Do you have any extra's?
- Thread starter Maya
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aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Sandbar,
Get a book on hard cider and you will get all the info you need to know about tannins, bitter, bittersweet etc etc etc until you are so confused you wont know what to do. But that being said you can test for tannins, acids, ph and many other aspects which to into making high quality or at least old world hard ciders. I have come up with the opinion that its all about recipes and personal taste as to what you like in a cider or not. There are also many books out there many of which contradict but you can also go online and search the heck out of cider apples and find out which are good for what. A lot of apples used for blending hard cider are described as inedible lol. I have actually grafted a few and should be growing some of them but they are important to add bitter or tannin or whatever the quality that you are looking for in your cider.
George I find that article interesting and I would love to become a boutique cider supplier for some small scale cideries and that's one of the reasons I have been planting and grafting many old cider varieties the past few years in hopes of having something unique to offer. There are quite a few cideries in NY and PA (although PA is a pain in the tail with their regulations including alcohol levels in cider) that are not that far from my farm so I hope to explore some of those places this year and see if I can get some sort of enterprise going in hopes of putting a few bucks back into this very obsessed hobby I have now. I don't want to be the hard cider maker per se but if I can produce special order juice that could be a good niche.
Paul
Get a book on hard cider and you will get all the info you need to know about tannins, bitter, bittersweet etc etc etc until you are so confused you wont know what to do. But that being said you can test for tannins, acids, ph and many other aspects which to into making high quality or at least old world hard ciders. I have come up with the opinion that its all about recipes and personal taste as to what you like in a cider or not. There are also many books out there many of which contradict but you can also go online and search the heck out of cider apples and find out which are good for what. A lot of apples used for blending hard cider are described as inedible lol. I have actually grafted a few and should be growing some of them but they are important to add bitter or tannin or whatever the quality that you are looking for in your cider.
George I find that article interesting and I would love to become a boutique cider supplier for some small scale cideries and that's one of the reasons I have been planting and grafting many old cider varieties the past few years in hopes of having something unique to offer. There are quite a few cideries in NY and PA (although PA is a pain in the tail with their regulations including alcohol levels in cider) that are not that far from my farm so I hope to explore some of those places this year and see if I can get some sort of enterprise going in hopes of putting a few bucks back into this very obsessed hobby I have now. I don't want to be the hard cider maker per se but if I can produce special order juice that could be a good niche.
Paul
sandbur
5 year old buck +
My interests tend towards the crab apples and I will be grafting some of the older prairie varieties this spring. I have no idea how they will taste.
My primary purpose is for wildlife, for CAR testing, and for winter hardiness.
I have even done a bit of reading on breeding apples. I would like to try a few crosses with the chestnut crab. Might never get to it....
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Well for what its worth I know that a lot of crabapples are used to add acid or tannins to hard cider
Maya
5 year old buck +
Paul, in order to make money at it you have to do it all imo. Cider makers up here in Vt are doing real well, but they can not pay enough to make it worthwhile for most growers to make the investment to plant and grow. Woodchuck is the 2nd biggest cider maker in the US, but they don't buy much of anything from Vermont growers, and it's not just dollars. We do not produce enough as a whole to supply them. I want to say they need 10,000+ acres of apples to produce enough for their needs. Vermont only has in the neighborhood of 2000 acres total planted.
Even with some high Brix content in the 15-20 range, will only get you $15-18 per bushel. Most apples are only fetching $8 per bushel. Grown and bottled yourself can make a few bucks for you, but even then it's just a good value added product to go along with a good U-pic operation imo.
Even with some high Brix content in the 15-20 range, will only get you $15-18 per bushel. Most apples are only fetching $8 per bushel. Grown and bottled yourself can make a few bucks for you, but even then it's just a good value added product to go along with a good U-pic operation imo.
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
George
Not really trying to make money and no way want to get into a deal with a big supplier bit just sell some juice that is unique to some craft guys or some small scale cider makers. Just want to get some payback for some of the sprays and supplies I use in this hobby. Maybe buy a new pair of pruners lol. That's all
Paul
Not really trying to make money and no way want to get into a deal with a big supplier bit just sell some juice that is unique to some craft guys or some small scale cider makers. Just want to get some payback for some of the sprays and supplies I use in this hobby. Maybe buy a new pair of pruners lol. That's all
Paul
Turkey Creek
5 year old buck +
I get the trade publications and I have seen the stories over the last year or two about the lack of cider apples. We have a lot of micro brewers and small vineyards here in Nebraska. Trying to get a friend of mine to go into the hard cider business. He has enough acres and is looking to diversify his income. Possibly strike a deal with one of the existing breweries.
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Couple hundred a week would be good but I couldn't sit in a roadside stand more than 15 minutes lol. But may do the trust system. I am going to do something this year so I can depreciate all my equipment and keep the money out of uncle SAMs hands
We have attended the Expo in Michigan early dec most years , went on a tour dec 14 and sampled many hard ciders from established orchards, flavors and aromas are like wines all up to the individual consumer , dry , sweet, light , heavy , they come in all types . The industry is exploding not enough production , even here in Minnesota demand is strong but most makers do not want desert apples , We have been pressing ours fresh and selling no fermentation our price at the orchard is $8.00 gal so yield maybe $24.00 bu after the press . We use seconds from our sort of desert type apples although we do have some cider types we grow . Some say you cannot make a good cider without some crabs in the mix and I could not agree more . We sell a fair amount of cider to hobbyists that want to try a batch of hard cider we don't budge on price , when we harvest we use no drops only picked fruit . We do all the gathering in the trees .
chickenlittle
5 year old buck +
I think it is difficult to transition from hobby/habitat to sales. Having a huge variety of cultivars and rootstocks means you have no scale for any part of the work, from what and when to spray to what should be picked and marketed. Not the same as having a block of Goldrush and a block of Honeycrisp to focus on. Even if you consider that the trees and equipment are free, just getting enough sales to cover your extra time would be tough.
Heres a few hints for ultra small orchards its worth what you pay , Marketing is everything sat in of a conference years ago older gentleman speaking of the apple industry , says hes been in the apple business for 40 plus years quote was Anybody can grow em it take a genius to turn em into money ,
On small scale cider put out the word or flyers at the local brewing , wine making supplier to tap into the hobbyist interest keep your prices reasonable press for them even have them come out and help with the pressing , these people are looking for the experience more than the product and will spend for it , they will also tolerate blemished fruit that's low spray . Home wine making is also booming of coarse theres a vineyard in your area that wants to add hard cider to their offering they will be interested but are hard to get to pay enough don't let them fool you they want the juice for free but the end product is priceless .
On small scale cider put out the word or flyers at the local brewing , wine making supplier to tap into the hobbyist interest keep your prices reasonable press for them even have them come out and help with the pressing , these people are looking for the experience more than the product and will spend for it , they will also tolerate blemished fruit that's low spray . Home wine making is also booming of coarse theres a vineyard in your area that wants to add hard cider to their offering they will be interested but are hard to get to pay enough don't let them fool you they want the juice for free but the end product is priceless .
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Not really any extra time since I am picking the apples anyway and instead of them rotting or going for deer food at least I might be able to pay for some supplies. My time is free now since retired so there is no real cost to that unless you include honey DO pay haha. I am not looking g to scale just to sell some stuff and see where it goes. Thanks for the input. Btw did you get your scions?
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Wooduck really appreciate the info. I am just looking to feel good about what I do and put a few bucks in my pocket. I don't need the money to survive (thank god) but would be nice to say I am selling some of what I grow. Being a hobbyist orchardist dips a far cry from what I did before but it's a helluva lot more rewarding for sure I really do believe marketing is the key and getting to the right person with the right story or approach is a key factor. I am not putting out a whole lot of juice yet but sure can do more especially with all the bushels of apples I have given away in the past
Thanks again
Paul
Maya
5 year old buck +
Paul, I do set up a small roadside stand and do the honor system while I'm not here. Not to many problems. I bag them with a price on the bag and leave out a bushel behind the bagged ones in case they want to bag their own. I'm putting op a barn in a year or two and will eventually sell out of that. When I'm retired! ;)
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Looks like something I can handle. Those apples look great and love the bushel box too
sandbur
5 year old buck +
Wooduck- are you making hard cider or just selling juice?
aerospacefarmer
5 year old buck +
Thanks for that info. I never thought of looking there for a source to sell some. Do you remember what the area was that these ads were posted?
