Watersprouts for grafting ??

[Bowsnbucks]

To any of you guys who've grafted long enough to get fruit off your self-grafted trees : will watersprouts used as scion produce fruiting trees ?? Or must you use wood from branch tips to get " fruiting wood " for grafting purposes ??

It seems to me I saw something about watersprouts not being able to produce a fruiting tree - only vegetative growth. Anyone have some bona fide info on this ?? ( planning for this spring's work !! )

 

[buckvelvet]

I've grafted watersprouts just fine however I don't know of any reports saying they have no fruitability (is that a word?). I want to say when I was first learning @Turkey Creek even told me that water sprouts albeit 1st year watersprout wood is just fine to use.

 

[Turkey Creek]

I have used water sprouts just fine.

 

[yoderjac]

When taking scions from a wild persimmon tree, water sprouts are some of the best. Often wild persimmons will have small diameter new wood scions. For some reason the upward growing water sprouts are very vigorous and much better diameter. I will sometime intentionally prune a good size lateral branch on a wild persimmon to encourage vertical water sprouts off that branch.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[CrazyEd]

I've used water sprouts, but i've also read things that say it's not preferred, if you have a choice.

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/selecting_and_storing_scion_wood_for_grafting

"While some grafters like to use watersprouts, Michigan State University Extension recommends avoiding excessively vegetative shoots. If it is the only healthy, straight wood available, discard the terminal ends where there are less carbohydrates stored and where buds lack maturity.

Avoid suckers that arise from the rootstock, below the union. One of the problems with using watersprouts is that the tissue often lacks in stored carbohydrates, which is important in the wound healing and callusing process."

http://www.seattletreefruitsociety.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/gregs-scionwood-storage1.pdf

"Select healthy looking material, growing at approximately 45-degree angles. Supposedly, scions from angled branches produce fruit buds sooner than shoots growing straight upward."

 

[buckvelvet]

CE lowers the boom!

 

[yoderjac]

CE lowers the boom!

I think Ed is referring to apples specifically.

 

[buckvelvet]

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[Bowsnbucks]

Thanks for the info, guys. Also thanks for the links, Matt. Read 'em all.

 

[CrazyEd]

I think Ed is referring to apples specifically.

When I said I have used watersprouts for grafting, yes referring to apples. The URLs I provided don't say anything specifically about apples.

 

[yoderjac]

When I said I have used watersprouts for grafting, yes referring to apples. The URLs I provided don't say anything specifically about apples.

I realize this was obvious to the regulars. I was clarifying for new and non-member readers. CrazyEd is a synonym for Apple! :D

 

[Turkey Creek]

On some very old neglected apple trees water spouts may be your only choice for scions as the annual growth at the ends of limbs maybe be too small.

That is my experience. I dont intentionally pick water sprouts over other scion wood, but I dont refuse to use water sprouts. I will tell you though from experience over the last couple of years, grafting old spurred up wood at the tips can be successful. Might cause you to pull a little hair out in the process, but it can work.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

I've found the same thing as you guys on old trees - first-year wood is very small dia.

I wondered if water sprouts would EVER fruit after being grafted. I think I read that somewhere - can't remember where - that's why I asked the ? in this thread. I pruned some trees last winter ( old ones ) to get water sprouts to grow for scion wood. If I remember the advice correctly, the article said to pick FRUITING wood over water sprouts so you are sure to get fruit. I have no expertise in this area at all. Wondering if pruning for water sprout growth was worth it if they won't / may not fruit. I've grafted some water sprouts to clonal rootstocks and they " took ", but are not old enough to fruit yet - if they even will.

 

[Neahawg]

I've found the same thing as you guys on old trees - first-year wood is very small dia.

I wondered if water sprouts would EVER fruit after being grafted. I think I read that somewhere - can't remember where - that's why I asked the ? in this thread. I pruned some trees last winter ( old ones ) to get water sprouts to grow for scion wood. If I remember the advice correctly, the article said to pick FRUITING wood over water sprouts so you are sure to get fruit. I have no expertise in this area at all. Wondering if pruning for water sprout growth was worth it if they won't / may not fruit. I've grafted some water sprouts to clonal rootstocks and they " took ", but are not old enough to fruit yet - if they even will.

As I understand it most of your true fruiting wood is 2-3 years old and as you want 1 year old wood to graft you don't really want true fruiting wood.

This is assuming they mean you actually want wood that could potentially produce fruit the next growing season vs wood that will eventually produce fruit.

 

[buckvelvet]

As I understand it most of your true fruiting wood is 2-3 years old and as you want 1 year old wood to graft you don't really want true fruiting wood.

This is assuming they mean you actually want wood that could potentially produce fruit the next growing season vs wood that will eventually produce fruit.

Yes you dont want your scion bud energy used up throwing a flower, been there done that, have had them die ir love but setback quite a bit when they flowered.


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