food plot is still holding water. It is very rich soil. It holds water but I can still have a real nice plot.

Most of my plots look like that after the recent thaw, but it does not seem a good gauge for the question.