Which hunter will do better?

[bwoods11]

In relation to the Steve Bartylla thread....which hunter will do better in your opinion?

A) The guy that spends a lot of time scouting, is very careful not to "over-hunt" the property, has stands for the right winds, waits until the conditions are right. Stays out of the core bedding areas. Hits the rut pretty hard but is always watching his entry and exit. Has trail cams to assess the population and movement.

B) The guy that rarely scouts, has maybe two stands. One camera and sometimes no camera. Takes off 9 days during the gun season (In Minnesota which is also during the rut) and sits from sunup to sundown. Regardless of wind, and conditions.

My answer is B...this is what has happened to me and I own the property with the other guy. He has a 150+ and a 175 incher to his credit in recent years. I have not shot a 140 or bigger on this farm ever. Also keep in mind I am primarily archery.

 

[yoderjac]

C) The guy who happens to be at the right place at the right time.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Too many factors at play to say. It is somewhat complicated by the fact you both hunt the same property. Most of the "pros" would probably say approach A is much more effective.

One thing i'm starting to believe is that lots of scouting and trail camera use can be detrimental to success but a big part of that is how they are used. Even if no human goes to a trailcam for months to pull cards i still think some deer avoid locations where they see obvious trailcams. Glassing bean fields from a half mile away is different than scouting sign on foot. In your case it sounds like your buddy is more likely to catch a roaming buck in the rut that may be out of or on the fringe of his home range and isn't as locked into your property/human intrusion/scent. If that is the manner you're most likely to score on good bucks on your property it makes sense that it has worked for him.

 

[SD51555]

In relation to the Steve Bartylla thread....which hunter will do better in your opinion?

A) The guy that spends a lot of time scouting, is very careful not to "over-hunt" the property, has stands for the right winds, waits until the conditions are right. Stays out of the core bedding areas. Hits the rut pretty hard but is always watching his entry and exit. Has trail cams to assess the population and movement.

B) The guy that rarely scouts, has maybe two stands. One camera and sometimes no camera. Takes off 9 days during the gun season (In Minnesota which is also during the rut) and sits from sunup to sundown. Regardless of wind, and conditions.

My answer is B...this is what has happened to me and I own the property with the other guy. He has a 150+ and a 175 incher to his credit in recent years. I have not shot a 140 or bigger on this farm ever. Also keep in mind I am primarily archery.

Always B.

It's the Snoopy pole principle. A guy can hunt or fish hard his whole life and never hook a wall mounter. Put a 7 year old on the dock with a Snoopy pole, and you'll have a monster laying there before you can go back and grab your coffee.

 

[SD51555]

One thing i'm starting to believe is that lots of scouting and trail camera use can be detrimental to success but...

That could be a whole nother thread.

 

[yoderjac]

Too many factors at play to say. It is somewhat complicated by the fact you both hunt the same property. Most of the "pros" would probably say approach A is much more effective.

One thing i'm starting to believe is that lots of scouting and trail camera use can be detrimental to success but a big part of that is how they are used. Even if no human goes to a trailcam for months to pull cards i still think some deer avoid locations where they see obvious trailcams. Glassing bean fields from a half mile away is different than scouting sign on foot. In your case it sounds like your buddy is more likely to catch a roaming buck in the rut that may be out of or on the fringe of his home range and isn't as locked into your property/human intrusion/scent. If that is the manner you're most likely to score on good bucks on your property it makes sense that it has worked for him.

I completely agree on the scouting and trail cam use. First, "scouting" is not something you really do on purpose on your own land that you manage. You get to know the land and deer intimately. As for trail cams, the biggest issue by far is human intrusion or poorly designed cameras that deer avoid. My camera network runs 24/7/365 with no sound or visible flash. Maintenance trips are less than once a year on average. I don't use is for hunting intel. It doesn't really provide me much I don't already know. I uses mine for trending analysis to make QDM decisions.

I sometimes think "nothing" is the best approach for shooting a nice buck. Kind of like the snoopy principle mentioned, the more important it is to you to kill them, the more you try to do. The more we do, the more often we do things that work against us. My experience has been that I see nice bucks when I least expect it. When I just sit back, relax, and enjoy nature is when I seem to see the most mature bucks. When I'm more focused on shooting a nice buck, I seem to see far fewer.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[TWIG]

My uncle is a prime example B. Doesn't scout. Doesn't own trail cameras. Only hunts a few days during archery. Almost always kills the biggest bucks on the family farm during gun season.

 

[bwoods11]

My uncle is a prime example B. Doesn't scout. Doesn't own trail cameras. Only hunts a few days during archery. Almost always kills the biggest bucks on the family farm during gun season.

I can't tell you how many guys say that to me. Uncle, cousin, friend. Lets face it... we work our ass off and it sometimes falls in their lap!

 

[yoderjac]

I don't know whether it is learned or some innate ability that some guys have. I had a mentor when I was much younger who was one of the founders of a suburban bowhunting group with me. He was about a decade older than me at the time. One day he fell off a 6' ladder in his driveway and broke a him and needed a hip replacement. After the surgery he could no longer use a climbing stand and could only hunt from a ladder stand. Of course, he was in no condition to set a stand. I offered to help him set stands. It turned out to be a pivotal decision in my bowhunting career but I had no idea at the time. We agreed to buy a bunch of ladder stand together and I would do the grunt work of setup, he would pick the locations, and we would coordinate and share the stands.

That year, we went into the woods together with a stand and agree on a general location. I'd say, "There is a nice straight tree." He would look at it and look around. Then he would say "Nope...That tree over there. The deer will come from here and cross at about 20 yards and go that way. When have a nice shot when they get to this point. I thought to myself "Surrre...what a crock, but I'll humor him." That continued stand after stand.

What a lesson in humility I got that year. I would say that he was exactly right about 85% of the time about how the deer would relate to the area. He did his best to explain his stand site selection to me but some of it he could not articulate although he clearly wanted too. There were no obvious trails or sign. And he showed me what he saw, but I could not put the pieces together. I did learn a lot. He would squat down and look up to see the back cover from a deer's perspective, and things like that, but I could never figure out how he knew what the deer movement would be.

For whatever reason, I think some guys just have a knack for it, so there are probably 2 sides to that coin.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Gator]

I’d say it’s guy A that also sits daylight to dark during the rut as most scent doesn’t matter during that period especially for a rifle hunter set way back from where the deer tend to be. Scent is way more important when needing to be close.


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[Baker]

The one with the best deer herd and the most bucks irrespective of a) or b)
But that is a smart a** answer for which I apologize

 

[hillrunner]

In relation to the Steve Bartylla thread....which hunter will do better in your opinion?

A) The guy that spends a lot of time scouting, is very careful not to "over-hunt" the property, has stands for the right winds, waits until the conditions are right. Stays out of the core bedding areas. Hits the rut pretty hard but is always watching his entry and exit. Has trail cams to assess the population and movement.

B) The guy that rarely scouts, has maybe two stands. One camera and sometimes no camera. Takes off 9 days during the gun season (In Minnesota which is also during the rut) and sits from sunup to sundown. Regardless of wind, and conditions.

My answer is B...this is what has happened to me and I own the property with the other guy. He has a 150+ and a 175 incher to his credit in recent years. I have not shot a 140 or bigger on this farm ever. Also keep in mind I am primarily archery.

If you are both hunting the rut, I'm going to guess the guy with the rifle will outperform the bow guy most of the time despite greater effort by the archer.

 

[Bill]

Are you scouting your farm during hunting season?

 

[SwampCat]

B. My wife has proved it. She knows nothing about deer movement, doesnt play the wind, takes a book and spends seat time in the same stand every time she goes. I am like a person chasing the stock market - I pour over game cam pics, I have multiple stands, I play the wind, I try to out think them - and she has killed three times as many quality deer on our place during modern gun season as have I. I think the rut complicates things because the bucks are much more difficult to pattern. Bow hunting in Oct or Jan - I think they are much easier to pattern. During the rut, I spend most of my time hunting where they were. They dont know where they are going next.

 

[swat1018]

I think the first approach wins outside the rut.

During the rut, time in the woods matters most. Bucks let their guards down and have nothing but doe on their minds.

 

[rocksnstumps]

He would squat down and look up to see the back cover from a deer's perspective, and things like that, but I could never figure out how he knew what the deer movement would be.

For whatever reason, I think some guys just have a knack for it, so there are probably 2 sides to that coin.

Thanks,

Jack

Temple Grandin made a living in the livestock industry as an consultant on animal behavior and slaughterhouse design. A bit odd of an occupation but apparently she had a knack for looking from an animal perspective and talks about doing similar to your mentor and getting down to look from their perspective. She has autism and frankly her brain processes differently than most folks. Very much imagery vs. words and such. Her book is an interesting read, Animals in Translation

 

[bwoods11]

Are you scouting your farm during hunting season?

No. It’s just 40 acres. But a good 40. Surrounded by timber in a rolling hills agriculture and wooded area of Minnesota

My main scouting is cameras. I know the farm very well. Part of the issue, is I’m hunting elsewhere on my other farms and not over hunting this property.

He, on the other hand, hunts 10+ hours a day for let’s say realistically 4 days in a row…. That’s more hours than I put in! He does not bow hunt.

I’m not complaining. He had been rewarded for long all day hunts! Pic of farm below ..

 

[homerj1]

B.
Firearm hunting during the rut makes connecting on big bucks much easier.

 

[Tree Spud]

In relation to the Steve Bartylla thread....which hunter will do better in your opinion?

A) The guy that spends a lot of time scouting, is very careful not to "over-hunt" the property, has stands for the right winds, waits until the conditions are right. Stays out of the core bedding areas. Hits the rut pretty hard but is always watching his entry and exit. Has trail cams to assess the population and movement.

B) The guy that rarely scouts, has maybe two stands. One camera and sometimes no camera. Takes off 9 days during the gun season (In Minnesota which is also during the rut) and sits from sunup to sundown. Regardless of wind, and conditions.

My answer is B...this is what has happened to me and I own the property with the other guy. He has a 150+ and a 175 incher to his credit in recent years. I have not shot a 140 or bigger on this farm ever. Also keep in mind I am primarily archery.

This is equivalent to asking who will retire with more money ... the person who works hard, pays off their debts, and saves money or the person who spends $20-$30 every day on lotto tickets?

I'll take hunter A ... preparation plus luck = opportunity!

 

[SD51555]

Others being the one that get to pull the trigger doesn't bother me. My nephew hunted for the first time last season, and he got his first deer minutes into his first sit. Everything was perfect: The path in, the food plot, the shooting lane, the blind set up, and the actors. What seemed so smooth to him took years of design, work, failure, and retooling to pull together. That was very rewarding.
The ones that don't do any scouting, habitat work, or even show up outside of hunting season miss out on all the rest of the fun throughout the year. I get a lot of enjoyment out of keeping the polish on the whole system.