Will 24D/round up kill seed?

[tbarile]

I planted red clover in the spring (brassica mix last fall) and just did a spray, throw, and mow of that same brassica mix into the clover. I sprayed this past Friday and mowed yesterday. After mowing I noticed a decent amount of red clover in areas that look like the spray never came in contact with. Is it ok to spray again or will that kill the seed? We had one light rain on Sunday if that makes a difference. Thanks

 

[H80Hunter]

Round up and 2,4-D are not the same. Roundup the answer is no. There is no residual and no effect on seed. Has to be uptaken through green. 2,4-D has a soil residual so depending on what/when you sprayed and what you planted after it would inhibit germination for some period of time.

 

[tbarile]

So is there any way to kill the clover without killing the seed?

I used a combo of glyphosate and 24D as there was both clover and grass.

 

[H80Hunter]

Roundup should kill anything. I'd just broadcast my brassica seed and spray roundup only on the clover. The 2,4-D will prevent germination of the brassica seedlings or possibly kill them due to the residual. I've never had anything I couldn't kill with roundup, but I know some have issues depending on weeds. Roundup and 2,4-D is fine for a burndown but you need to wait a couple weeks before seeding.

 

[Bassattackr]

As H80H mentioned, round up is a nonselective herbicide, no residual. If you've already seeded, I'd be hesitant to spray again, especially since you've had a rain. You probably have more germination than you realize and could nuke a good portion of the crop.

I wouldn't worry about some clover returning, makes some nice plot diversity the deer will appreciate

 

[j-bird]

round-up/gly won't kill your seed. BUT if any of the seed germinated with the rain you had....it will kill that as well. As long as the clover isn't choking out what you planted I would leave well enough alone. A little clover int he mix won't hurt anything.

 

[yoderjac]

You don't need to kill the clover. You just need to suppress it long enough for your brassica to germinate. I've posted this picture on many threads:

I sprayed established white clover with 1 qt/ac gly and then drilled radish into it. The gly top killed the clover. The radish germinated and then the clover filled back in from the root system. Medium red clover is a short lived perennial. I typically get about 2 years out of it.

So, you would have been better off just spraying gly without the 24D. 1 qt/ac will topkill clover as long as you have rain in the forecast. 2 qt/ac will top kill some and root kill some. 3 qt/ac will completely kill the clover if that is what you want.

The clover in your brassica is a good thing. It needs to be suppressed long enough for the brassica to germinate. I'd cultipack after seeding to ensure the breassica gets good seed/soil contact. The clover will fix N that the brassica uses and be another attractant in the field.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[tbarile]

Damn! Thanks for all the info

 

[tbarile]

Man, I don't know what to do. I'm worried that the clover is going to choke out the brassica before it can grow.

 

[yoderjac]

Man, I don't know what to do. I'm worried that the clover is going to choke out the brassica before it can grow.

First, I wouldn't worry too much. Both are good deer foods. Second, it takes more time to see the full effects of gly. I think you are concerned about the wrong thing. I'd be happy if the clover did not get hit and is growing. Why? Because it seems likely to me that the ground residual effect of the 24D may kill the brassica anyway. At least with the clover, you'll have something.

What kind of 24D did you use? Amine or Ester? It is not labeled for brassica so I don't know what impact the residual effect will have on it specifically. It is labeled for soybeans and there is a difference between how long you are supposed to wait before planting beans between Ester and Amine. I would look at the label and see what the waiting period is for soybeans.

Let's say for argument sake the waiting period was 3 weeks. If you really want brassica in the field rather than clover, I'd simply wait about 3 weeks or so. You will have a good feel by then what your germination rate is and how much clover survived. If you are not happy with what you see, there are a couple options. You could just overseed with more brassica to supplement what you see growing, but don't over do it. If you see little to no brassica germinating by then, you can simply spray again if you want (GLY ONLY), broadcast your brassica at normal rates and cultipack.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[tbarile]

It's a 4 acre field and I left the other 2 acres in white clover so I'm not concerned with having more clover in the field.

The 24D is ester. The label has fallen off but I will look that up.

 

[yoderjac]

It's a 4 acre field and I left the other 2 acres in white clover so I'm not concerned with having more clover in the field.

The 24D is ester. The label has fallen off but I will look that up.

If I recall correctly, the delay before planting time is shorter for Ester than Amine.

 

[tbarile]

It looks like at the rate I used, I would only need to wait 7 days for planting soy beans

 

[yoderjac]

Then I'd just wait a few weeks depending on rain to see what you get and do what I said above.