Wild Turkey population is tanking across most of its range
- Thread starter Howboutthemdawgs
- Start date
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
Three more than I’ve gotten this week!Huge increase in turkey numbers on my farm.Not what some people have shown, but I'll take it.
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T-Max
5 year old buck +
I was running a chainsaw this morning along the edge of my cornfield and saw a ton strut out of the woods onto a knob. Kept running the saw and a few minutes later looked to see several dozen turkeys coming out. I went to my truck and sat in the seat and glassed them for a while. Ended up with 14 toms, 5 jakes, and more than 30 hens. I haven’t seen that many on our place dating back to when turkey numbers were booming!
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Catscratch
5 year old buck +
I had a kid ask yesterday if he could hunt. I think youth season starts next week, maybe?
T-Max
5 year old buck +
Well, he just told my stepmom it starts tomorrow…
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Mortenson
5 year old buck +
Trying to figure out a 2nd 20 gauge turkey gun to use, so two sons can hunt at the same time. Would you guys be ok using 2.75" federal tss 9 pushing only 1 1/8 oz load from an old single shot model 37 Winchester? Barrel is stamped - choke which most likely means a full choke I think. In keeping with the spirit of the thread, shots would be kept to a max of 25 yards.
At 25 yards, I wouldnt be worried about 2 3/4” lead 6’s
Catscratch
5 year old buck +
I never worry about shells. Have shot turkeys with dove loads (head shot with lots of pellets), and steel duck loads. I'm not much on pushing limits for distance, but I'd say at 25yds anything would work. Just throw a pattern on something real quick to make sure you know what's going out there and you'll be fine.
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
In todays turkey sign of the apocalypse…
A friend sent me a video of his four year old killing his first turkey. That’s right 4. Sitting in a giant mega blind with 4 people, .410 with tss in a lead sled deal. A four year old has no business shooting anything.
So just in one snapshot here’s all the things the turkey faced in one video that it wouldn’t in say 2010
Legal .410
Tss
Youth season (show me one study where youth season has improved hunter retention)
Mega blinds
Light weight lead sled deals
Cell cam showing birds using the plot
There was a strutter decoy of course (still illegal in a couple states thankfully)
4 year old being able to kill a bird
For anyone who’s optimistic about the future of the species I’m amazed given its battles that just we can control let alone the mountains it faces without our doing.
A friend sent me a video of his four year old killing his first turkey. That’s right 4. Sitting in a giant mega blind with 4 people, .410 with tss in a lead sled deal. A four year old has no business shooting anything.
So just in one snapshot here’s all the things the turkey faced in one video that it wouldn’t in say 2010
Legal .410
Tss
Youth season (show me one study where youth season has improved hunter retention)
Mega blinds
Light weight lead sled deals
Cell cam showing birds using the plot
There was a strutter decoy of course (still illegal in a couple states thankfully)
4 year old being able to kill a bird
For anyone who’s optimistic about the future of the species I’m amazed given its battles that just we can control let alone the mountains it faces without our doing.
The success of our turkey population is somewhat of a perplexing situation to me. I am pretty much willing to do anything - down to close season for a year of two if need be - to grow the population. But, turkeys are not like deer. I can grow deer on my place. The turkeys dont respond positively to any of my habitat improvements - maybe slightly to predator removal during the nesting season. There havent been any research that I have seen that any realistic habitat manipulation on a small scale - 350 acres like I have - will likely result in improved turkey numbers.
Last year, we had horrible spring nesting weather and a severe summer drought, and low gobbler to hen numbers - all considered negative to increase population. Yet we had the best reproduction in the 20 years I have owned my place. I have four cameras out right now - different turkeys on all four cameras on the same day. Never seen that before - with all the flooding now - they may all be gone by the time season opens in two weeks.
I dont know if reasonable harvest of gobblers even matters. I am not saying we could kill them all - but I dont know that a reasonable season length and limit makes a difference.
USFWS has had a greatly reduced pintail limit for a long time. Generally a limit of one and sometimes only half the season - and the population has not positively responded. They are going to a three year, three pintail trial just to see if it makes a difference. Maybe regulated pintail harvest is irrelevant. Maybe gobbler hunting is largely irrelevant.
As far as youth season goes - that never enters my mind. There were no youth seasons when my kids were growing up and I still took them all the time. I take my grandkids every chance I get during regular season
many weeks ago, the hens were bunched and the gobblers started breading them
The hens, after breeding, head out to lay - and the hen groups start to break up
Wouldnt doubt some hens are starting to set, now - and the gobs have to go on walkabout to find some action
later in the spring - receptive hens get hard to find so the gobs have to take what they can get - even strutting for the crows
oftentimes, a hen will have a nest destroyed and no other hens around so they may seek out other birds for companionship. The gobblers are wore out by now - this is how turkey buzzards came to be
with our season opening so late in the year, the gobblers will be done and the trannies will take over
Dont hesitate to ask for more information on the breeding hierarchy of the wild turkey. To he11 with Dr Chamberlain
Catscratch
5 year old buck +
Lol!
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
I don’t have an opinion on the season date issue. Part of me thinks it’s good because it allows hens to get bred. Other part of me has seen some research from Harper that said it didn’t matter on their test grounds. But here’s a chart showing population increase in Louisiana starting year 2 after delaying the season. May be coincidence but can’t rule out the timing.
many weeks ago, the hens were bunched and the gobblers started breading them
The hens, after breeding, head out to lay - and the hen groups start to break up
Wouldnt doubt some hens are starting to set, now - and the gobs have to go on walkabout to find some action
later in the spring - receptive hens get hard to find so the gobs have to take what they can get - even strutting for the crows
oftentimes, a hen will have a nest destroyed and no other hens around so they may seek out other birds for companionship. The gobblers are wore out by now - this is how turkey buzzards came to be
with our season opening so late in the year, the gobblers will be done and the trannies will take over
Dont hesitate to ask for more information on the breeding hierarchy of the wild turkey. To he11 with Dr Chamberlain
Arkansas is the poster child for moving to a late season. We started in 2010 and our own g&f admitted that the spike in 2012 was due to favorable weather. The years following, poult production was dismal - the worst of all times that the survey has been done. I think the last couple years are similar to many states across the south - poult production is up regardless of any management practices in place. I think Harper’s findings are pretty solid - comparing counties with late season opening and those with earlier opening at the same time. If the late season timing did improve poult production, it should be something that is evident the first year. Personally, if I have to pick between Harper and Chamberlain - it is going to be Harper everytime - I dont care if Chamberlain is UGA
Howboutthemdawgs
5 year old buck +
For sure on Harper. but there’s so many variables it’s hard to isolate just one and draw a definitive conclusion. I applaud states for at least trying something even if it were unpopular.Arkansas is the poster child for moving to a late season. We started in 2010 and our own g&f admitted that the spike in 2012 was due to favorable weather. The years following, poult production was dismal - the worst of all times that the survey has been done. I think the last couple years are similar to many states across the south - poult production is up regardless of any management practices in place. I think Harper’s findings are pretty solid - comparing counties with late season opening and those with earlier opening at the same time. If the late season timing did improve poult production, it should be something that is evident the first year. Personally, if I have to pick between Harper and Chamberlain - it is going to be Harper everytime - I dont care if Chamberlain is UGA
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Mortenson
5 year old buck +
Go easy on us Dawgs, but kid #2 and I just finished up the 4 day youth season. Typical March and early April action for around here. Meaning almost no action. Had 5 hens check out the decoys today. Heard only 1 gobbler in the 4 days. He became more of a turkey hunter in these 4 days of tag soup than had he scored on day 1. Hope Illinois uses the money wisely.
That is the point where we were in AR. Most hunters were willing to give almost anything a shot. The late season opener is something that is really easy to tell if it works. Like in TN - you could have two or three counties with late season openers and easily compare poult production between those counties and the rest of the state. Poult production is something that should show fairly quickly with a change in regulation or habitat manipulaion
Theoretically, you could have looked at the data from AR six or seven years in and seen the worst poult production ever - for several consecutive years. How do we know that the late season opener did not contribute to that? The very best poult production in AR was in the 80’s when the season opened three weeks earlier than now
The thing that bothers me about our state going to the late season opener - it has proven it did not help - but we stayed with it. I am sure Chamberlain will lay claim to his theory improving the poult production all across the south - probably ignoring the dismal AR production. The data that I have looked at indicates a number of states are now having recent fair to good poult production - including AR
I saw it at my place - a huge increase last year. That ten inches of rain we got in the last couple days probably will not help this year - although they seem to be mostly laying now and not setting. Maybe they will be OK. I have seen more turkeys on my place this year than I have in the last five years combined - another good year of poult production, and we would be back to the glory days