Frustration grows in the Hoosier state

[bat man]

Does Indiana have mandatory check stations when you kill a deer? MN went away from that and many does were shot, cut up and frozen and never registered as you had 48 hours to call them in. They were in the freezer in 30 hours.

 

[j-bird]

Does Indiana have mandatory check stations when you kill a deer? MN went away from that and many does were shot, cut up and frozen and never registered as you had 48 hours to call them in. They were in the freezer in 30 hours.

Physical check-in is only optional now. Now all you have to do is make a phone call. I know many deer get taken every year and are never recorded. Farmers in particular simply shot'm, gut'm, butcher'm and freeze'm and they go on. The only way you NEED to have a tag number from checking a deer in is if you take it to a taxidermist or to a locker for processing, or if you get stopped while transporting one. Only reason the state cares is so they can get their money! With the landowners (like me) not required to purchase a tag the state has no idea who is even out there hunting. In fact 13.4% of the deer registered where from landowners - who did the right thing - how many countless others didn't.......... Hell the state can't tell you how many hunters we even have in a given year - because of things like landowners not having to buy a tag and lifetime tags that are used or are not used. Management without data - gotta love it!

 

[Jeff23]

It is perfectly legal to move known Cwd deer between game farms even under so called quarantine.

This is a misleading statement. 1)The only way someone would have a known CWD positive deer would be if it were dead; there is no approved live test... yet. 2) A farm in WI that has had a positive- which doesn't necessarily indicate which other deer may be positive- can kill their deer at a hunt facility. Most states do not allow that, so your blanket statement doesn't always apply. In no case may a farm with a CWD positive move a deer to another breeding facility. 3) A "so called quarantine" often means they are tracing back all known connections to a CWD positive facility, both forward and backward, so quarantine doesn't mean the location has or has had a CWD positive deer, just that they are trying to determine levels of risk.
You are applying what you say is happening with your relatives to everyone, and that is unfair and mostly untrue. Even if someone moves a fawn pre-inventory, the receiving farm needs to report when that animal is 12 months of age where it came from, and if they report truthfully, they would be caught. If they lie, it may end up catching up with them anyway as it probably means they lied about the pedigree, which can be verified in most cases.

 

[sandbur]

This is a misleading statement. 1)The only way someone would have a known CWD positive deer would be if it were dead; there is no approved live test... yet. 2) A farm in WI that has had a positive- which doesn't necessarily indicate which other deer may be positive- can kill their deer at a hunt facility. Most states do not allow that, so your blanket statement doesn't always apply. In no case may a farm with a CWD positive move a deer to another breeding facility. 3) A "so called quarantine" often means they are tracing back all known connections to a CWD positive facility, both forward and backward, so quarantine doesn't mean the location has or has had a CWD positive deer, just that they are trying to determine levels of risk.
You are applying what you say is happening with your relatives to everyone, and that is unfair and mostly untrue. Even if someone moves a fawn pre-inventory, the receiving farm needs to report when that animal is 12 months of age where it came from, and if they report truthfully, they would be caught. If they lie, it may end up catching up with them anyway as it probably means they lied about the pedigree, which can be verified in most cases.

Thank you for the clarification, Jeff.I was going to question him about that statement.
If Dipper is seeing something illegal going on with these domestic deer, it needs to be reported.

 

[Jeff23]

Thank you for the clarification, Jeff.I was going to question him about that statement.
If Dipper is seeing something illegal going on with these domestic deer, it needs to be reported.

You're welcome, and I completely agree.

 

[Jeff23]

Coming from a guy who hunts behind fences and has a long track record defending deer farmers

I have done just what you mentioned (including just this past winter), and those does tasted great! If someone said, "You can do the same thing, but have to shoot a buck," I would do that too- I'm betting those straps will taste just as good! :)
Hey Dipper, I grew up on a dairy farm, and the does we shot on the preserve were nothing similar to Holsteins except both lived within the confines of a fence. A 1,000 acre preserve is nothing like Gene's breeding pen. ;) Actually, if it weren't for a wind switch, I would have gone home empty handed this past winter. (It seems those "Holsteins" I was hunting knew the smell of a human meant danger!)
Aug 21, 2014Report
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Not that you care, but I have hunted behind high fence 4 times in my life, killed does three of those times, and not only defend deer farmers from unfair criticism, but have a deer farm. I have never hidden that information, so resurrect whichever old posts you wish. I guess that means I don't have any input worth contributing to these or any other discussions??

 

[bueller]

If the end of deer hunting as we know is coming because of the DNR, CWD, deer farms, car insurance companies, politics, or whatever other scapegoat, then I guess we better enjoy it while it lasts. Watch out baldies and yearlings, no reason to be picky anymore

 

[dipper]

You don't garner support from many folks because you're an abrasive SOB ;)
If you aren't willing to contact the folks that sandbur told you to...then what is it that you expect the rest of us to do? Beeatch and moan about deer farmers? Seems as though its possible your relatives are playing fast and loose with the rules...does that mean all deer farmers do? I give Jeff some respect because he has always represented deer farmers with intelligent, thought out responses (both here and on QDMA). That doesn't mean I agree 100% with everything he posts or does as a deer farmer, but at least he's trying to show the flip side of the coin that most of us don't know first hand.
I'm guessing deer farmers are like most any other folks...some are bad, some are good, some are in between. I'm not ready to vilify an entire group based on the actions of a few bad apples. I do think it would be a positive thing for the good deer farmers to start calling out the bad ones...it would seem like a good way to provide job security.

Enjoy your deer as well.

 

[Jeff23]

There u go, the fact that I'm on an island and can't garner support from a bunch of like minded pissed off hunters shows how unreasonable my beliefs are. Enjoy your deer.

I wouldn't say your beliefs are unreasonable, just different than mine. The discussion/debate is part of the fun for me. I enjoy all deer, and expect to continue to do so. You do the same.

 

[sandbur]

There's nothing illegal, that's the problem! Let's alol make a reasonable guess as to how Cwd recently turned up on that farm in eau Claire. The poor farmer has no record he ever imported a deer to his facility. Wonder how? It's not in the wild herd...yet!
I guess Johnny q public is content with all your "loose" language. Get freaking use to reduced herd levels, it's as simple as that.
Everyone has a scapegoat, I'm apparently one of the few that has an issue with the deer farmers& reduced herds. Carry on and bitch about the government some more.....

Dipper-I agree with you that the deer farmer has contributed to spreading CWD and I am not happy about it. If the action you mentioned is not illegal, please contact the state board anyway. These veterinarians understand disease control and they need to be made aware of loopholes that can spread disease. Your state has had some of the best vets working on disease control. This statement comes from my personal experience with some of them. I went to school with them.

I have no first hand experience with the situation in the last farm. Perhaps the deer farmer violated the law in some way. But remember that CWD can be spread by feed, by contaminated soil, and by the actions of deer hunters and land managers. Perhaps by predators and who knows even by rodents, or birds.

As to deer farms, I have tremendous respect to all farmers who take good care of their livestock and who struggle day after day to make a living. Like it or not, domestic deer are livestock in Minnesota and probably also in Wisconsin from the way I understand the laws.

 

[bat man]

Dipper does not seem to understand what is going on here in MN.

DNR had an agenda to lower the deer herd and did it without informing the hunters. Hunters called BS and DNR did not care. Hunters got an audit of our DNR management and herd monitoring.

Not the same story as WI.

 

[bat man]

I was just trying to help u guys, i feel strongly deer pens should be taking alot of the blame.

If what you purpoort is true, what is the plan of action?

 

[dipper]

If what you purpoort is true, what is the plan of action?

Going fishing tomorrow

 

[j-bird]

Well anyone that knows me from other forums has seen this already, but I'm going to put it here as well.

I found a group Indiana White-tailed Deer Herd Management Group on facebook and they appear to be interested in trying to get organized to affect change. I have already contacted them myself and awaiting a reply. I am encouraging any Hoosier deer hunter to check out their facebook page and see if this is something you wish to be a part of.

 

[MoLandOwner]

Well anyone that knows me from other forums has seen this already, but I'm going to put it here as well.

I found a group Indiana White-tailed Deer Herd Management Group on facebook and they appear to be interested in trying to get organized to affect change. I have already contacted them myself and awaiting a reply. I am encouraging any Hoosier deer hunter to check out their facebook page and see if this is something you wish to be a part of.

That's not the group with Higgens in it?.......is it?

 

[wiscwhip]

That's not the group with Higgens in it?.......is it?

He is in the Illinois group.

 

[MoLandOwner]

Sorry, wrong state! I was thinking but nothing happened!:eek:

 

[j-bird]

I was very clear when I reached out to the group here that Hunters/landowners shared some responsibility in this matter as well. I am not out to sink the DNR - I simply want open dialogue between the stake-holders and a public plan (where we are, where we want to go, and how we are going to monitor the progress, AND what we are going to do once we reach the goal). Some folks want heads on platters or to essentially shut down the antlerless harvest and that just isn't going to happen. We need to push for a public plan about the harvest goals, but there also needs to be more done regarding educating hunters and landowners about trigger control and habitat (much like Batman has talked about). The DNR also needs to do what hey can in managing properties better as well.

 

[bat man]

We can debate why till we are blue in the face, but the tags and more aggressive seasons will keep coming...

Dip has a point. How bad can it be if the public keeps buying tags.? Great argument for the DNR. If we retain customers, business is good. Stockholders must be happy.

Easy to keep shrinking the herd if the hunters keep coming back. Reactive at best, but until they are proven wrong (license sales) its easy to keep selling.

But he still needs to quit getting so butt hurt every time he posts.

 

[bat man]

Builds character

You have character. No one here will argue that.