cover crop before brassica

[MoBuckChaser]

Plant together and you will have a lot of N, the science is out there.

I know the science very well. AWP can produce UP TO 150lbs of N. Buckwheat NONE that I know of.

 

[shawnv]

I know the science very well. AWP can produce UP TO 150lbs of N. Buckwheat NONE that I know of.

Buckwheat when planted along with AWP triggers something in AWP that increases the amount of N AWP produces by a significant margin. Buckwheat will grab it besides phosphorus as an added benefit. I sat through a multi-hour hour university presentation on soil science and cover crops and this is a relatively new discovery within the past couple years so I can understand where you would not be aware of this.

 

[wiscwhip]

Well, wherever you are getting your oats from is ripping you off! Hard! A combo of BW and AWP(or any other field pea for that matter) is not even close to being as economical to plant as a couple of bags of oats.

 

[shawnv]

I used to pay $18-$22 a bag that covered and acre. Last year it was like $50 for BW and $30 something for AWP for an acres worth of that. So at $40 something per acre it's higher than it used to be but not 5x oats, probably double.

 

[shawnv]

Nova, any of the suggestions will work for you so do whatever is best for your time and money. I don't want to get into a "who's more right" match so I'm bowing out at this point.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

Buckwheat when planted along with AWP triggers something in AWP that increases the amount of N AWP produces by a significant margin. Buckwheat will grab it besides phosphorus as an added benefit. I sat through a multi-hour hour university presentation on soil science and cover crops and this is a relatively new discovery within the past couple years so I can understand where you would not be aware of this.

I would love to see the science on this from a independent source or any university. I go to classes every year to sort through the fact and fiction. Never seen any proven studies on your theory yet. But would love to see it.

 

[kabic]

I tend to believe Shawn did hear what he said he did at a presentation. I'm not having much luck finding the Cornell Study, but have found a few site that say:

Mixing legumes and grasses can also increase the amount of atmospheric nitrogen fixed by legumes because faster rooting grasses will deplete soil nitrogen levels, causing the legume component to fix more nitrogen.

Adding cowpeas to the buckwheat cover crop reduces your need to add a layer of compost before seeding your fall garden since you greatly increase the amount of available nitrogen produced. Like many legumes, cowpeas fix nitrogen out of the air, and they do that even better when there's very little nitrogen in the soil for them to suck up. Buckwheat steals soil nitrogen from its neighbors, tricking the cowpeas into fixing more nitrogen than they would if grown by themselves in the same soil. You cut the duo at the same time you would have cut the buckwheat (which is several weeks earlier than you would normally cut cowpeas) and end up with somewhere between 50% to 100% of your nitrogen needs for the fall garden taken care of.

http://www.hort.cornell.edu/extension/organic/ocs/tutorial/legume_n/4mixes.htm

 

[shawnv]

I tend to believe Shawn did hear what he said he did at a presentation. I'm not having much luck finding the Cornell Study, but have found a few site that say:

I'll post the link to the one of the video presentations I watched sometime once I find it again (I watched a lot) but I think what kabic posted was the point. The unknown in the trials was why buckwheat preformed better at this than other companions. I organic farmed garlic for a number of years so that's how I came across that tidbit. I did cover crop that way the past couple of years for my garlic is a high N feeder like brassicas and transitioned it to a couple food plots.

 

[wiscwhip]

The fact that a grass/legume mixture produces more N than a monoculture legume is nothing new at all, it has been in play for a long, long time. It is proven in nature by the fact that a mixed prairie produces some of the most fertile natural soils in existence. A good mixed prairie will have a high diversity and good amounts of grasses, legumes, and other broadleafs. BW is not a grass, it is a broadleaf, however, it is a very, very efficient nutrient scavenger compared to many other plants, whether it is planted with a companion crop or not. The "symbiotic effect" it has with the legume is real, it is just that to achieve the effects of the "extra" N(that would be produced at a higher rate as it was robbed from the legume's root nodules by the BW), it takes planting it with another high cost legume companion crop, i.e. cowpeas or AWP's. I believe the OP was looking to get away from high cost, short term, cover crop plantings.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

Yes the OP was looking for something cheap, cant get much cheaper than Oats at 2 bu per acre. Adding 4010 peas for not much money more could help as well. But they cost more money. And he wanted cheap.

But the direction we have gone from is the Buckwheat and AWP produce lots of nitrogen. The Buckwheat does not. Does the fact that the buckwheat as a companion crop help the AWP produce more N, possibly. Because it has worked, some say, with peas in California. But we ain't got the weather or season or soil they do in california. I would love to see any actual studies on it from our area. So far all the CCA's I have learned from in this area, have nothing to prove it. Yet!

 

[shawnv]

I believe the OP was looking to get away from high cost, short term, cover crop plantings.

That was my bad for reading the thread title and running with it.

 

[Diesel5610]

Never used oats but may give them a shot this year. I have noticed the same thing with buckwheat prices here, they have jumped a bit. We have used Berseem clover as a cover crop before brassicas and it is another option. Not sure it would fit your cheap criteria.