Newbie help

spaniel

5 year old buck +
I bought a hunting property this year which includes ~6acres of clearing for food plot. On the home property I just put in an acre of corn each year, so this whole food plot thing is new to me.

I would like to put in a mix of perennials and annuals. This property is 90min from home, I can get my tractor there once in the spring to work/plant. I have no spraying capability now, but could add a sprayer to my Ranger. Likely limited to one trip to spray if I had to. I have a 2-row corn planter which will do soy beans but no drill. Broadcast is my other option.

I'm thinking putting in clover on one lobe of the clearing in front of a stand but need to determine what to do with the rest. It starts up on a hill, which can get very dry, and goes down low where it can get wet on the bottom. I put corn in late this year (mid-June due to historically we spring) and NONE of it survived a late July drought.

I'm not looking for my homework to be done for me -- just some suggestions where to start research on some various crop options and where to get the seed. This is southern Indiana east of Terre Haute. Thanks in advance.
 
I'd consider doing the Dbltree rotation or a variation of it.

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or crimson and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot...we use 50# each rye, oats and peas along with radish and clover seed all planted in half of each feeding area

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 50-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Frostmaster Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre

Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28 but for best results soil test and add only what is necessary.

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year
 
Chicory is drought tolerant as well as milo (grain sorghum). Make sure to get some gypsum on that dry area as well as planting a fall cover of rye and Radish to help loosen the soil structure. Minimize or eliminate Tillage too


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
It's pretty clear I need to get a spreader for my Ranger so I can put down fertilizer and find a place to get non-ag quantities.

Thanks for all the detail, but to clarify, I have a very busy job with tons of travel and young kids with events sucking up most weekends. The tractor will only get down once in the spring, and I'm not interested in doing multiple plantings. The time just isn't in the cards with the property being 90min away. Annuals need to go in in one shot in the spring.
 
Thanks for all the detail, but to clarify, I have a very busy job with tons of travel and young kids with events sucking up most weekends. The tractor will only get down once in the spring, and I'm not interested in doing multiple plantings. The time just isn't in the cards with the property being 90min away. Annuals need to go in in one shot in the spring.

When you find something to plant and forget in the spring put it a bag with deer on it and make enough $ to retire and have lots of time.

Read through this, http://habitat-talk.com/index.php?threads/the-throw-n’-mow-method.5510/ some guys are planting some awesome mixes that might be a one and done for the summer. But I don’t know of anything that will last summer through fall.

If I were you with a schedule like that. Clover would be my go to. Even if it gets weedy and doesn’t get mowed there is clover in there.
 
First thing I would do is plant Keiffer pear trees - in early April - on one side of your plot; the trick is which side. When you plant them use a water pipe and landscape fabric covered with pea gravel and straw mulch to conserve moisture throughout the spring and summer. If your plot runs east & west, I'd plant on the north side (and half of the west side that adjoins the north side) and have the trees spaced 15' apart running down the contour of the hill for about 2/3 of the way …. to avoid the low area (collects too much water and could be a frost pocket). Plant Kindred Spirit (6' width) white oak trees (SWO component of this fast growing hybrid makes it extremely water tolerant) for the remainder of the down hill slope (extremely water tolerant). The pear trees will have a relatively narrow shape and not infringe on your food plot plantings very much. Within 8-10 years, they will begin pumping out considerable soft mast on an annual basis that will hang/drop well into hunting season. If the food plot runs N-S, simply reverse the planting so the west side gets pear trees for 2/3's of the way down (then col white oaks) and the west end (1/3 to 1/2) of the north side has pear trees. Whatever Ag plant you put in the remainder of your food plot will be augmented by substantial vertical gardening with soft mast you can partially control the release of.
Attached the last photo is a photo of a Kindred Spirit colWO tree that is less than 4.5 yrs old (since planted as an acorn). The other photos show flushes of leaves on a KS last year with the first photo showing the same tree last month. Notice, in the latest photo, it is skinny on the lower one-third since the cage restricted it's growth.
KS 7 2019.pngKS 7 2019.pngKS 8 2019.pngKS 9 2018.pngKS 10 2019.png
KS 3.png
 
Last edited:
If you have a hard time being there I would say the hell with it. Plots are overrated. Leave your property as a sanctuary. If you really think you need some food then rent it to a small farmer to plant some alfalfa and tell them no cutting after Sept 10.

In your spare time go plant some trees and work on other stuff or take the kids fishing. I’m loving not wasting time and money on plots. This year is the most bucks I have seen on my property since owning it. Got within 35 yards of a nice 8pt last time up. There is a great 10pt that will spend Oct and November there too. All the plots did for me was make a doe factory and get my freshly planted conifers browsed to nothing.
 
I bought a hunting property this year which includes ~6acres of clearing for food plot. On the home property I just put in an acre of corn each year, so this whole food plot thing is new to me.

I would like to put in a mix of perennials and annuals. This property is 90min from home, I can get my tractor there once in the spring to work/plant. I have no spraying capability now, but could add a sprayer to my Ranger. Likely limited to one trip to spray if I had to. I have a 2-row corn planter which will do soy beans but no drill. Broadcast is my other option.

I'm thinking putting in clover on one lobe of the clearing in front of a stand but need to determine what to do with the rest. It starts up on a hill, which can get very dry, and goes down low where it can get wet on the bottom. I put corn in late this year (mid-June due to historically we spring) and NONE of it survived a late July drought.

I'm not looking for my homework to be done for me -- just some suggestions where to start research on some various crop options and where to get the seed. This is southern Indiana east of Terre Haute. Thanks in advance.

Why do you want to plant a food plot? What to plant should be one of the last decisions you make, not the first....

What are you trying to accomplish? Do you have sufficient scale to accomplish it? What kind of soils do you have? What equipment do you already have? (you mentioned some of it). There are two general approaches that you should consider first, high input traditional tillage verses soil health.

Most folks are quick to get dirt under their fingernails. You can do a lot of harm to your soils with traditional tillage. Search this forum for "Ray the soil guy". I've posted links to some of his videos. It is worth listening to these arguments before you start. I know because I'm still trying to undo damage I created when I first started.

These are some of the rhetorical questions you should be asking yourself long before you get to "what should I plant?"

Thanks,

Jack
 
I agree with Oak,..

Specially if you can only get down there with limited time. Plant trees !

Years from now you may have more time,.. and the trees will be really doing well.

The sanctuary ideal is nice too!

Yoder,.. good questions for Spaniel !!
 
Nice Post 35!

You can admit your mistakes and that sort of candor really helps folks like me who are just starting out. (and many others who read this)

Thank you !
 
Spaniel,
I have a VERY similar situation to yours!
  • My property is 90 minutes away from my house. I have a cabin there but can't store stuff there (it can get broken in to every few years).
  • I have 2 kids in sports (wish I knew better than to sign them up for hockey - they will never want to inherit this property and I have spent a lot of time coaching and now watching my older son play college hockey)
  • I actually have no tractor and rely on my ATV and a harrow rake for anything that I've done.
  • I have built a very smaller compactor that probably doesn't weigh enough to meet everyone's normal standards.
  • I had my property logged 5 years ago and I had a 1 1/2 acre field added (it's the only field around for miles) that serves as my plot.
  • The field is on a hill, sounds similar and mine runs east to west.
  • The soil was pretty crappy - mostly clay and the second year I put down 1,500 lbs of lime to get the soil closer to where it needs to be.
  • NOTE: I have a lot of state game land nearby - bordering me on 2 sides but NO hunting pressure.
Some VERY good questions and points were above in other responses. It helps to use those questions and my answers as part of my response.
I'm still a student of all of this after 5 years but I do follow the no-till method as recommended above. I've got to build soil on top of all of that clay. This is loosely my experience. I hope to save you some time on the learning curve...

Why did I want a plot?
For me, I own 35 acres. It's in the south-western part of NY. There are a lot of hardwood forests and it's very hilly (not mountains like further east - i.e. Lake Placid) but a couple thousand feet in elevation change from top to bottom. Typically deer bed up on the top of the hills, feed on oak benches or ridges and come down to the bottoms where there are a few wild apple orchards and creeks at night. Honestly, I don't know why they come down at night - it's just what they do. Of course - MY PROPERTY IS IN THE BOTTOM. So I wanted deer on my property during daylight hours.

My original reason for having a plot was to hunt over. Plain and simple, I wanted one like you see on TV (right?). Honestly, I now know that's kind of dumb but it got me started on my journey.

What are my goals?
They have changed over these 5 years. Once I learned more, my interests varied and I started wanting to have food on my land after hunting season ended in order to help keep deer on my property. I'm not sure that having deer on my land year-round was a good idea based on only having 35 acres, I'm changing my tactics next year (you'll read that below). In the first couple of years, I started to improve my overall land. I've planted trees from the state forestry division a few different years (over 500 trees in total all of varying types from pine to hard and soft mast producers). These all come as bare root and I haven't caged them so I don't know if they survived at all.

So what have I done? (Planted)
Aside from the trees from the state forestry:
I did order 4 chestnut trees and planted those down the middle of my field.
I also planted two pear trees and 3 apple trees from the local big box store near the end of the season (big discounts) on the edges of the field.
As for food plot stuff, my experience has had different levels of success. Here's my story:

Year 1:
Was my best! (or so I thought)
I planted late summer after the field was put in by my logger with a dozer. The field was new to the woods, so the animals didn't know it was there. I probably planted brassica, rape and turnips in a couple of areas. Plus I did the whole field in clover. (via throw and and rake). I threw down 10-10-10 and lime and I had turnips the size of softballs! It was great and I was hooked! I never did a soil test and I nailed it! While I never hunted the field, I was hooked based on the success of the plantings.

MAJOR MISTAKE: When the field was put in the dozer left everything piled up in certain places along the edges. Deer don't like being in an alley. My field is 30 yards wide in the middle with two bigger sections at both ends. Like a kidney bean.

Year 2:
This was a low point for my plot! My land still had TONS of browse from the logging getting sunlight to the forest floor.
(Still panted via throw and rake)
I tried to plant stuff into the clay and basically had scorched earth. Mostly native stuff remained all year.
But I still had doe and fawns using the field eating that native stuff all spring/summer/fall.

Year 3:
I started to learn about field prep and soil building. I sprayed everything down with Gly 2 or 3 times in the spring before I finally planted buckwheat (again via throw and roll). It came in AWESOME! 3 - 4 feet tall and bees everywhere!
My chestnut trees were coming out of the tubes and it looked like a great year.
There were deer in the field all the time. Primarily doe and fawns. But they were using my property all spring/summer/fall. I was super happy with that! What Success!
Mid-July that year, I knocked the whole field down with my harrow rake and planted a brassica mix. (BIG MISTAKE! I should have planted in sections, leaving something for the deer to eat and as cover).
In August I put down some horse oats.
I had planted winter rye in September some time, with plans to kill that off the following year as part of the soil building.
By fall, all I had left was the oats and native grasses (or so I thought).
 
Last edited:
(I had to break up my post - you can only do 10,000 words per post - LOL!)

Year 4:
WOW!
That winter rye made my field look picture-esc in the spring!
I still have deer spring/summer/fall.
BUT - In the summer, I made the same mistake again and knocked the whole field down at once. Almost running over a fawn in the process and it was bedded in the tall rye. I planted fall mixes again; brassica, turnips, rape, etc. (via throw and roll).
In August, I threw down more horse oats but sadly I never could get my hands on Winter Wheat or Rye
About the only thing that lived I really ever saw growing was clover and oats but the deer where there so much that it looked like things were freshly mowed.

Year 5 (this year):
I started thinking about all of the work I had been doing and I started wondering if the stuff I was planting was able to survive the browsing pressure all spring/summer/fall. I put up a plot saver fence and screwed around with that all year, trying to see if the stuff inside would grow more than outside (I could have use an inclusion cage but I didn't - I tried to take a shortcut). The shape that I used with the plot saver fencing was irregular plus on the hillside so I couldn't keep the fence at the right height all the way around. It ended up being a fail as I would get pics of all sorts of game on both sides of the fence. This year, I primarily have 8 doe, occasionally I have 3 bucks (a couple nice ones) and a flock of turkey in there all spring/summer this year. And this got me to realize that I had built a doe factory! And I don't think a lot of my previous years plantings were as successful because of the nightly/daily browsing. I look back on the first year when the deer didn't know about the field and I had baseball sized turnips without having good soil and it kind of proves it - I'm just hard-headed.

This year, I planted tritical and barley in the spring.

When I planted my fall stuff in strips running parallel with the hillside (I learned). Brassica mix in one 10 yard strip followed by austrian peas in the other. I ended up going back over the whole field with 100 lbs of horse oats (when I say this I mean rolled oats/feed - it grows).
Last weekend I finished the entire field off with 50lbs of winter wheat and 50 lbs of winter rye (still for soil building).

The field looks better this year as the oats and clover are keeping up with the pressure better now that the clover is more mature. Plus when I planted I used a push mower and mowed down the barley/tritical in strips and planted the brassica mix in those. In the alternating strips, where I planted peas, I just threw them and ran over the standing barley/tritical with my ATV.

Next year:
I don't plan on planting anything in the spring!
I don't want the deer on my property all spring/summer! There's tons of food in the woods and if the does disperse and hang around elsewhere, my plantings for fall may be more successful. However, I will still have standing wheat/rye next spring and I expect they will still fawn on my land. BUT I won't plant anything else until mid-summer. My plan is to knock down the field at that time (the whole thing) and plant into it via throw and roll.

Hopefully between next year and the following year, the doe will disperse a little more when they drop their fawns. The plants in my field will be able to grow without nightly grazing and my fall plots will be better. Still hoping to have fruit and nuts from the trees I've planted, also as a fall draw. And if all of this works, I'll also have turnips and radishes that will pop out of the ground near the end of hunting season for the winter.

This all brings me back to two things about "why do I want a plot?"

1. Now, I'm addicted to the planting and land management! I'm less concerned about getting a deer but I do like seeing them. In my area, seeing them is a reward. Harvesting one with archery equipment is huge! Some of this probably comes with age (getting closer to 50).

2. The most basic thing is to hunt over the plot in the fall. While this sounds contradictory to my first reason, I think I would feel some success from my hard work if I harvested a deer on my own land. It's close to my cabin and I can sneak in and out of my field edges easily (plus I can leave a stand setup instead of carrying in my climber in and out each morning and evening). As I get older, ease of getting in and out without a lot of work is going to be nice. I can likely even get a couple of hours in on a Friday after work - before daylight savings time kicks in because I've got a stand setup too.

So to answer your question, what would I plant?

It's more about when I would plant. Skip the spring altogether.
Get a soil test to know what you're dealing with.
I'm a T&M guy, so I wouldn't till.
I use a hand spreader and a hand sprayer for my 1 1/2 acre field. It works.
Plant in the summer. I know you said you can't but if you're trying to achieve goals similar to mine it's going to likely pay off (your goals may be different).
Remember - fields don't have to be pretty. So if they are weedy - the deer may use that as cover or food too.

Most of all, remember there are only 52 Saturdays a year. Kids grow up fast. So I like your approach not to put too much into this. Enjoy the kids but understand to have a good planting you might have to miss one weekend to get the field done to accomplish your goals. If you're like me, you have to do other maintenance at your place, so on one of those early summer days you have to run there to cut the grass, do a little field pre-work (spray). The next time you're there (a couple of weeks later), spread seed, lime, fertilizer (whatever you need to) and then knock down what's left standing. The stuff you knock down (in my case what/rye) will act like straw and hold moisture which can help with the drought conditions. Plus is will degrade over time creating better soil. If you time that planting before a rain, you're in great shape! But if you're like me, you probably can't time the weather. So as long as it's not a drought or rain is in the forecast, go for it. When you come back later, you might be surprised.

Enjoy!
 
Last edited:
Limited time and 6 acres of plots don't add up. Either find more time for plotting or don't plot 6 acres
 
Where is the property and what does the rest of your land have on it? And, what about the surrounding properties; what do they look like?
 
I'd consider doing the Dbltree rotation or a variation of it.

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#


Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or crimson and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot...we use 50# each rye, oats and peas along with radish and clover seed all planted in half of each feeding area

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 50-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Frostmaster Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre


Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre


Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28 but for best results soil test and add only what is necessary.

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year

^^^^^^^^^^
never gets old

thanks

bill
 
Top