Or, you dont have many predators. Research at Tall Timbers plantation has shown that predators can limit quail populations - even in good to excellent habitat. Probably the same with rabbits.
Educate me on turkey nesting and raising young
- Thread starter j-bird
- Start date
Or, you dont have many predators. Research at Tall Timbers plantation has shown that predators can limit quail populations - even in good to excellent habitat. Probably the same with rabbits.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
There is some interesting research that demonstrates the interplay between predators and habitat. This happened to be with deer fawn predation and coyotes but I presume the principle holds true with many species. Limited good habitat actually reduced recruitment compared to all poor habitat. This research was done on a pretty large scale. It turns out that improved habitat around creeks, pipelines, and other non-canopied areas created long narrow strips of habitat. Does were predisposed to fawn in this habitat which was markedly better than the surrounding canopied area. These limited sized blocks of cover were much easier for coyotes to hunt. Their success rate at killing fawns was much higher.
The best recruitment rates occurred where there was large blocks of the good early successional habitat for fawning. Fawning was much less densely concentrated and much harder for coyotes to hunt.
This is just one example, but sometimes we think we are making things better when we are making them works. Complex systems with lots of interplay are hard to understand.
Another non-intuitive study result was that an increase in coyote populations had a slightly positive effect on turkey populations even though coyotes are predators of turkey. The speculation was that while coyotes did predate some turkey, they predated other turkey nest predators at a much higher rate so overall turkey recruitment increased.
Thanks,
Jack
ksgobbler
5 year old buck +
no doubt predators play a role. However last fall hunting a different area of the state where habitat is good and not fragmented so many quail were encountered you didn’t even chase singles. No doubt they play a role but when you have contiguous good habitat it doesn’t seem to make much of a difference.
Each and every area is different - with different dynamics influencing predator and prey populations. The quail research at Tall Timbers showed quail populations on SOME lands might be limited by predation - even in good to excellent cover. But, quail populations on other land with the same number of predators might not be so influenced. Maybe there is a wider variety of prey base - more cotton rats. Maybe the weather is more or less forgiving and also affects nest success. As Yoderjac indicated - so many inter-relationships going on in individual areas - it becomes difficult to apply successes or failures in one area to another - but it is natural for us to try.
cavey
5 year old buck +
"Another non-intuitive study result was that an increase in coyote populations had a slightly positive effect on turkey populations... "
That makes sense when you think about it, coyotes are likely to prey more on the easiest to kill - sick or injured birds which if left alive may spread disease effecting the overall populations.
Turkeys around hear, at least for the last 10 years, have had a tougher time; increased predator pops (influx of fishers), very wet springs, reduction in crp acreage, the collapse of the family dairy farms - particularly the associated winter spreading of manure - a significant winter survival food source...
That makes sense when you think about it, coyotes are likely to prey more on the easiest to kill - sick or injured birds which if left alive may spread disease effecting the overall populations.
Turkeys around hear, at least for the last 10 years, have had a tougher time; increased predator pops (influx of fishers), very wet springs, reduction in crp acreage, the collapse of the family dairy farms - particularly the associated winter spreading of manure - a significant winter survival food source...
Native Hunter
5 year old buck +
I've not read any of the responses in this thread, so excuse me if I repeat something already stated.
The thing to keep in mind about nesting turkeys is that they will travel off several hundred yards sometimes to places they don't normally go to make nests. My farm is one of the best examples of that. I have great habitat for deer and quail - and extremely poor habitat for turkey. Yet, I always get a few nesting hens each year. Once that is over with, there won't be another turkey for months. Reconyx trail cameras don't lie.
I generally turkey hunt a different farm, but if I do want to hunt my place, I need to go in early in the spring and bushhog big roads through the grasses so the turkey will travel them. Without this, forget any gobblers and all you will see is a few nesting hens - going off several hundred yards from their home to nest.
Unless there is almost zero pressure, you won't find turkeys in a woods less than 100 acres very often in this country. Their normal home is big woods and if it has other types of habitat adding a lot of diversity, then that makes it even better. But the BIG WOODS is the key around here.
The thing to keep in mind about nesting turkeys is that they will travel off several hundred yards sometimes to places they don't normally go to make nests. My farm is one of the best examples of that. I have great habitat for deer and quail - and extremely poor habitat for turkey. Yet, I always get a few nesting hens each year. Once that is over with, there won't be another turkey for months. Reconyx trail cameras don't lie.
I generally turkey hunt a different farm, but if I do want to hunt my place, I need to go in early in the spring and bushhog big roads through the grasses so the turkey will travel them. Without this, forget any gobblers and all you will see is a few nesting hens - going off several hundred yards from their home to nest.
Unless there is almost zero pressure, you won't find turkeys in a woods less than 100 acres very often in this country. Their normal home is big woods and if it has other types of habitat adding a lot of diversity, then that makes it even better. But the BIG WOODS is the key around here.
I have two hens with 16 poults that make my front and back yard part of their every day food cruise. I shoot all the raccoons and possums that I can every year. Some years I have taken out 15 to 20 coons and a similar number of possums. I catch them under my bird feeders at night with my house spotlights serving to illuminate the targets. I believe this helps the hens eggs actually develop into poults. Great fun to watch!
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Interesting differences. Here in VA, we have lots of big woods in national parks in the mountains in the western part of the state. Turkey densities are very low by comparison to the eastern part of the state where habitat is much more diverse. It is a mix of hardwoods, pine plantations, pasture land, row crop land, and everything between. I live in the suburbs and it is not that uncommon to see turkey. I even see turkey inside the DC beltway once or twice every couple years. We had a hen fly into the glass window of an office building and break her neck.
I think the Big Woods idea was much more prevalent in the past. Things may be different in other locations. I'm sure winter has a big impact on birds in the north. Here, the winters are mild enough that turkey can always find good food sources. Yes, they love hard mast, but they find plenty of food during mast crop failures in diverse habitat.
Your point about bushhoging is very interesting and spot on. It goes to having good brooding habitat. A very large percentage of a poults diet is comprised of insects. Young poults can't navigate through fescue and turf grasses that fall over easily. Bunch grasses with bare ground underneath is ideal. Hens are reluctant to nest in places where poults can't easily navigate brooding ground. Bushhogging can provide travel corridors.
One not of caution is that bushhogging narrow limited access routes can also funnel birds with poults in such a way that makes predation easier. If you are bushhogging otherwise hard to navigate pathways, consider multiple and wider routes.
Thanks,
Jack
