Rediscovered Heritage Apples

[Native Hunter]

I thought this was a good article about a group that is finding apple varieties in the Northwest that were believed to be extinct. It's a good read for anyone into heritage apples:

https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/r...inct/277-3bfa348a-d698-44c0-9d8f-1a021c69af85

 

[Merle Hawggard]

I've actually talked with David. Chuck saw where he had found Arkansas Beauty and contacted him for me.
Last year he sent us Shackleford, an old Missouri apple from the Ozarks.
Nice article!

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[Native Hunter]

I've actually talked with David. Chuck saw where he had found Arkansas Beauty and contacted him for me.
Last year he sent us Shackleford, an old Missouri apple from the Ozarks.
Nice article!

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I thought of you on the Arkansas Beauty and was getting ready to send you a PM about it. Good deal that you already knew.

 

[PoorSand]

There's a somewhat parallel effort in Central Wisconsin . https://heirloomapplequest.blogspot.com/

During the first couple generations of homesteading here in the 1800s, we became a famous apple growing area, but by the time of the Great Depression much of the soil was depleted. During the good years, this area gave birth to the Wolf River and Northwest(ern) Greening.

 

[Chainsaw]

Interesting read Native. A neighbor told me about a guy who came with a crew to his NY property and took a ton of scions from a huge apple tree he had. The guy claimed it was a tree from very, very long ago. Might have been along the same idea of saving heritage trees.

Saw another interesting article today about original apple trees. It was reprinted in a Dave’s Garden newsletter. You may have seen it before. I hadn't though.
https://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/view/3125

 

[rocksnstumps]

There's a somewhat parallel effort in Central Wisconsin . https://heirloomapplequest.blogspot.com/

During the first couple generations of homesteading here in the 1800s, we became a famous apple growing area, but by the time of the Great Depression much of the soil was depleted. During the good years, this area gave birth to the Wolf River and Northwest(ern) Greening.

Yah maybe in another few generations everyone will be talking about planting a Ratsburg....

My Aunt and Uncle still live just south of Fremont next door to the farm they owned for many years, just off the Wolf River. They claim the Wolf River (the apple that is) was from a nearby farm that actually is just over in Winnebago county not Waupaca but a couple sources say different things where it came from. The county line is pretty close by in either case. The person who introduced the Wolf River apple to the world was W. Springer but actually from the Jacob Steigler farm close by as reported in

Transactions of the Wisconsin State Horticultural Society, Volume 10
By Wisconsin State Horticultural Society (published for years 1879-80)
from page 303

Another article from small local paper that is similar to above but mentions that the Ratsburg original tree is estimated at 170 years old...yowser
https://waupacanow.com/2016/09/07/mission-to-save-apple-trees/

 

[greyphase]

David is sending me scion of Ewalt a tree that was originally found in the early 1800's just a few miles from my home in Bedford Co Pa. Also Kittageskee a Cherokee apple and Shackleford a variety he spoke highly of. Exciting times for us heirloom apple addicts.

 

[Native Hunter]

Interesting read Native. A neighbor told me about a guy who came with a crew to his NY property and took a ton of scions from a huge apple tree he had. The guy claimed it was a tree from very, very long ago. Might have been along the same idea of saving heritage trees.

Saw another interesting article today about original apple trees. It was reprinted in a Dave’s Garden newsletter. You may have seen it before. I hadn't though.
https://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/view/3125

Thanks for that link. I had heard of that apple forest but hadn’t read that article before.

 

[chummer]

Interesting read Native. A neighbor told me about a guy who came with a crew to his NY property and took a ton of scions from a huge apple tree he had. The guy claimed it was a tree from very, very long ago. Might have been along the same idea of saving heritage trees.

Saw another interesting article today about original apple trees. It was reprinted in a Dave’s Garden newsletter. You may have seen it before. I hadn't though.
https://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/view/3125

I am sure you don’t remember but at the end of my road there are two old apple trees. They are a huge delicious apple but only keep for a few days before they turn to mush. I ran into a really old, old timer there picking those apples a couple years ago. He said it was the best pie apple he had ever had. He used to know where there were other trees like these but had since died. This makes me wonder about the history of these trees and the others like them. How the heck did they all end up there? Will the history of those trees die with that old man? Too bad they drop early and bare semi annually or they might make it into my apple program. Makes you wonder if anyone will be talking about our trees 75 years from now.

 

[cavey]

He used to know where there were other trees like these but had since died. This makes me wonder about the history of these trees and the others like them. How the heck did they all end up there? Will the history of those trees die with that old man? Too bad they drop early and bare semi annually or they might make it into my apple program. Makes you wonder if anyone will be talking about our trees 75 years from now.

 

[cavey]

Last year I went around a looked for late hangers - wild pasture apple trees and crabs. There are literally thousands of wild apple/crab trees around - un named and just waiting to be discovered. Sad part is with the decline in farming and cattle these trees are being put to the saw and bulldozer for housing and row crops. So much potential going to waste. The next heirloom/unique variety... we have seen a mild resurgence of apple orchards in the area with the new interest in ciders which is encouraging but years ago every farmstead had an orchard of some size... cattle got the waste apples and with every cowpie came a new seedling out in the pastures.

 

[buckvelvet]

David is sending me scion of Ewalt a tree that was originally found in the early 1800's just a few miles from my home in Bedford Co Pa. Also Kittageskee a Cherokee apple and Shackleford a variety he spoke highly of. Exciting times for us heirloom apple addicts.

Of coarse you are Rick, awesome!

 

[PoorSand]

When I was young, an elderly woman told me the names of the varieties of the two apple trees in the backyard of their farmhouse. Those trees are both still alive. One is on the Central Wisconsin Apple Rediscovery Project list. The current owner won't let me collect a bud from it. Hopefully the tree is still alive after the current owner is no longer the owner, and hopefully I am still alive to ask the next owner for a bud. Since I'm not one to sneak over there and collect a scion when the owner is away, there is a note in my file where I keep my Will explaining to my descendants what do to in case I'm not still around once access to the tree becomes legally possible.

 

[weekender21]

When I was young, an elderly woman told me the names of the varieties of the two apple trees in the backyard of their farmhouse. Those trees are both still alive. One is on the Central Wisconsin Apple Rediscovery Project list. The current owner won't let me collect a bud from it. Hopefully the tree is still alive after the current owner is no longer the owner, and hopefully I am still alive to ask the next owner for a bud. Since I'm not one to sneak over there and collect a scion when the owner is away, there is a note in my file where I keep my Will explaining to my descendants what do to in case I'm not still around once access to the tree becomes legally possible.

That's really strange someone would not allow you to take a scion or two.

 

[sandbur]

Last year I went around a looked for late hangers - wild pasture apple trees and crabs. There are literally thousands of wild apple/crab trees around - un named and just waiting to be discovered. Sad part is with the decline in farming and cattle these trees are being put to the saw and bulldozer for housing and row crops. So much potential going to waste. The next heirloom/unique variety... we have seen a mild resurgence of apple orchards in the area with the new interest in ciders which is encouraging but years ago every farmstead had an orchard of some size... cattle got the waste apples and with every cowpie came a new seedling out in the pastures.

In our area, most of the wild apples are crab sized and they grow along the banks of the ditch/ river systems as the uplands are farmed. This should preserve some of the diversity.

Last spring, their was a blizzard of white and red blooming apples along the river system at the edge of our town.

I should try and get permission to enter that pasture and see what is there.

I have checked some trees that are along right of ways.


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[sandbur]

One of the above links refers to nearly all apples coming from Khaz. Are we missing things by not bringing in more genetics from M. Ioensis or the southern US equivalent?

I see very little CAR in the trees growing along our ditch banks and assume there must be some ioensis blood in them.


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[Bowsnbucks]

Chummer - In post #9 you asked "How the heck did they all get there?" I've also encountered a few wild(?) apple trees in forested, mountainous areas here in NC Pa. Nothing around for miles, no ag - nothing. Yet at the edge of a pine woods, or on an in oak woods - here's an apple tree. Seeds from a hunter or trapper from the previous century? Either from an apple they had eaten (chance germination) or because they planted some seeds there? Maybe animal / bird droppings from an apple source miles away?

Without some miracle, we won't ever know how some of those ancient trees got there. Many of us on here ponder what unknown varieties, and the seemingly good genetics/DR they have since they survived for so long, that we're losing as they die off.

 

[Native Hunter]

I also find it interesting how many wild apple trees there seem to be at some places and not in others. I've never found a wild apple or crabapple tree in my area, but if you plant one it seems to take right off and grow well. However, persimmon trees just pop up everywhere on my farm. It's like a persimmon mecca.

 

[buckvelvet]

When I was young, an elderly woman told me the names of the varieties of the two apple trees in the backyard of their farmhouse. Those trees are both still alive. One is on the Central Wisconsin Apple Rediscovery Project list. The current owner won't let me collect a bud from it. Hopefully the tree is still alive after the current owner is no longer the owner, and hopefully I am still alive to ask the next owner for a bud. Since I'm not one to sneak over there and collect a scion when the owner is away, there is a note in my file where I keep my Will explaining to my descendants what do to in case I'm not still around once access to the tree becomes legally possible.

Less honest apple lovers would occupy a though of a pair of snips and a headlamp........just thinking out loud.

 

[cavey]

I also find it interesting how many wild apple trees there seem to be at some places and not in others. I've never found a wild apple or crabapple tree in my area, but if you plant one it seems to take right off and grow well. However, persimmon trees just pop up everywhere on my farm. It's like a persimmon mecca.

We have or at least had a ton of commercial apple orchards around and a lot of home orchards and cattle... waste apples often got fed to cattle... other critters and birds dropping seed all over. I see concentrations of wild apples in our area and believe it is from that legacy of those old orchards. Smaller family farms with lots of fence lines for stray seedling to grow up in. Every farm had pasture lands - those marginal side hills and odd corners or lower ground - that is where I find a lot of the trees growing. But we are losing those odd little areas to development and larger cash cropping fields - fences lines are being pulled and plowed under and there are virtually zero small dairy's around anymore.