Are the glory days of deer hunting coming to a close?

[BenA]

I wonder why land shares haven't caught on in areas like it has down here. Here it's more of residents displacing residents for deer hunting land.

 

[cbw]

Understood but from a resource and/or hunting standpoint why is a local more valuable that a nonresident? A lot of locals around me arent worth pissing on if they were on fire. I don’t think the fact you lay your head somewhere makes you a better steward of a resource

You gotta get better neighbors. Here is your official invitation to move to Iowa!

I’m making the assumption that there should be inherent benefits to where a person chooses to make their home. I’m making this assumption regardless of a persons character. There are laws to deal with scumbags.

As to the resource, I honestly can’t speak to that, as I haven’t seen or read about such impact (positive or negative). And while I see your point that you should likely have better habitat and resource managers, there will likely be more hunters, so likely something else will need to give (#of tags, tighter restrictions on non-resident non-land owners, etc)

And, personally (selfishly, perhaps), I am growing to hold the opinion of Lee Lakowski, that I’d rather have a neighbor that does a legal deer drive that lasts for only 2 weeks—and will kill an occasional 3yo (like happened yesterday with my neighbor)—compared to the hunting pressure of all neighbors targeting the same monster from Oct through Jan 10.

Bottomline for me and the state I choose to live and hunt, the habitat and resource is so fragile, (less than 7% timber, little public ground) that I don’t want to risk the possible impact on the resource and hunting that opening the floodgates to nonresident land owners might cause.


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[cbw]

Another thought… if you lived in Iowa like Hillrunner and I, would you want it to change?


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[cbw]

So, Jan 2-4, I’m doing my first out of state hunt to Tennessee to hunt ducks on the Mississippi River. And I’ve put my hat into the draw for an Idaho elk tag next year, so I reserve the right to charge my views in the future. :-)


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[Howboutthemdawgs]

Another thought… if you lived in Iowa like Hillrunner and I, would you want it to change?


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Great question. I honestly don’t know because I’m the outside looking in. I guess I would still appreciate the guy who invests in my state in a substantial manor. Not the guy who buys 10 acres so he game the system. But if I’m a resident and a guy comes in from Georgia and spends 2.5 mil to buy 300 next to me, I’m going to run with the assumption he’s on the same page with goals (I could obviously be wrong but it seems unlikely.) Conversely if farmer Johnson lets 5 guys from town come hunt cause his paw grew up with his paw, I have no idea what to expect but my mind would usually go to the worse case.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

So, Jan 2-4, I’m doing my first out of state hunt to Tennessee to hunt ducks on the Mississippi River. And I’ve put my hat into the draw for an Idaho elk tag next year, so I reserve the right to charge my views in the future. :-)


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You sonof….! Hahaha
Hope its awesome

 

[SwampCat]

I have the answer to your problems. Move to a location that grows small deer, almost no small game, no pretty mountains, no row crop, very few non residents, hot as hell 8 months out of the year. Did I say Very few NR. Lower land prices. Red country through and through. I am pretty sure the rest makes 150” deer as your monster worth it

 

[cbw]

I have the answer to your problems. Move to a location that grows small deer, almost no small game, no pretty mountains, no row crop, very few non residents, hot as hell 8 months out of the year. Did I say Very few NR. Lower land prices. Red country through and through. I am pretty sure the rest makes 150” deer as your monster worth it

That’s funny… we are now both proposing the same solution… to move. :-)


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[BenA]

How many resident landowners that own property for hunting are not displacing locals from hunting there? Are they just letting locals have free hunting use of the land so they have a place they can go hunting whenever they want? I bet residents are more restricted by other residents than nonresidents.

 

[omicron1792]

I agree with @Howboutthemdawgs on this one.

The county where my farm is has fallen in population for the last 30 years. It is down to less than 10k people.

Drugs have about wiped out a whole generation of people. There just aren’t the 20-40 year olds participating in home buying, careers, etc, much less hunting.

I buy gas, seed local when I can. I hire local for dozer work. Pond building. Adding stands. My barn build. I stop at the local general store every time I go down. The owner, one of the few productive members of his generation that grew up there, and I have become friends. We text and talk often. He loooooves that I have made my farm a second home outside of the big city.

I haven’t had a poacher or trespasser in over 4 years, and I have had 1 in the 8 years I have owned the farm. I have locals call me if my gate is left open or they see anything funny on my farm. They know that poacher won’t be calling them for a 2k electrical wiring job when I add to my solar setup. Or a 3k septic tank when I finally get it put in.

Y’all are comparing an out of state landowner to yourselves. You should be comparing it to the average citizen of these poor counties where most of our farms are.

 

[SwampCat]

How many resident landowners that own property for hunting are not displacing locals from hunting there? Are they just letting locals have free hunting use of the land so they have a place they can go hunting whenever they want? I bet residents are more restricted by other residents than nonresidents.

Not many NR landowners here, but one right across the road from me - 1400 acres. 25 years ago probably 25 different residents hunting it for turkeys, deer, ducks, and hogs. 20 years ago a NR bought it and high fenced it. To my knowledge, a resident never hunted the place since then, and it has resold to another NR since then. But to be honest, a resident could have done the same thing. Big difference to me is residents support the local and state economy 12 months a year

 

[BenA]

Not many NR landowners here, but one right across the road from me - 1400 acres. 25 years ago probably 25 different residents hunting it for turkeys, deer, ducks, and hogs. 20 years ago a NR bought it and high fenced it. To my knowledge, a resident never hunted the place since then, and it has resold to another NR since then. But to be honest, a resident could have done the same thing. Big difference to me is residents support the local and state economy 12 months a year

Not an ordinary circumstance though. And, I don't think you'd wish you had 25 more hunters next to you though. Support for the wildlife resources is different than support for the local and state economy.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Not many NR landowners here, but one right across the road from me - 1400 acres. 25 years ago probably 25 different residents hunting it for turkeys, deer, ducks, and hogs. 20 years ago a NR bought it and high fenced it. To my knowledge, a resident never hunted the place since then, and it has resold to another NR since then. But to be honest, a resident could have done the same thing. Big difference to me is residents support the local and state economy 12 months a year

Let me ask you though, does it matter to you in the least if someone supports Arkansas’ economy 12 months out of the year as opposed to the money a nonresident brings? I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a tangible benefit from that. It seems like a pie in the sky theoretical benefit.

 

[Hoytvectrix]

I wonder how many non-resident landowners end up retiring on or near their property? My parents didn't move to their property until 10 years ago, but my Dad has owned or hunted that property for 50 years. Locals complain about out of staters buying up their land, but that property was vacant with no activity for 30 years before my parents bought it. At what point are they considered locals?

Sure, their career earned income taxes were collected in another state, but all of their retirement income is spent there. If and when I retire I will do the same that they did. In the meantime, nearly all of my expendable income is spent in Missouri.

 

[SwampCat]

Let me ask you though, does it matter to you in the least if someone supports Arkansas’ economy 12 months out of the year as opposed to the money a nonresident brings? I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a tangible benefit from that. It seems like a pie in the sky theoretical benefit.

I dont know the dollars and cents of it - but the less contribution to the county economy by a NR - the more a resident landowner will eventually be tasked with paying. Lets say all of a sudden 5% of land in a county was bought by NR owners. Where is the county going to make up that millage and sales tax loss than inflict higher taxes on resident land owners in one way or another?

 

[BenA]

I dont know the dollars and cents of it - but the less contribution to the county economy by a NR - the more a resident landowner will eventually be tasked with paying. Lets say all of a sudden 5% of land in a county was bought by NR owners. Where is the county going to make up that millage and sales tax loss than inflict higher taxes on resident land owners in one way or another?

Local economies benefit greatly with sales dollars and taxes generated by non-residents.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

I wonder how many non-resident landowners end up retiring on or near their property? My parents didn't move to their property until 10 years ago, but my Dad has owned or hunted that property for 50 years. Locals complain about out of staters buying up their land, but that property was vacant with no activity for 30 years before my parents bought it. At what point are they considered locals?

Sure, their career earned income taxes were collected in another state, but all of their retirement income is spent there. If and when I retire I will do the same that they did. In the meantime, nearly all of my expendable income is spent in Missouri.

Another factor is people who buy in others areas CHOOSE to invest there. People who are local in a lot of cases are there cause they have no other choice. I feel like people who invest in an area are generally more apt to be protective of it’s wellbeing

 

[SwampCat]

Local economies benefit greatly with sales dollars and taxes generated by non-residents.

No way a non resident pays more than me as a 12 month resident to the local economy - no way.

 

[BenA]

No way a non resident pays more than me as a 12 month resident to the local economy - no way.

But ask the sales tax collectors in Destin, Gatlinburg, Eureka Springs, Branson, etc, etc.

 

[BenA]

Deer hunting Meccas there...

Just an example of non-resident contribution to local economies. If we're talking about just deer hunting, I kept my farm from being subdivided into local residential lots.