Poor Soil Frost Seeding options... more than clover?

[CheeseCurd]

Have a .25 acre plot that got expanded to probably 1.5 acres this winter when loggers came in to take care of tornado damage. Had them bring the dozer in and clear away a bunch of poplars leaving what i am assuming is mostly cleared away dirt. No soil amendments have been made yet and its probably pretty rough (rusk county wi crap soil). Typically this property is pretty wet in the spring/early summer so much so that spring planting is not an option. Therefore I want to frost seed some clover (and possibly something else?) on this just to get something in the ground other than weeds and new poplar growth. Depending how it goes, might be tilling under and planting other stuff late summer/early fall.

My question is: What strains of clover to frost seed? Looking for something hearty that will grow in such crappy conditions. I have jumbo ladino, alice white, kopu II, and medium red in other blends on this property and other properties and its done well, just dont know if those are good options for this situation. Ive heard some good things on alsike? Also, are there any other seeds that work well to frost seed like this? Wheat or rye need to get deeper, right?

thanks in advance!

 

[yoderjac]

Most perennial clover will frost seed well but it will not do well with poor pH. I would not waste money on it if you're much below 6.0. It doesn't technical frost seed, but you can surface broadcast winter rye on bare soil before a rain and it will germinate pretty well. It tolerates poor pH and infertility. If you have bare soil and a cultipacker or lawn roller you can probably spray after spring green up with gly and then surface broadcast buckwheat and pack it. It too tolerates poor pH and infertility. It wants to see warm soil so you will want to wait until you soil temps hits at least 65 for buckwheat. The optimal for buckwheat germination is 80 degrees soil temp.

Wheat does not surface broadcast as well as Winter Rye and will not tolerate as poor of soils as Winter Rye.

I would soil test and lime this spring and then plant buckwheat. By fall your pH will be better. You can then throw and mow clover into the buckwheat.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[bbcoach]

I think you have answered your own question. You haven't checked the PH in your soil or added any amendments and it stays wet in the spring and summer, so why plant something that probably won't grow. Clover is best planted in the fall. If you plant it in the fall, it has a chance to develop a good root system, doesn't have to fight grass and weeds while getting established and will explode come next spring. My suggestion is take a soil sample and add any lime recommended NOW (it will take the lime about 6 months to do it's magic). When the weeds and grasses start in May, give them a good dose of glyphosate. If you are in Wisconsin, CheeseCurd, plant your clover with a cover crop of Winter rye or Winter wheat around the 1st of August and you should have a Great clover plot next spring. Good Luck.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I also have land in rusk county wi, so I have dealt with soil issues there. I agree with the others here- start with a soil test and add the recommended lime, p and k. i would hold off on the clover right away and get the soil where it needs to be. If you wanted to plant something early you could lightly disk or drag in oats for a cover crop when you spread the lime and fertilizer. Then you could go back and spray the plot in summer to prepare for a late summer seeding. Your options are somewhat limited until the ph gets corrected, but a mix of buckwheat, oats, winter rye and winter wheat would likely grow the first year. Where is your property located? Mine is a few miles northwest of Ladysmith.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

And to clarify, none of the seeds I recommended will work with frost seeding. Once the soil improves you will have more frost seeding options though.

 

[CheeseCurd]

Thanks guys. I guess my thought was if i could get some seed on the ground started instead of letting the grasses and weeds that grow so thick on our place take over, i would be ahead of the game come july and august. This chunk is around 800 acres between jump river and Ladysmith.

 

[yoderjac]

Thanks guys. I guess my thought was if i could get some seed on the ground started instead of letting the grasses and weeds that grow so thick on our place take over, i would be ahead of the game come july and august. This chunk is around 800 acres between jump river and Ladysmith.

You can. We are just suggesting that you choose a crop that is pH and infertility tolerant while your amendments are working.

 

[CheeseCurd]

Just not through frost seeding? Guess will have to bite the bullet and take time away from musky fishing and hope it stays dry enough to plant buckwheat in june.

 

[yoderjac]

Just not through frost seeding? Guess will have to bite the bullet and take time away from musky fishing and hope it stays dry enough to plant buckwheat in june.

Not technically through frost seeding but it doesn't really matter. You could surface broadcast winter rye without tillage. While it is not technically frost seeding winter rye does well when simply surface broadcast on bare soil especially before a rain. If the equipment has made it pretty much bare dirt, simply wait for things to green up a little and surface broadcast 100 lbs/ac of Winter Rye. That will get something in the ground quickly. If weeds have gotten a head start, you can spray with gly when you broadcast the WR.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[broom_JM]

I'd throw down some Alsike...it does well enough on low pH, wet ground. Bigger concern is aal the poplar that will come up.

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[MojoRisin]

I'd throw down some Alsike...it does well enough on low pH, wet ground. Bigger concern is aal the poplar that will come up.

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I too have had good luck with Alsike on low ph wet soils. I have not frost seeded it though.