Do your B-118 trees lean badly?

[nickh]

I know that a lot of you have apple trees on B-118 rootstock. I have about 100 here. My trees are around 5-7 years old.

B-118 is a large tree and is not supposed to require staking, so none of them were staked. However, over the past couple of years, the trees have been leaning worse and worse. What seems to be happening is that we get a large amount of rain and the soil gets saturated, and then the wind blows against them and they lean further and further. We have clay loam soil here, pretty heavy, and it can get very wet at times.

Some of the trees that just started leaning more seriously this year are 12' tall.

I've observed some other B-118 trees that were planted at the same time, at different locations nearby, but all with similar soil, also leaning badly this year.

The trees aren't old enough that I would be opposed to replacing them. But I'm trying to figure out if this is a problem with B-118 itself, perhaps on certain types of soils, or if this is unique to my area or how they were planted?

If few other people have this problem then I'm not sure what to think about the cause, but I'm curious if other people have had their B-118 trees lean like mine.

Unfortunately I have no apples on any other rootstock so I can't compare to know if other rootstocks wouldn't do the same thing in my soil.

Thanks!

 

[Catscratch]

ALL of my trees lean to the north. Most lone natives lean to the north. I've always attributed it to the slight Kansas south breeze during the growing season.

 

[chummer]

All of my B.118 are straight.

 

[Natureboy]

I have the same issue with a lot of my trees on B-118 rootstock. I would guess that at least 25% of them are leaners. They were all staked with 1/2" steel conduit at the time of planting, however that is more to get it to grow straight than to support the tree. I also have a few trees on M-7 and almost all of them are also leaning to some degree. Thankfully, most of my trees are on M-111 rootstock and all of those are well anchored with none leaning. My biggest issue with the M-111 trees is root suckers, I have to be careful to cut them all prior to spraying Roundup around the bases for weed control.

 

[Apple Junkie]

I have B.118 trees in the ground, but for only for 2 years. The older trees are on a standard or M.111 rootstocks and I don't see any leaning issues on any of them. My next location will be more like yours as far as soil type, with some wind exposure. I am glad you raised this issue, it bears watching.

 

[Native Hunter]

Well that sucks.........…. I saw my first leaning issue with a B118 tree this year. I gave my FIL a heirloom variety on B118 a couple of years ago. It grew extremely fast and put on a lot above ground very quickly. I noticed this spring that the tree seemed "wobbly." A wind storm later on this spring made it lean badly. He currently has a rope on it to straighten it up.

Up until a couple of years ago, I had never used anything but MM111. I now have several B118 trees. I started using them because of how so many people on the forums recommend them and never gave any bad reviews. I guess I didn't listen enough years...........

 

[4wanderingeyes]

Mine are all doing decent. Do you guys water a lot when they are young? I am just wondering how the root structure is, compared with mine. I typically water the hot months the first year I plant them, then after that they are on their own. The roots need to dig out, and down to find the water, and I think that is what strengthens the tree later in its life, and makes it more tolerant to dry periods. But I have no proof, just a little experience.

 

[Native Hunter]

Mine are all doing decent. Do you guys water a lot when they are young? I am just wondering how the root structure is, compared with mine. I typically water the hot months the first year I plant them, then after that they are on their own. The roots need to dig out, and down to find the water, and I think that is what strengthens the tree later in its life, and makes it more tolerant to dry periods. But I have no proof, just a little experience.

I only water the first year if it gets really dry. I never water after that.

 

[homerj]

Are any of the leaning trees not in 100% full sun? If so, they may simply be leaning towards wherever most of the light is coming from.

 

[Native Hunter]

Are any of the leaning trees not in 100% full sun? If so, they may simply be leaning towards wherever most of the light is coming from.

Not mine. And the one I mentioned leaned in the direction the prevailing wind was blowing it.

 

[ToddG]

I have a couple on M111 leaning. All of my trees on B118 are straight.

 

[rocksnstumps]

ALL of my trees lean to the north. Most lone natives lean to the north. I've always attributed it to the slight Kansas south breeze during the growing season.

Did a job in Wichita during the spring a few years back. Yeah you do get some "slight" breezes there. Blew so hard all day they couldn't land any planes and they diverted flights to Kansas City. Course I got stuck because no plane to board later after all the ones that started the morning in Wichita took off on the runway directly into the wind I would guess.

 

[PoorSand]

I'd be inclined dig up some shovel fulls of dirt and see if there is a June bug larva infestation in the soil. The grubs are white. Tree roots are one of the things they feed on. It is possible that your trees have had difficulty growing lateral roots over the years.

 

[rocksnstumps]

To the OP, this year has not been kind to northern WI for wind storms. Talked to a logger a couple of weeks ago and downed timber around the Mountain area is close to 300,000 acres to be salvaged. At the Tree Farm Field Day event last weekend they mentioned downed and damaged timber state wide this year is close to 750,000 acres. Personally I'm still cutting up busted trees and ripped up by the roots trees from two storms over the last month.

 

[Catscratch]

ALL of my trees lean to the north. Most lone natives lean to the north. I've always attributed it to the slight Kansas south breeze during the growing season.

Did a job in Wichita during the spring a few years back. Yeah you do get some "slight" breezes there. Blew so hard all day they couldn't land any planes and they diverted flights to Kansas City. Course I got stuck because no plane to board later after all the ones that started the morning in Wichita took off on the runway directly into the wind I would guess.

At least you were stuck in the awesome town of Wichita! I'm only an hour from there.
I just got home from picking up some equipment. Drove all the way home riding the leading edge of a storm. The wind in it made even a KS life'r take notice. I snapped a pic of the johnson grass in the ditch laying completely on its side. Constant debris flying sideways the whole way home.

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[Catscratch]

I'd be inclined dig up some shovel fulls of dirt and see if there is a June bug larva infestation in the soil. The grubs are white. Tree roots are one of the things they feed on. It is possible that your trees have had difficulty growing lateral roots over the years.

Do tell more... I have junebugs by the bucket full. Is there a granule treatment for the larvae? Are there other tell-tale signs in the leafs or anything?

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[Bowsnbucks]

We have trees on B-118, MM-111, and Antonovka rootstocks. Our soil is clayish loam. We have a few B-118's leaning, and I've used rope / stakes to pull one up from leaning so far. Our oldest "newer" trees are 6 years old. No problems with MM-111 or Antonovka here at all. Any new added trees will be on Antonovka or P-18 for longer-lived trees. If any of our current trees crap out on us or bears destroy them, the replacements will be on those 2 rootstocks.

When I sent e-mails back in 2013 to the 2 head profs at Penn State's horticultural dept., they recommended MM-111 for our clayish loam soil at camp. They said they are proven to do well in heavier soils, & are very well anchored. FWIW.

 

[PoorSand]

Catscratch: On my coarse sand soil, the assessment I was given by a neighbor who is a forestry professor is that I have a June Bug larva infestation. We have quite a hatch of them every spring. I see the white grubs when I dig up soil at this time of year. I understand that there are products that can be spread to kill them, but the professor told me that on our very low organic matter content soil, if I just kill the quack grass in the fall and keep it controlled from then on, that will get most of the job done. That's what works by me.

 

[PoorSand]

Catscratch: More info on the June Bug larva... In preparation for fall planting apple trees to fill in for dead or disappointing ones this week, I grabbed hold of some apple tree whips that were still only 1' - 3' tall after over 15 years and pulled them out. June Bug larva came up with some of their root systems.

 

[Lois E Brenneman FNP]

I have both purchased trees on B-118 as well as grafted any number of my own trees on B-118. I've not had issues with trees leaning. Leaning could be secondary to heavy winds, snow drifts, sun issues, etc. Some staking when you notice the leaning might be helpful until the tree can hold its own. One thing I really like about B-118 is that the leaves are reddish so there is never any question of graft vs rootstock if there is some breakage. BTW B-118 readily fruits and deer will eat the fruit so they make a good tree for mast. You can eat them also but they are tart. They are not bitter.