Soil amendments for throw and mow method

[westonwhitetail]

What do people do for amending their soil for the throw and now method. Mainly I was wondering about the initial lime application. I usually like to disc it in some but if I was gonna do the throw and mow, could I just broadcast the pelletized lime before or after I seed and then mow over the top of it all?

It is a smaller plot so I used bagged lime and fertilizer. I have winter wheat standing from last fall that I planted in the plot currently. Thanks


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[Semisane]

You can throw that pelletized lime at any time - before, after or during the planting process. Sooner is better. As I do every summer, I'll be throwing a few bags of lime into the standing vegetation on each of my three small plots this weekend. They are 1/4 acre, 1/3 acre and 0.4 acre. It saves a step when I'm planting in September.

 

[Big Snow Man]

Get some pelleted lime on as soon as you can

 

[hilltopper]

What about other minerals like manganese sulfate, copper sulphate, zinc sulfate, and borax- do they need to be incorporated with tillage or can they simply be applied to the surface?

 

[yoderjac]

If throw and grow is part of a long-term nutrient cycling strategy, just surface broadcast it. Working lime into the soil simply speeds the process of it moving through the soil naturally and gets it to root depth faster. In sandy soils, lime often moves too fast through the soil and surface broadcasting is a positive. In heavy clay it moves slowly, but a long-term strategy to build OM and improve nutrient cycling requires patience. Keep in mind that tillage works against you in this. Everything can be surface broadcast. Also keep in mind that with this kind of strategy, you need far fewer amendments. Incorporating amendments is never required. It simply gives you quicker short term results at a longer-term cost.

In general, if you have sandy soils, keep up with your amendments. If you have clay, you can be lazier but need more patience.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[hilltopper]

So, it's early June, and it's finally starting to dry out- which doesn't take long in these sandy soils. I have a very sandy 1 acre plot with current pH of 5.8 that I put 2 tons of lime on last July. Soil tests also indicate mineral deficiencies- thats why I asked about tillage in post above. I did a clover/rye/oats throw and mow in late August but germination and/or later survival of clover was almost nil, perhaps due to insufficient thatch, dry period after germination, or other factors. Even the rye did relatively poorly. Right now the rye is so thin that I feel I don't have enough thatch for an effective throw and mow now or in a month or two. I'm afraid that sand burs will soon burst forth on the sparsely vegetated surface. What and how could I plant right now to get enough thatch for another shot at a clover/rye mix in the fall? Should I scuff it with the tiller, apply mineral amendments, plant rye or oats, and mow what's there (all before a rain)? I am trying not to till my dry sand anymore. Don't suggest Buckwheat- deer numbers are too high for a one acre patch. They mowed it down when it was 6" the last time I tried that.

 

[Big Snow Man]

Wow I'm on sand not to far from you and I plant buckwheat on the heavy side. Yes it gets hit but it helps. I have also heard sorghum sudan grass is a good soil builder and the deer leave it alone.

 

[hilltopper]

I'm looking at sorghum sudangrass and think it might be a good choice. I know it's not real palatable, but my deer eat anything. Any chance deer could have trouble from Prussic acid poisoning? Probably far-fetched, but my deer eat almost everything. How deep does the seed need to be? Maybe I could find someone to drill it since I don't have much growth to create thatch for a throw and mow...

 

[Plottin'booners]

Are you spoon feeding nitrogen at all?

 

[hilltopper]

My last nitrogen was late september (100 lbs/acre) but none this spring. The stand was so thin, and rye usually thrives here without spring nitrogen.

 

[westonwhitetail]

You can throw that pelletized lime at any time - before, after or during the planting process. Sooner is better. As I do every summer, I'll be throwing a few bags of lime into the standing vegetation on each of my three small plots this weekend. They are 1/4 acre, 1/3 acre and 0.4 acre. It saves a step when I'm planting in September.

Thanks I'll go that route. I was just worried about wasting it running off


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[yoderjac]

Thanks I'll go that route. I was just worried about wasting it running off


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That generally is not an issue on relatively flat fields. However, if you have a slope, runoff can be an issue. You might want to consider applying your maintenance lime, fertilizer, and seed simultaneously and using a cultipacker going across the slope if that is an issue for you.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[westonwhitetail]

That generally is not an issue on relatively flat fields. However, if you have a slope, runoff can be an issue. You might want to consider applying your maintenance lime, fertilizer, and seed simultaneously and using a cultipacker going across the slope if that is an issue for you.

Thanks,

Jack

Thanks, one of my plots is quite steep, that's part of the reason I was worried about not tilling it in there. Hopefully the vegetation will help hold it in place


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[Semisane]

Every time you till that steep slope you chance losing topsoil.

 

[yoderjac]

Thanks, one of my plots is quite steep, that's part of the reason I was worried about not tilling it in there. Hopefully the vegetation will help hold it in place


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First, I consider establishing permaculture rather than a traditional food plot in steep areas. If possible use your most level ground for plots. I'd avoid tillage, focus on throw and grow, and use a cultipacker to try to press in amendments and seed the best you can. I'd do my best to establish perennial clover. Avoid using N. Learn to tolerate weeds. Steep plots are always a challenge. I'd then consider establishing some kind of fruit or nut trees in the clover. Eventually you can convert it into a "wildlife opening". I'm doing that for other reasons even on level ground as part of my program.

The idea is to establish a long-term low maintenance food source. I start with a clover field and then plant low long-term maintenance fruit and nut trees. I use Durana in my area which is quite persistent. I can get 10 years out of it. By the time the Durana ceases to become a factor, the trees will be in production and take over. A field of weeds that is simply bushogged every year or two with fruit and nut trees can produce quite a bit of deer food.

Thanks,

Jack